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Need help with chainsaw choice for Alaskan mill

Started by bornwithnoname, January 20, 2015, 07:44:02 PM

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bornwithnoname

Okay... This is my first post here so hopefully im doing this right.

I currently have a Alaskan sawmill and need to get a new power head for it, it is a granberg 36''. the saw i have powering it is way under powered and it is really killing the saw! the oilier just broke today. i have always planed on getting a new saw if i liked milling and eventually i want to buy turboe i  saw weekend warrior which is a sing mill powered by a chainsaw. Anyways i am debating weather to get a husky 395xp or a 3120xp im leaning towards the 3120xp especially because iwant to get the swing mill someday. But here is the question is it worth the extra $$$ and is 1559 a good price or is there some one who sells them online for less? thanks.

celliott

Welcome to the forum!

My two cents fwiw,
I have a 36" Alaskan as well. Mine is powered by a 395xp. It does just fine. I don't know if you would gain much cutting speed with the 3120 over the 395 if only milling up to 36". I've never ran a 3120 but have picked one up and I feel like the 395xp would be more "usable" than the. 3120, if you know what I mean.
Pro to the 3120 is the auxiliary oiler. Although the 395 does oil pretty well. Sorry, can't help with your price question. Never bought a brand new saw before!
Chris Elliott

Clark 666C cable skidder
Husqvarna and Jonsered pro saws
265rx clearing saw
Professional maple tubing installer and maple sugaring worker, part time logger

Geoff Miller

Welcome to the Forum

I have the 36" Alaskan mill and power it with a Stihl 084 (122cc). I have cut white pine up to 30" and hard maple up to 24". The saw cuts well but it is a workout by the time you finish a log. I use it  mainly to cut slabs, 2-3" thick (live edge). You will make a lot of chips if you are just cutting 1" boards. Consider adding an auxiliary oiler as this type of milling is hard on the bar.  I bought one from Bailey's that attaches to the frame of the mill and feeds oil to the bottom side of the bar, just behind the nose. I ended up buying a bandsaw mill last year so the Alaskan mill is now used only for those logs I can't get to the sawmill.

celliott

Chainsaw milling is hard work. I don't think it gets any easier on you, the user, using a 100+cc saw, it will just be a bit easier on the powerhead.
Chris Elliott

Clark 666C cable skidder
Husqvarna and Jonsered pro saws
265rx clearing saw
Professional maple tubing installer and maple sugaring worker, part time logger

4x4American

Chainsaw milling is tough on the saw, and the user.  I would get a Stihl, because the Husky won't last near as long.  :)  But if you do get a Husky, make sure after the first few tanks you go around and retorque the bolts, they're known to rattle themselves apart. 
Boy, back in my day..

Sawmill_Nick

I bought a 54" Alaskan mill and 3120 last year for making large live edge that won't fit on the woodmizer.  Haven't used it a lot but seems like a great saw. It is very heavy compared to the 365 and 372xp that I also own. I have never used a 395 to compare. I haven't milled a lot with it yet but I know it's easy to bog the saw down so seems the more power the better. The price you listed is about what I paid online last march.

Jemclimber

If milling is going to be the majority of its use, the 3120 is better suited for the application.  The more power the better and you won't regret it. I used to mill with a 395 and it will do the job, but not as fast as the 3120. The 3120 runs slower with more torque, which is what you want for milling.  Chainsaw milling is slow and anything to speed it up is advantageous.
lt15

Kindlinmaker

I purchased a 3120 at the Boone show in August for generally the same purposes you describe.  Husky was offering a manufacturer discount and the price mentioned is fairly close to the price they offered.

I agree that it is a lot of saw to handle but I am very pleased with performance to date although we only use it for the occasional big logs.  I installed a 42" bar and have buried it more than once in yard trees (ash, oak, walnut).  It just keeps on going. I've also ripped some 30"+ slabs to fit logs on the sawmill and it handles this chore without breathing hard (and without ripping chain).  Very pleased with the purchase so far.  We plan to put a modified 60" Alaska together with it this Spring to handle more yard trees as we love the figured wood many of these contain.

