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Author Topic: Removing the lipstick from the pig  (Read 9438 times)

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Offline Ruffneck

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Removing the lipstick from the pig
« on: May 07, 2015, 11:05:06 PM »
I finally removed the skim-coat on the retaining wall of my old house.
I had the engineer out to look at the wall and column before I made the purchase, but if you really want to know the extent of the ugly, you need to remove the lipstick first:


After my findings I made the decision to take a big leap and bring in the team from Pace Engineering:
 

  

They have been out for one site visit so far. The biggest concern for them is the concrete column and header in the one garage:


  

The extent of the problem is pretty apparent after exposing it. The engineers didn't seem to be as concerned about the retaining wall as I was. They say if they could see some movement in it, then it would be concerning.


  

After their visit, they recommended a "suspender and belt" approach to the column issue. :D
I put a couple of strong-backs over it and tied it back to the wall with some ratchet straps.


 

I have a temporary shoring plan from the engineers, they are calling for a 6x12 header beam with two 6x6 posts connected by Simpson brackets. Seems a little overkill to me for supporting an 8 inch slab, but if you ask an engineer a question, they're going to give you an engineers' answer.

The reason there has been so much deterioration at these locations is the water drainage. It has been going on since the house was built. They will be designing a drainage plan too.

Old houses sure are full of surprises.  ;D

Offline Holmes

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #1 on: May 08, 2015, 12:25:03 AM »
 And to think you have only just begun.. :)
Think like a farmer.

Offline thecfarm

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2015, 05:56:42 AM »
That is quite the wall. Good luck to ya.  :)
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Offline Ianab

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2015, 06:21:19 AM »
PNW is an earthquake zone isn't it?

Hence things get over-engineered. Dodgy concrete walls + shaking = things (and people) getting squashed.
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Offline zopi

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2015, 06:55:47 AM »
looks like a good place for some gravel pit/French drains...
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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2015, 08:03:13 AM »
Looks like you were at a point that you had to either fix it or loose it.  The video makes me tired.   :D
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Online WV Sawmiller

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2015, 09:24:19 AM »
I thought here in WV was the only place people built on hillsides like that.

Good luck on your project.
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Offline Howdy

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2015, 10:10:34 AM »
Great video, gives the rest of the world a view of the quality of work and the speed that folks here in Oregon work every day!

Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2015, 05:08:52 PM »
An update on the wall project. They drew up the temporary shoring plan in pretty short order. The plan calls for a 6x12 header with two 6x6 posts attached with the right Simpson brackets. If I were to build shoring at work, a 6x6 header would be sufficient  :-\ I get it though, it is their name on it  :)

Went to pick up the material I had on special order at the local Home Depot yesterday morning. They had had everything but the Simpson brackets ::) Somehow they're missing, they'll order them again, could take up to seven days. So much for being able to con my brother into helping out real quick, at least I didn't have to transport the timbers in my Honda ;D

They have a number 2 stamped on them, but I think to myself, they must be joking. Not a #2 or better in my book. Pith running the length on a corner, big old knot on another. Guess I'll change my grading rules from here on out... ;D 

Offline beenthere

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2015, 08:14:09 PM »
Your 6x6 with no big knots and their spec for a 6x12 #2 with big knot and a pith may equal out. :)
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Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2015, 09:24:52 PM »
I should have refused the whole deal. They are all stamped #2... It will be field verified. I'll take some pics and post them. I'd hate to go to the work and have the engineers reuse my work.... I should make my own timbers...
 :laugh:

Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #11 on: May 19, 2015, 03:30:13 PM »
Here are some pictures of the timbers and temporary shoring plan:

 

This is the 6x12 beam:

 
 

  

 

  

 

Here are some pics of the 6x6 posts:

 

  

  

 

If that's what goes for number 2, I have been over-thinking the milling of my Ponderosa Pine.
I was sure hoping to be progressing a bit faster on this project. Home Depot couldn't find the Simpson brackets and I'm still waiting for their reorder to come in. The engineers are still working on their plans. They should have something for me soon they said... :)
 

Offline beenthere

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #12 on: May 19, 2015, 03:47:59 PM »
No. 2 is not an "appearance" grade, but is a structural grade, and am sure you can count on it to do the job you have. Put the most knots on the upper side of the beam. The strength of this No. 2 is already taken into consideration and the consultant doing the calculations figures that No. 2 will work.
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Offline Brucer

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #13 on: May 19, 2015, 11:57:02 PM »
Grading rules for a 12" wide, No. 2 Structural Beams allow "well spaced" knots up to 6-7/8" diameter (rule 130 c). "Well spaced" means that in any 6" length, the sum of all the knot diameters cannot exceed twice the maximum diameter; also, there cannot be more than one knot of maximum diameter in any 6" length (rule 718 v).

Grading rules for a 6 x 6 No. 2 Structural Posts allow "well spaced" knots up to 3" in diameter (rule 131 c).

There are specific rules about how you measure the knots -- for beams you draw imaginary lines on either side of the knot that are parallel to the edges, then measure the distance between the lines. Basically you're measuring the width of the fibres that are interrupted by the knot.

The rules allow quite a bit of wane (1/3 the width of any face for a #2). The other big issues with structural members are shake (which you don't have) and slope of grain (which I can't tell without seeing the timber in person).

The rules say nothing about the pith, which has always mystified me. Not that I'm complaining -- I either box the heart or saw it out completely, and that impresses my customers.

If the pictures you posted show the biggest knots, then it looks like it all meets the grade.
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Offline greenforestyy

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2015, 04:26:37 PM »
wait i dont see a vid anywere maybe im to slow ahh or i skipped it.. I see pictures though !

Offline Ruffneck

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2015, 11:29:21 PM »
wait i dont see a vid anywere maybe im to slow ahh or i skipped it.. I see pictures though !
:
https://youtu.be/Lc_ilccX5I4?list=PL4041w-KMR6I1L47So6vi-q3bHiMAtYnD

It's a long story with many twists and turns. This is from 9/28/2015. I will give a full report at the completion of this phase :)
 

 

Offline beenthere

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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2015, 11:48:04 PM »
Ruffneck
You sure can stick to a tough project. Kudo's to you for the progress you have made so far.
Substantial improvement under difficult circumstances. smiley_thumbsup
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Re: Removing the lipstick from the pig
« Reply #17 on: September 29, 2015, 10:25:30 AM »
Congrats on your well earned progress.  I still say that you make me tired.   smiley_sweat_drop  smiley_whip
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Offline Ruffneck

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Pound #
« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2015, 11:40:10 PM »
Pound # Next Phase:



 :)

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Re: Pound #
« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2015, 08:09:38 AM »
Looking good.  I only know that you have long range plans and that you know what you are doing.   8)
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