detroit or cummins

[timberjack240]

 i am sittin here in school  :' (bored out of my mind : with nothin to do so i decided to make this topic:

i run a skidder with a detroit and i love to listen to it in the mornin. its loud and roars through the woods and you know when and were its comin through. 

i was wonderin if you guyz prefer a detroit or a cummins
i think cummins are ok but they aint loud enough for me ;D

[leweee]

timberjack_240.....you know what they say"If it's too loud, your too old" :D :D :D

[Ed_K]

 Your right about the to old part  ;). I run a 453  :( in a taylor cable skidder. The next one will be a cat or clark.

[Sawyerfortyish]

I love Detroits But..... My next Timberjack will not have one. I have a 230tj with a 353 and here in New Jersey there are tooo many people that have nothing better to do than complain about one thing or another. So your better off being quiet and getting the job done.

[J_T]

When you get my age and can't here yourself  ??? think you will wish it had been quiter ;D

[Ron Scott]

Yes, we need to keep the equipment as quite as possible while working timber harvests. Noise polllution is an environmental issue and concern on most all areas we work here. 

[OLD_ JD]

second time this year a "buste" ma rad in my john deer >:(...wish i have Deutz engine in to it ;)

[sawguy21]

What?? What?? Sorry cant hear you.  Jimmy who??

[J_T]

Yep that is it Sawguy21 :'( :'(

[timberjack240]

 i love listenin to people complian to the noise. if i had it my way the old jack with the 453 in it wood be runnin with one straight pipe without a muffler  8)without a pipe is to bad  ;D i found that out this summer
one pipe wood turn sum heads  :D
and to leweee ill agree with ya there if its to loud yur to old  ;D i like that phrase. thats what im goin to tell my pap the next time he says its to loud  ;D
timberjack 240

[racer9]

I have been hearing a detroit running somewhere around me for the past couple if days, so I got interested in where it was at. I knew it was a skidder by the way it sounded. I finally found it. An Amish crew is cutting a good sized piece using a Timberjack. I ckecked the mileage from my place, believe it or not, it is a little under 4 miles away. They are up on a hill top, and I also live on a hill top, so the sound carries pretty well. Just makes me smile. Nothing like the sound of a Detroit in the morning, noon, or afternoon!

[logman]

When I was in the USCG on small boats we had 6V53's in our 44' MLB.
They were loud, leaked oil all over and very touchy as far as setting their
racks.  Ever have a Detroit run away on you?  One New Years morning I
got woken by my boss to go and light off the boat because he had adjusted
the rack.  I started the starboard engine and man it just started screaming.
I don't know what the RPMs got up to but it just kept going up.  I pulled the
fuel stops but it still kept going on the fuel in the lines.  I ended up having
to trip the blower stop to shut it down.  I was always shaky when I lit off
that engine from then on.  I prefer Cummins ever since!

[timberjack240]

racer
i liek the way you think
theres nothin like a detriot no matter what time of day  ;D my personal favorite time is about 700 in the mornin we all is still  :D

[Rookie tractor guy]

Hey all i am new to the board and i have been reading the various topics, I must say i am impressed with
the wealth of knowlege on this board. that being said i own 10 acres of land on the kingston pennisula New Brunswick and I plan to to clear it myself . I figured out a 45 HP 4X4 tractor with loader will do the trick however i am not sure of what brand as of yet . I have ten years to figure it out anyway. More to the point of the story I am a diesel mechanic by trade and i have seen detroits runaway and i have seen it happen to a mechanical PT cummins. but that was due to improper positoning of the peadla linkage to the governer shaft. Bosh systems will do it if they freeze up but i have only seen that once. As far as cummins cat or detroit they all have there good and bad points but give me an old 3406 B cat anyday

Cheers
Ken Hatfield

[Mr Mom]

     Sorry CATS here. The only reason for that is my neighbor
will not work on any thing but cats.
     Plus You can almost get any parts for them.

[Luckyfarmer]

I have a detroit pumping water in dry times..early in morning you can hear it in town 6 miles away..guess I'm getting too old, I now think its hard on my ears

[thurlow]

When I was in the USCG on small boats we had 6V53's in our 44' MLB.
They were loud, leaked oil all over and very touchy as far as setting their
racks. Ever have a Detroit run away on you? One New Years morning I
got woken by my boss to go and light off the boat because he had adjusted
the rack. I started the starboard engine and man it just started screaming.
I don't know what the RPMs got up to but it just kept going up. I pulled the
fuel stops but it still kept going on the fuel in the lines. I ended up having
to trip the blower stop to shut it down. I was always shaky when I lit off
that engine from then on. I prefer Cummins ever since!