The saw is equipped with a .404 sprocket and the selling dealer had to order and re-sprocket an Oregon bar to work.  I was surprised with the limited supply of large bars but they figured it out.  It also took a bit of practice to learn how to flex the bar to pop the chain on but just a learning curve.  Running the .404 has given me a whole new level of respect for saw dangers and for the guys out West that run these every day.  It's heavy and unforgiving so I wouldn't want to run it all day long but it is great tool for those big jobs.
If you think the boards are twisted, wait until you meet the sawyer!

bornwithnoname

First i want tho thank everyone for theit help and opinions and welcoming to the fourm.
Quote from: Jemclimber on January 21, 2015, 07:50:22 AM
If milling is going to be the majority of its use, the 3120 is better suited for the application.  The more power the better and you won't regret it. I used to mill with a 395 and it will do the job, but not as fast as the 3120. The 3120 runs slower with more torque, which is what you want for milling.  Chainsaw milling is slow and anything to speed it up is advantageous.

Thats what i was thinking thanks for reassuring me.

Quote from: 4x4American on January 21, 2015, 07:23:15 AM
Chainsaw milling is tough on the saw, and the user.  I would get a Stihl, because the Husky won't last near as long.  :)  But if you do get a Husky, make sure after the first few tanks you go around and retorque the bolts, they're known to rattle themselves apart. 

I use to like stihl saws better but the price of the husky is significantly less if money wasn't a issue i would probably buy a stihl

Quote from: celliott on January 21, 2015, 06:05:47 AM
Chainsaw milling is hard work. I don't think it gets any easier on you, the user, using a 100+cc saw, it will just be a bit easier on the powerhead.

I know its hard work i have milled quite a bit already and have some large oaks to mill and a decent size black locus and want to get a bigger saw first.

Quote from: Geoff Miller on January 20, 2015, 09:56:52 PM
Welcome to the Forum

I have the 36" Alaskan mill and power it with a Stihl 084 (122cc). I have cut white pine up to 30" and hard maple up to 24". The saw cuts well but it is a workout by the time you finish a log. I use it  mainly to cut slabs, 2-3" thick (live edge). You will make a lot of chips if you are just cutting 1" boards. Consider adding an auxiliary oiler as this type of milling is hard on the bar.  I bought one from Bailey's that attaches to the frame of the mill and feeds oil to the bottom side of the bar, just behind the nose. I ended up buying a bandsaw mill last year so the Alaskan mill is now used only for those logs I can't get to the sawmill.

I am definitely buying the aux oilier but currently bailey's is out of stock and want to upgrade to a band saw or swing mill but since im only 18 im a little low on funds if i buy the saw it will cost more than my truck and its insurance!

Quote from: celliott on January 20, 2015, 08:56:04 PM
Welcome to the forum!

My two cents fwiw,
I have a 36" Alaskan as well. Mine is powered by a 395xp. It does just fine. I don't know if you would gain much cutting speed with the 3120 over the 395 if only milling up to 36". I've never ran a 3120 but have picked one up and I feel like the 395xp would be more "usable" than the. 3120, if you know what I mean.
Pro to the 3120 is the auxiliary oiler. Although the 395 does oil pretty well. Sorry, can't help with your price question. Never bought a brand new saw before!

I wish i could buy used but there arnt many options local not to manny big trees

bornwithnoname

Quote from: Kindlinmaker on January 21, 2015, 12:25:28 PM
I purchased a 3120 at the Boone show in August for generally the same purposes you describe.  Husky was offering a manufacturer discount and the price mentioned is fairly close to the price they offered.

I agree that it is a lot of saw to handle but I am very pleased with performance to date although we only use it for the occasional big logs.  I installed a 42" bar and have buried it more than once in yard trees (ash, oak, walnut).  It just keeps on going. I've also ripped some 30"+ slabs to fit logs on the sawmill and it handles this chore without breathing hard (and without ripping chain).  Very pleased with the purchase so far.  We plan to put a modified 60" Alaska together with it this Spring to handle more yard trees as we love the figured wood many of these contain.

The saw is equipped with a .404 sprocket and the selling dealer had to order and re-sprocket an Oregon bar to work.  I was surprised with the limited supply of large bars but they figured it out.  It also took a bit of practice to learn how to flex the bar to pop the chain on but just a learning curve.  Running the .404 has given me a whole new level of respect for saw dangers and for the guys out West that run these every day.  It's heavy and unforgiving so I wouldn't want to run it all day long but it is great tool for those big jobs.

