First Load From a Circle Mill

[Ga_Boy]

I picked up my first load from the mill this weekend, its a mix of RO and Hickory.  All the material was supposed to be 4/4.  I have not measured it all yet but, using my calibrated finger some of boards are 3/4" thick or less and some are 1 1/2" or better.

Is this what I should expect for all my loads?  :-/


Ga Boy

[beenthere]

I don't know the history of this activity, but you should not get "thick and thin" lumber back from a sawing job. Not sure how other sawyers calculate sawing fees when producing thin lumber. But, I would make a number of careful measurements to find out what percentage of boards are undersize, and by how much. Then decide if its worth taking the next step.

I would first, measure the # of boards under the thickness spec, and deduct them from the bd ft scale (not pay for undersized lumber), and second, rescue the rest of your logs before they are also butchered.  Apparently the circle saw sawyer doesn't have a mill that can saw straight, which can be any of a number of problems.  Hope for your sake that he gets them figured out before ruining more of your logs/lumber.

Stacking thick and thin lumber in a kiln is the next problem you face. Recovering useable lumber after drying, and after making extra passes through a planer, are additional problems.

Wish you well.
 :(

[Bibbyman]

Must be lumber from the "Thick-n-Thin" sawmill.  ;)

[HORSELOGGER]

Check the width, It may be from the " Thick, Thin and Tapered Sawmill"

[Buzz-sawyer]

A circle mill is capable of exact cutting dimensions...it just has to be built and squared properly. I built my mill from pre ww2 stuff ....I had a guy tell me it wouldnt cut "nothin but thick and thin" well I cut him some uniform 1/16th of an inch boards......it WILL cut straight......... ;D ;D ;)

[FeltzE]

Try another source to sawmill, stop by and look at the finished product before you commit. I rebuilt an old belsaw and it cut fine until I damaged the blade then after realignment and blade repairs back to excellent quality. There are many reasons a circle mill may cut improperly. Just as a band mill, imroper sharpening and tooth geometry, misalignment, or worn/loose guides on the setworks (for starters)

Eric

[Kevin]

Any chance they could be the last boards sawn from the logs?

[Ron Wenrich]

At 3/4" for a dogboard, it will either fall off the headblocks or you'll hit the dogs.  I don't like to saw anything less than a 2" dogboard, but will go to 1 1/4" on occassion.

You might get some thin boards if they used a shim cut when turning back to a sawn side.  But, there wouldn't be too many of them.

Are these your logs or are you just buying lumber from the mill?  Keep a good tally, and don't pay for miscuts.  Those boys will start to pay attention after that.  If they make a fuss, take the miscuts back.

[Larry]

Yeap and in RO or hickory the dogboard is going to be junk anyhow and kindling for the stove.  I say miss cuts which should be no charge.  Think I would find another mill.

[woodhaven]

I agree with all. A well tuned and adjusted circle mill will cut just as accurate as your shop table saw. If everything is right and you set it to cut a 1" board it will do it every time. Sounds like the guy needs to spend a afternoon doing some adjusting.

[Corley5]

I'd go and talk to them about the problem and take along a few examples.  If you don't get any satisfaction find another mill.

[Ga_Boy]

I measured last night.  The thinnest board is  3/4" and the thickest is 1 1/4", the other are some where in between.  These measurments are on the ends as I've got them stacked and stickered as best I could.

The logs were mine and I got'em fer free.  Only took ten logs to this mill since I've been waiting since early January for the first mill to mill the 31 RO and WO logs.  The sawyer said maybe in a few weeks he will get to them, gottas turn his garden over and get that going.  This is why I started looking for a new sawyer.

Looks like I need to start looking for a mill; again.  I've got 55 logs of poplar and pine that I am going to use to build my barn and kiln out of and I want to get these milled so they can start air drying.

New questions:

How long should I let the poplar and pine air dry before I use it for kiln construction; I intend to use the closed cell spray on foam type of insulation?  I'm worried if it aint dry enough there could be problems down the road in the walls.  

Can I start the barn construction with fresh off the mill lumber?  I have read posts here where others have done this but I am not sure if they used poplar and pine.

Note:  I down loaded that FREE spell checker to use for this post, I like that feature cause' I never learned to spell.

[cluckerplucker]

go I built my barn and trusses for my house from fress cut  pine that was 25 years ago and its still here . As long as you brace out the trusses right and dont try the short change on the lumber it will dry the way you build it.I even ran braes between the truses to keep them stright.  cecil

[Frickman]

Ga Boy, go find another mill to saw for you. Or better yet, get your own and join us in the ranks of wood butchers. Seriously, there is no excuse for messing up lumber, even if it's low-grade wood. If your mill had the nerve or didn't care about butchering up your lumber all the talking in the world won't change them. That's just the way us sawmillers are. Any competent sawmill owner is going to stay on top of things and adjust and fix little problems before they become big ones. Occasionally you'll get a thick and thin and thick board, especially the dog board when you are sawing a long, small diameter log down to a small dog board. The cant will bow on you when it gets small. Thick and thin lumber shouldn't be par for the course though. I have customers ask me if we cut thick and thin lumber. I tell them that we can, but we'll have to charge them extra for the work involved.

