Deere 440a woes

thenorthman · February 03, 2013, 11:33:47 AM

I know most of this has been coverd in previous threads, I'm just to lazy to search em out.

Anyway got the skidder on a job yesterday, and noticed a few things that are a little sketchy.

The first is when its cold its hard to turn but gets smooth after 1/2 hour or so

The blade if moved up and down more then a couple of times in a row it will start shaking and making a Hel of a racket, this is with the clutch out.

Also, and this got a little better as the day went on, the winch brake has trouble holding, have to play with the lever a bit until it holds, It pulls just fine, and free spools better then any other winch I've ever messed with, just the brake isn't real strong, but like I said after 6-7 turns it was working most of the time. It might be because the wood I was pulling was 30-40' x 30" dia fir, but it seems like it should do ok on that

mad murdock · February 03, 2013, 11:40:46 AM

Do you have a way to check the hydraulic system pressure? Weak pump, or a sticky pressure relief valve? Just a couple guesses, hope you get it dialed in. On the winch issue, is the control linkage sloppy? So brake is not setting properly each time??

Corley5 · February 03, 2013, 11:48:10 AM

Change the hydraulic filter if you haven't already. You might add some Seafoam Trans Tune also. Won't hurt if it doesn't help

thenorthman · February 03, 2013, 11:50:02 AM

Yeah I guess the linkage is a bit sloppy... looks like the control lever has been runned over and rebuilt a few times.

as far as the hydros go got no way of checking pressure. but I do have one steering cylinder that is leaky, other wise its got strong enough hydros to lift 2-3 logs at a time, if you don't mind the shaking...

I'll have to look into the release valve...

thenorthman · February 03, 2013, 11:57:52 AM

The owners manual is a bit vague on changing the trans filter, I'm a little worried that I'll lose a bucket of fluid on the ground... I have a new filter for it just a little apprehensive about spilling that much fluid in the driveway...(I don't have a shop

)

lumberjack48 · February 03, 2013, 12:49:05 PM

Anytime my hydraulics acted like that it was low on oil, sucking air instead of oil.

grassfed · February 03, 2013, 01:59:16 PM

You need to bleed the hydraulic system after you make sure that it is full. There is a bleed fitting on the left side of the steering valve. The system must be bled any time there is air in the system. Follow the procedure in the manual.

Bobus2003 · February 03, 2013, 05:34:16 PM

My blade Machine is slow to turn and my blade hammers like crazy until the Hydraulics are warmed up.. Only other time it does it is if the Fluid is low.. As for changing the Hydraulic filter.. Yeah you'll lose some oil.. I dunno if it'll be a gallon or not.. Be quick but make sure you get the cap seated right.. I have fought mine on a few occasions.. It will seem right but once the machine is running it'll leak..

As for the Winch Brake.. is it slipping while pulling? If so let it slip, the brakes are "supposed" to self adjust. (Which i think is whats happening for you if it gets better after a few drags) If thats not happening you may need new brakes

snowstorm · February 03, 2013, 06:53:11 PM

first off look at the blade valve. under the tin cover in front of the dash rite side. if its still the big square valve that came on it . well lets just say they were known trouble. a new valve can be bought for $150 or so not from jd. it must be for a closed center system. the priorty valve is next to it they also could be trouble. it will work with it removed down side is breaks and blade wont work at the same time. make sure the return spring is still on the brake valve. steering valve is quite complex and can bother. trans filter is on the left 6" or so in dia the hole is in the frame for it. it really only has 1 steering cyl the other is a stabilizer only has 1 hose. look at the steering cyl brackets the front ones brake or the bolts fall out. had one once that broke the lock nut on the steering cyl on the gland in the cyl. stray parts and the steering valve dont mix well. as far as bleeding it have never done it. i have had a 440 since the 80's and before that i worked on them almost daily at a deere dealer. on the winch take the left cover off the big one you will have to take 1 oil line off. then you can see whats going on. they used vee packing so if there is any oil at all in the housing fix it there is also a seal in the cover you took off. have seen so welds break on the brake band its in 3 peices so look that over along with springs........buy a tech manual

Bobus2003 · February 03, 2013, 09:29:24 PM

Snowstorm, my 440 has 2 hoses to each of my steering cylinders..

thenorthman · February 04, 2013, 12:37:23 AM

Checked the trans fluid on the way out to the stupor bowl, was a little low but still between the marks, so that should be good enough anyway, (at least until I get more...)

I'm not real positive as to whether the cylinder or the hoses leading to that cylinder are leaking either way I'll have to look into it before to long (please please just be the hose...) and two hoses to both steer cylinders...

The blade is kinda strange works ok the first few times while its cold, then gets all noisy and irksome, then if I don't use it a whole bunch seems just fine, the lever for it I believe is set up for auxilary hydros, all the way up and the blade drops like a rock but that's all and it detents halfway up... all the way down blade goes up, slight pressure up from there and the blade has power down, of course I have no idea where the aux lines would be plumbed in... or what I could do with em but the option is there...

After next pay day I'll get some more type 303 equivalent, and swap out the trans filter and maybe see where that leak is coming from.