Those guys who run those big saws all day have some serious skills i just only got my first saw last year. i have been watching my dad and grandpa fell threes since i was a kid. My grandpa use to log in maine and he allays amazes me it truly is a art and he has tough me alot. What gauge and pitch chain do you use for your Alaskan mill? thanks

4x4American

Boy, back in my day..

bornwithnoname

Quote from: 4x4American on January 21, 2015, 07:18:41 PM
Pay me now or pay me later. 
i just goggled that and saw the fram commercial.
do you really think it would be better to buy a stihl. Thats what my grandpa runs and there is a saw shop one town away and i just got a large check so i could buy the stihl but i need something that would sway me over i have read many good things about the husky.. do you have anything that would support the stihl being way better and worth the extra $300

bornwithnoname

here are some pictures of the junk pine i milled so i can make a shed someday because i know everyone on every forum i have ever been on loves pictures


  

4x4American

I own 2 huskys (that I bought brand new) and at least 8 stihls.  I've found the stihls to be more reliable and better built.  husky guys say what they want, but I prefer stihl.  The 395 from what I've heard/read is a fine saw.  And to be honest the next saw I buy is proberly going to be a 395.  I have experience that with my stihls, more often than not, it takes but one pull to get them started.  With my huskys, they take much more pulling.  and throughout the day, if you put a husky down for a few minutes, you'd better set the high idle to get it to start again.  The huskys seem to have a lot of little silly breakdowns, whereas the stihls just like to work.  There's a reason you see so many old stihls around and not as many old huskys.  I've read about the 3120 being a great saw but not very long lasting.  Just my opinion.  Do what you want.   
Boy, back in my day..

bornwithnoname

Quote from: 4x4American on January 21, 2015, 08:09:44 PM
I own 2 huskys (that I bought brand new) and at least 8 stihls.  I've found the stihls to be more reliable and better built.  husky guys say what they want, but I prefer stihl.  The 395 from what I've heard/read is a fine saw.  And to be honest the next saw I buy is proberly going to be a 395.  I have experience that with my stihls, more often than not, it takes but one pull to get them started.  With my huskys, they take much more pulling.  and throughout the day, if you put a husky down for a few minutes, you'd better set the high idle to get it to start again.  The huskys seem to have a lot of little silly breakdowns, whereas the stihls just like to work.  There's a reason you see so many old stihls around and not as many old huskys.  I've read about the 3120 being a great saw but not very long lasting.  Just my opinion.  Do what you want.   

ok now im going to have to think more and do some more research before i decide on the ms 880 or 3120xp thanks for you opinion... i will have to go talk to my local dealer this weekend.

4x4American

No problem.  A good servicing dealer is a key factor.
Boy, back in my day..

mad murdock

Welcome to the forestry forum bornwithnoname. I have done a fair amount of milling with a CSM, though not a lot of slabbing. I have my mill setup optimized for dimensional cutting, a couple things I would consider 1- budget~don't overlook a used saw, there are a lot of older saws out there that can be had for a lot less money that suit themselves well for milling. I have an 075 Stihl and several McCullochs, most of them were freebies a couple I paid 10 bucks a piece for. Most of them needed a good going over and cleaning, maybe a new spark plug, starter cord, carb kit, some fuel line and I and in a case or 2 an ignition switch. You can save a lot of money if you have the skills of are willing to learn the basics of www maintenance. It will pay you back for years to come, if you can fix your own stuff, or at least the easy stuff. 2nd-consider the biggest log you will be addressing (on average) if you will be sticking will the 36" mill consider a saw in the 90cc class and outfitting it with a bar and chain combo to give you a narrow kerf- the 63PMX Stihl chain (picco) leaves a 1/4" kerf, hence less waste, and less power required in the cut over 3/8" pitch or larger .404" chain. If you are going over the 90cc threshold, larger chain is needed to handle the hp input going into the chain for safety reasons.  Ask around on the used saw thing, and check craigslist. You can sure save a lot of $$. I sure have. Good luck with your milling and nice whack of slabs you got going for your future projects.
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