Have always heard that Detroits were externally lubricated

[Rookie tractor guy]

Detriots have their place when i was a kid i could here my father coming up to 7 miles away.

[tmullen]

 The old fire engine at our station before it was retired had a detroit in it. Never had the motor run away on us. But when we ran out for a fire we did not need to run the siren, everybody within a mile radius could here us coming.  ;D ;D

Man I luved that old beast!!

[barbender]

Detroits in a skidder sound cool when you're the one running the machine, but they really annoy me if I have to listen to one outside of the machine.  I've heard guys running them on timber sales miles away, when I'm out working around the yard or whatever, that sound just gets on my nerves.  I used to run an asphalt roller that had a 4-53 in it.  With rollers, you run the engine wide open, so those things really kill your ears.  Thats with earplugs.  So, give me a cummins.

[Ron Scott]

I agree on the noise pollution of a Detroit. I prefer the quiet logging jobs and so do the neighbors. ;)

[Ironwood]

I understand there may be no comparison, but I just bought an old F-550 with the 7.3. I like the wine of the turbo (occasionally) but WOW when I delivered my old F-350 460cid to the new owner that baby was quiet (too busy sucking gas to make any ruckus). I miss that quiet, almost like magic under the hood. Now I hear everything going on under  the hood and have to SPEAK LOUD into my cell phone. Reid

[Sawyerfortyish]

I'll add a little more since this thread began. I run my mill with a 671 detroit my edger with a 353 my genset with a 371 and had a hog with a 871 and a skidder with a 353. I will say as far as reliable easy to work on detroits are good workhorses. Now with the rising cost of fuel there very easy on fuel. my Timberjack with a 353 will run all day on about 5 gal of fuel . My 671 that powers my mill not only runs a 56" saw but runs two oil pumps and a big sawdust blower. That burns about 275 gal a month. I now have a horrizontal mulch grinder with a percat moter that is smaller than my 671 but uses about 1/3 more fuel than the detroit. I like detroits but I would love em if they were just a bit easier on the ears. I ran my old mill 16yrs with a 471. I didn't use hearing protection now as I get older I know that was a big mistake i'm having problems hearing. I use good earmuffs today but it's a little late.

[Ed_K]

 I have to agree that working on them is easy. I replace the clutch and p.p. in under 5hrs today in 22deg weather. Its just as loud now as before  ;D.

[weimedog]

The silver series Detriots actually didn't leak much and went like hell.
I had a few in trucks. The first truck had an old 6V53T with a 5X4 splitter
for a transmission arraaingement (A five speed at the motor and a 4 speed
transmission about midway between the front transmission and the rear axles.
It made me deaf and got me into hill (Mountain!!)work no one else would do because
they were smarter than I was.

The second a 6V92TTA in front of an Allison. Bought it because I had to know
what one ws like. It was a sleeper..actually an ass kicker..much better than I was lead
to believe. In town it could keep up with car traffic with a 15 tom load ...no strain or pain.
Just KILLED anything with a 13-15-18speed from stop light to stop light.
It only struggled if I had to go to places like Estes Park where it was ALL
uphill. The Allisons needed to stay cool or they would die.

Then I had Cummins. First was a Big Cam II 400HP that dyno'ed 365hp at
the rear tires...Still have that old thing in the barn. (Attached to a Ford LTL9000)

Now I've had a lot of time with N14's and some Cat's

The Detriots were ear busters but treated right ran forever. Someone said the racks
were "touchy" but  that wasn't my experience. With the tuning "picks" you can get from
any Detrit Dealer...they were really easy to run the rack on. (Over head) AND they
really responded well to that tuning. My 6V53 leaked when the oil got too much time.
Fresh Rotella T and it didn't leak as much (Or maybe the clear oil didn't show as much)
The detriots would just run and run..even hurt. Amazing tough. I learned to just trust them
and neither one EVER left my in the woods or on the road.

The older "Mechanical" Cummin's were solid as well. I never liked the lower oil pressure
versions after Big Cam III's. Obviously they are good. The N14's with the new style electronic
controls are more fuel efficient and all but the throttle response stinks as compared to
the old Detriots and Old Mechanical Cummins....So it depends on what you are doing.

Where efficiency and emissions...and quiet are priorities the newer the better. And now with the
new Cummins (600HP) and the new Cat's (550 hp and up) You almost have to have that kinda
power to compete in the over the road market. But thats a completely different deal than Skidders.