Thanks for the help gang...

grassfed · February 04, 2013, 06:50:20 AM

All it takes to bleed the system is 4 feet of clear plastic hose and a 9/16 or 1/2 wrench and 10 mins. It does make a difference. Dealers want to run up your bill the last thing they want is to bill for a 10 min bleed. Try this first: if there is air in the system you will see it bubble out in the clear hose. Air in the system WILL CAUSE many symptoms that are similar to other problems. Eliminate the simplest first and go from there. I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT.

thenorthman · February 04, 2013, 09:51:06 AM

I am planning on trying to bleed it, my owners manual is a little vague on where the bleeder is... but it does say how... I just want to put a new filter in first and have enough oil to replace anymore that is lost. Don't want to run it dry

grassfed · February 04, 2013, 10:06:48 AM

This is under the cowl on the left side of the skidder facing back toward the seat. The twig is passing over the bleeder valve. ;D

thenorthman · February 04, 2013, 11:31:47 PM

Ah I see now, its under all that grease... ;D lucky me the top part of the dash (cowl?) is currently unattached, I need to get in there and see why the temp and fuel gauge aren't working anyway, and hook up some werk lights. and fix the key switch, and replace the cigar lighter (even though I quit smoking...) and the ether injection tube thingy... starter button works :D and the seat still has most of its vinyl only a few cracks...

Honestly most of that list will probably never get fixed... temp gauge and lights maybe, fuel gauge... wires are missing from the tank so that would be a qualified no.

thenorthman · February 10, 2013, 07:39:24 PM

An update...

Hydros are working much betterer... and the temp gauge does in fact work! turns out you just have to work it a little harder to get the needle to move. Spent allot of time hurrying up and waiting last weekend, yesterday was more fast paced and we got the ol needle up where it belongs...

Now for another question... When greasing the u-joints and other driveline related stuff, is there some kinda trick to getting the grease cert lined up with the access holes in the belly pan, or am I just going to have to crawl under there and have someone drive back and forth until they line up?

thenorthman · February 19, 2013, 10:16:24 PM

So Replaced the transmission filter today and hydraulics are working even better.

So while I was at it I turned her hard right so I could grease the drive lines etc, shut er off, disengaged winch pto, so I didn't go for a ride and to get everything slimey while I was in there. Bumped the starter to reingage the pto shaft. Now She won't start at all, Starter clicks and give a nice grunt but will not turn over, batteries fully charged. Have disengaged pto, and pushed clutch in, same thing. In the morning I plan on disengaging Hydraulic pump and trying again.

Any other ideas???

beenthere · February 19, 2013, 10:22:17 PM

Double check the battery post connections, and the ground strap(s). Sometimes.......... :

:

thenorthman · February 19, 2013, 10:34:27 PM

ah yes, D'oh moment...

Snowstorm, it does only have one hose to the left side steer cylinder... um sorry...

Also the cylinder is not leaking its the hose above it from the tranny I assume its the supply/return line to the pump, some one put a fix on it but its in a spot thats hard to reach without droping the belly pan and that cylinder... its also in the way of changing filters now...

grassfed · February 20, 2013, 07:02:15 AM

For greasing the drive shafts u-joints I do that 1 or two times a season. I pull the pans and clean out the twigs and oil then I grease and check the bolts on the shafts. You want to make extra sure that you keep the front one in good shape because if it breaks it will tear up the case it runs under. I would not shift the pto a lot I would just leave it engaged JD removed the shift feature on the later models so maybe it could cause problems (maybe they were just cutting costs). Sounds like it could be bad connections or weak battery or maybe your starter is getting weak. You should make sure that the fan alt belt is tight and that you are getting a good charge when it is running. I have shut the hydro pump when it is cold but when the starting system is good I don't need to do that. If you need a starter they sell them on ebay. The one with the small motor and reduction gear works great! I have had one for 3 seasons and love it.

thenorthman · February 20, 2013, 12:15:58 PM

I have a strange feeling that the greasing I've done over the last few days has been the first shes seen since at least 2004, when she got a new motor, u-joints where all dry and noisy, pins where making noise, all in all not good. I'll be giving her Hel in a minute or three, gotta finish my coffee...

Normally I do leave the pto engaged, just had to turn it by hand to get to the grease certs.

thenorthman · February 20, 2013, 08:28:34 PM

All is right with the world again... being kicked over like that bound up the hydros I guess... disengaging the pump worked just fine.

Now have any of you'se guys ever repined the articulation hinge on one these, and how much of a nightmare is it going to be. I don't think she needs one yet but soon... pretty sure it don't need to be line bored, just repined...

John Woodworth · February 23, 2013, 12:24:17 AM

Be sure to give the grease fittitng on the top outboard end of the axle housing a few pumps every few months, they lubricate the axle seal, don't overdo it, if the seal runs dry it will seize up and spin on the axle as well as let water and dirt into the bearing which when it seizes up will also spin on the axle and then you will have to weld up the axle to hold the new bearing.

thenorthman · February 23, 2013, 12:12:24 PM

got them greased up first thing... they are the easiest to get to. Still have to crawl underneath and get the last of the drive line zerks... but have to find some one willing to drive over me... the wifey said no...