bornwithnoname

Quote from: mad murdock on January 22, 2015, 01:46:58 AM
Welcome to the forestry forum bornwithnoname. I have done a fair amount of milling with a CSM, though not a lot of slabbing. I have my mill setup optimized for dimensional cutting, a couple things I would consider 1- budget~don't overlook a used saw, there are a lot of older saws out there that can be had for a lot less money that suit themselves well for milling. I have an 075 Stihl and several McCullochs, most of them were freebies a couple I paid 10 bucks a piece for. Most of them needed a good going over and cleaning, maybe a new spark plug, starter cord, carb kit, some fuel line and I and in a case or 2 an ignition switch. You can save a lot of money if you have the skills of are willing to learn the basics of www maintenance. It will pay you back for years to come, if you can fix your own stuff, or at least the easy stuff. 2nd-consider the biggest log you will be addressing (on average) if you will be sticking will the 36" mill consider a saw in the 90cc class and outfitting it with a bar and chain combo to give you a narrow kerf- the 63PMX Stihl chain (picco) leaves a 1/4" kerf, hence less waste, and less power required in the cut over 3/8" pitch or larger .404" chain. If you are going over the 90cc threshold, larger chain is needed to handle the hp input going into the chain for safety reasons.  Ask around on the used saw thing, and check craigslist. You can sure save a lot of $$. I sure have. Good luck with your milling and nice whack of slabs you got going for your future projects.

thanks for the input you are definitely right about being able to do maintenance saves some serious money and will be likely doing all the easy stuff and have done most of the things you have said on other equip and on chainsaws.  i see you live in NW Oregon so you have lots of big trees so there are lots of big saws to cut those trees where i live it has basically  been logged out along time ago and all the big trees are on the main streets and yard trees but i still am getting a pretty good stack of trees over 3ft wide to cut up... I do want to start milling more dimensional lumber with the mill and just got the chainsaw lumber making book by will malloff do you have any tips to making cutting boards more efficient?

mad murdock

The biggest thing is get a method that works for you and study each step to see if you can reduce the number of steps required to complete the task.  I have a good sharp axe handy when I am milling, that way if there are irregularities in a log that make initial setup a problem, I can whack and shape with the axe and maybe another small saw so my opening guide can lay on the log with minimal issues.  I use a couple 1x3's on the ends of the log to hold my rails on( I use a 16' section of an aluminum extension ladder), get the first slab off, then I have another saw setup with a home made mini mill attachment, that I snap chalk lines and edge with, then I decide from the 3 sided cant, what I am going to make out of the log, set the mill of for that, and start slicing away.  If it is 2x4's, and the cant will allow, I would take 8 in off, then reset the mill for the 2" dimension, and begin to slice of 2x8's, then when that is done, take the whole stack and resaw them into 2x4's.  I think that there are similar methods in Mallof's book.  I have a couple quick clamps that I use to hold a stack of boards together, and I go a bit on the heavy side on slabs, saves time, and if I want to recover a board off a slab, I can always set the mill to 1" and mill the slab using the flat side as a guide.  With the CSM, efficiency comes in making the least number of cuts to get to a useable cant, having a second saw set up for edging also make things go a lot faster.  With and Alaskan, there is a lot of time tinkering with resetting the depth of cut and getting ready for the next cut, having the second saw set up to do edging just makes it go a lot faster.  I guess for me it has worked well having a lot of used saws, I don't have a lot of $$ stuck in any one saw.  Now that I have my Bumblebee CSM, things go even quicker.  follow the tips in Mallof's book, get the logs off the ground a bit, so you can be at a more comfortable working height, and use gravity to your advantage, it is a lot easier to mill going downhill, than flat or slightly up.  Try and plan your board making so you aren't having to reset the mill for each cut,  the more cut you can successively make without having to adjust the mill, the faster it will go for you. The more you do it, the better you will get at it, and the quicker it will go. Another thing, get a good filing guide, like the Granberg, or Oregon, one that allows you to adjust all your angles, and file after each tank of gas, or 2, even if it is only a stroke or 2 of the file on each tooth, the time saved in milling and increased efficiency of the chain to cut will more than make up for the time it takes to touch up a chain. Also, the Picco, or Low Profile chain is a big plus, IMO.  I started with 3/8" pitch chain, and after about 6 mbf of milling, switched, and I will never go back.  too much of an improvement.  The only way I would use bigger chain is for milling with a bar over 42" in length, or using a saw larger than 90cc.  The smaller chain cannot handle the power required for those tasks, for that you have to step up to 3/8" or .404".  Looks like you are off to a running start!
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