We build barns and buildings with green lumber all the time and feel the building might come out better. As the wood dries it shrinks, thus holding the nails tighter. My sawmill building was partly framed with poplar lumber that was two or three days removed from the stump and we haven't had any problems with it.

[EZ]

Theres no excuse for thin and thick boards. I wouldnt put up with it at all. If theres is a problem with thin, thick, or wave, the saw should be shut down NOW, and check why.
Last weekend a guy wanted me to saw a pine log 3/4 inch thick. After squaring I sawed two boards and the guy shut me down and said go ahead and saw them 5/8. I sawed one at 5/8 and he said saw them at 1/2 inch. He wanted coon skin boards and was going to plan them down to 3/8, said the last guy he had saw for him the boards were all different sizes.
EZ

[Ga_Boy]

Really do appreciate the the help.  I'm talking with a local band saw operator to mill my barn timber.  Seems to be a nice feller, met him a few months ago on WW, I was posting on doc's page looking for help on setting up my kiln.  That is when I ran into the good folks at Nyle and they introduced me to FF.  

I got some pictures of my future barn for the band saw feller so he can get an idea of what I have.  I gotta figure this picture posting out when I do I will post some pictures of my lasest collection of free timber.  

I got a line on a huge oak that went down in the hurican that passed through a few months ago.  Now if this rain will stop I'll get some pictures of that beast coming out of the woods.  I'm not real sure if my little Kubota will handle it.







  

[woodhaven]

Hey Frickman,
 Do you use a lot of poplar?
I have a lot of it down now after Isabel last year. It seems to rot in no tine around here and I have been afraid to use it for anything outside. I bet I have 50 on the ground about 2' breast hight and 50' to first limb. It would nice to saw rather than watch it rot.

[Ron Wenrich]

Poplar is OK as long as it doesn't come in contact with the ground.  I've seen it used as contrruction wood.

You should have milled that poplar into grade lumber.  I'm working on about 200 Mbf of poplar right now.  We sell it in thickness from 4/4 to 12/4.  Lots of moldings come from poplar.  

It also takes a stain that makes it hard to tell from cherry or walnut.  Used a lot in furniture production.

[Ga_Boy]

Here goes my first picture post attempt.




I sure do hope this works.  if'n so I'll add a plenty.

[woodhaven]

Ron,
I am walnut and oak spoiled. I use it for everything. Never have to stain, if it gets chipped you don't even notice it. I see poplar is a hot item in stores to me its always been junk wood. Guess I need to change my way of thinking. I tried staining it before but the green shades in it never come out right.

[Tagerts_crossing]

poplar is good framing and sideing wood use it green if you want.  If you use it for a house I would let it air dry for about 3 months.  It will take weather well just don't have ground contact.

[redpowerd]

you have to cut it, mill it, and nail it green

[Frickman]

Woodhaven,
We use alot of poplar for buildings. Like Ron said you can't let it contact the ground. You can use it for exterior applications, just be sure that it can dry well after it rains. Most of our barns and sheds are sided in poplar. We saw alot of poplar for barn framing, almost everyone around here uses poplar. Last week I cut some poplar trees on Tuesday, we sawed the lumber out on Wednesday, and a neighbor farmer built an addition to his barn on Thursday and Friday. He'll put the tin roof on next Monday when it quits raining. The building will probably end up outlasting both of us. The Amish barn builders usually use green wood, and they are considered the best barn builders around.

Also, as Ron mentioned there is a big demand for poplar grade lumber. Especially 8/4 to 16/4. In the thicker sizes and longer lengths it pays real well too. We usually get a premium for 14' and 16' long lumber. I love sawing poplar, it's my favorite wood to run across the mill. It's something how things change over time. Back in the 70's few of the mills around here would cut poplar, there wasn't much of a demand for it. Now I see guys tripping over each other to get the timber. When we get logs too big for us to handle easily we sell the logs to other mills, and they're glad to get them.

[Ron Wenrich]

Funny how markets change.  When I first got around sawmills in the early 70s. we didn't saw much oak.  Red oak was considered junk, and we either sent it to the casket company or put it into pallets.  What we wanted was poplar.

I talked to another mill man who said he grudgingly cut red oak in the early 60s and had to pay $20/Mbf for it.  

That all changed when red oak became popular.  It was after the recession in '74.  My theory is that the baby boomers were starting to buy houses and were using cheaper cabinet wood, primarily oak.  There were also oak floors.  This was a generation that grew up on knotty pine and hard maple in homes.   Their grandparents had oak furniture.

About 4 or 5 years ago, the closed grain species became popular, and the red oak markets have been steady, but not rising in price.  Gen X is starting to build houses.  People are tired of oak.

Tulip poplar has a market again, but I remember when poplar fetched more than red oak.  I don't know if we'll get back to that.

[woodhaven]

Ron,
Now you done went and messed me up. After reading your post several times I feel 20 years older. You didn't have to go through a whole generation change.  ;D : : :