My feeling is a Detriot along with a really good set of ear plugs is fine for Skidders & the like.
The Cummins is going to have a wider power band and be a whole lot quieter. Also more fuel efficient.
But heavier per HP.

[Quartlow]

Depends on what you want, Me, you couldn't give me a scaterpiller. Tell me who here wants to spend $12,000 grand on parts for a major overhaul?

I can rebuild a 6-71 4 or 5 times for what it cost to overhaul a 3406

Depenadbilaty and abuse, DD all the way. If you have one run off due to an illset rack it was mechanic failure. Use the RIGHT injector setting tool andit won't run off. DD are the only motor I know of you can literally gather up parts from 10 diffeant engines put it together with nothing more than a new set of rings and have it run.  I can guarrenty you won't do that with a Cat Cummins or anything else.

As for leaking, put together with weatherstrip adheshive on the gaskets and run properly, IE wide open all the time and they won't leak. Baby them and you will get blowby out of the drip tubes.

For a road truck that I had to run over the road in give me a Signature 600 cummins. Taker a trip to see  Bruce C. Mallinson at Diesel injection of pittsburgh and get one ho his  Pittsburgh Power Performance Computers. Plugs into the main computer and at the flick of switch instant horsepower.  I do believe theres 7 power settings topping out around 800hp.

If you want real power, get a Big cam 4 cummins and have Bruce rebuild it, how about 1200 ponies under the hood for daily driving pleasure?    I drove one of these for over a year hauling apples out of washington to the east coast. Only thing that I ever found that I couldn't flat run off and leave was a pair of hot V8 cats that belonged to a pair of brothers out of alabama. Only thing was they where doing rebuilds every 250,000 miles while we where getting 600,000 Again you couldn't give me a scaterpillar

[Flyboy]

 :DTJ 240, My lawnmower makes more noise than MY skidder. :D :D I've run DD in skidders, TJ  230, 240. Ran a Cat 525 for a week or so when the log truck was broke. Cat's aint what they used to be!!!  There IS something about the sound of a Deeetriot pullin a good hitch about 3 miles away in the woods.
My old man said if it started with a "C" it was going to cost you money. ;)
Ear plugs are cheap, and it lets the transplants know we're still around :D

[Ed_K]

 Flyboy, could you hear my dd this morning? Can't be more than 3 mi from you. Nasty rainy weather  :( >:( today I quit at 1:30.

[Ron Scott]

"Noise pollution" has become more and more a concern on our logging jobs as the other users such as snowmobiles, trail bikes, orv's etc are becoming quieter. :

Many of the landowners don't want us chasing "the wildlife" off their land, especially during the spring breeding and hunting seasons.

[Flyboy]

  Hey Ed, can't say I heard ya for sure, but I was wondering if you were workin. I quit at noon, was wet enough :( Was just gettin into some good stuff too. ;)

Ron, I'm all for anything that promotes the professionalism of logging! And yeah some old rig runnin a straight pipe with a  hot dog operator "puttin the wood to it" out behind someones house otta get spoke too. I guess I was just refering to the nastalga of a Detroit being synonymous with "workin in the woods"

[Button]

 With a cummins in the pickup and a dd in the skidder I would have to say they are both fine engines, top of the heap in my humble opinion. If I had to choose I would have to go with the Detroit. One day I was rocking the skidder getting threw a tight spot when the engine flipped and started running backwards. I got a fresh face of dirt as the air filter shot all its contents at me. I pulled the shutdown cables and had to put it in gear and let out the clutch to get it to die. After checking my pants I reset the cables,pressed the button and she fired right up,,,,and ran the correct way sucking air threw the aircleaner instead of threw it's exhaust. I heard they could do this but it was my first. This was three years ago and she's still a sceaming mule. Enjoy the day
Peter

[Burlkraft]

Have always heard that Detroits were externally lubricated

Yes......Detroits have built in weep holes.

One of my trucker customers called his 671 a road oiler :D :D :D :D

[Quartlow]

Yes......Detroits have built in weep holes.

One of my trucker customers called his 671 a road oiler :D :D :D :D

Hey now, its not oiling the road,,,,,it's marking its territory  :D :D :D :D

[timberjack240]

yea them ol detroits tend to leak a drop odf oil here and there and pretty much everywhere all the time  ;D i know one thing is for sure ... if oil helps prevent rust the belley pan in the ol jack will out live me  :D