bornwithnoname

Quote from: mad murdock on January 22, 2015, 06:25:09 PM
The biggest thing is get a method that works for you and study each step to see if you can reduce the number of steps required to complete the task.  I have a good sharp axe handy when I am milling, that way if there are irregularities in a log that make initial setup a problem, I can whack and shape with the axe and maybe another small saw so my opening guide can lay on the log with minimal issues.  I use a couple 1x3's on the ends of the log to hold my rails on( I use a 16' section of an aluminum extension ladder), get the first slab off, then I have another saw setup with a home made mini mill attachment, that I snap chalk lines and edge with, then I decide from the 3 sided cant, what I am going to make out of the log, set the mill of for that, and start slicing away.  If it is 2x4's, and the cant will allow, I would take 8 in off, then reset the mill for the 2" dimension, and begin to slice of 2x8's, then when that is done, take the whole stack and resaw them into 2x4's.  I think that there are similar methods in Mallof's book.  I have a couple quick clamps that I use to hold a stack of boards together, and I go a bit on the heavy side on slabs, saves time, and if I want to recover a board off a slab, I can always set the mill to 1" and mill the slab using the flat side as a guide.  With the CSM, efficiency comes in making the least number of cuts to get to a useable cant, having a second saw set up for edging also make things go a lot faster.  With and Alaskan, there is a lot of time tinkering with resetting the depth of cut and getting ready for the next cut, having the second saw set up to do edging just makes it go a lot faster.  I guess for me it has worked well having a lot of used saws, I don't have a lot of $$ stuck in any one saw.  Now that I have my Bumblebee CSM, things go even quicker.  follow the tips in Mallof's book, get the logs off the ground a bit, so you can be at a more comfortable working height, and use gravity to your advantage, it is a lot easier to mill going downhill, than flat or slightly up.  Try and plan your board making so you aren't having to reset the mill for each cut,  the more cut you can successively make without having to adjust the mill, the faster it will go for you. The more you do it, the better you will get at it, and the quicker it will go. Another thing, get a good filing guide, like the Granberg, or Oregon, one that allows you to adjust all your angles, and file after each tank of gas, or 2, even if it is only a stroke or 2 of the file on each tooth, the time saved in milling and increased efficiency of the chain to cut will more than make up for the time it takes to touch up a chain. Also, the Picco, or Low Profile chain is a big plus, IMO.  I started with 3/8" pitch chain, and after about 6 mbf of milling, switched, and I will never go back.  too much of an improvement.  The only way I would use bigger chain is for milling with a bar over 42" in length, or using a saw larger than 90cc.  The smaller chain cannot handle the power required for those tasks, for that you have to step up to 3/8" or .404".  Looks like you are off to a running start!

thanks for all the advice i do have a granberg sharpening jig and love that thing it makes sharpening much more accurate. the reason i wanted to get a big saw is because I wanted to be able to use it to power a swing mill some day its called the turbo saw weekend warrior. The picto chain does sound like a good option because it will take less hp to push it through the wood my question is do you think it would be faster than 3/8 on a 880. what i really think i might to is get the 880 and get a new sprocket and bar for the saw i have currently and use the 880 to cut it into a usable cant and then cut dimensional lumber with the saw with the narrow curf chain. i do all ready have a mill that is used for edging but im not to happy with it and want to replace it. i do want to thank you for you well thought out words of advice

Magicman

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, bornwithnoname.   8)
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

bornwithnoname

Quote from: Magicman on January 22, 2015, 07:16:13 PM
Welcome to the Forestry Forum, bornwithnoname.   8)
thanks magic man I have found lots of good info from verrry knowledgeable and friendly people here. Now am just finally posting questions instead of lurking and hope some day to be sharing the things i learn with other people whom value my humble opinion.

Nomad

     I've got both Stihl and Husky saws, and have no problem with Husky.  I've got a 3120xp I bought some years ago specifically to use with a big Granberg Alaska mill.  That powerhead didn't last 4 hours milling before I needed a new rebuild kit for it!!!  It's a big saw with a lot of power, but I'd never put it on a mill again.
Buying a hammer doesn't make you a carpenter
WoodMizer LT50HDD51-WR
Lucas DSM23-19

bornwithnoname

Quote from: nomad on January 22, 2015, 08:42:50 PM
     I've got both Stihl and Husky saws, and have no problem with Husky.  I've got a 3120xp I bought some years ago specifically to use with a big Granberg Alaska mill.  That powerhead didn't last 4 hours milling before I needed a new rebuild kit for it!!!  It's a big saw with a lot of power, but I'd never put it on a mill again.

i have pretty much decided to go with the stihl 880 and am going to try to order one this weekend i herd quite a few people say the stihl will be a better saw and i have seen a decent amount of complaints about the husky and very few on the stihl

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