iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

Band guide wear

Started by bandmiller2, December 07, 2018, 07:22:45 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

bandmiller2

Band guides have two basic modes of failure, bearings and physical wear on the roller, worst near the end. Alignment of the roller to band travel is important if its cocked off  the band in effect is scraping the roller. More important is the type of lube used on the band. Worst is plain water, it can't help but cause fine rust on the band and iron oxide is very abrasive. A little better is water with soap but theirs not really enough soap for lube and rusting is still a problem. Better is diesel it lubes and prevents rust. Best is light oil applied sparingly with a wick it not only prevents rust but also lubes the interface of band to roller. I have quit using diesel, I save drained hydraulic or ATF to lube my bands. Don't use engine drain oil it stains and has bad products of combustion. Diesel dissolves pitch, oil more or less prevents it from sticking. I prefer sealed bearings as they have less maintenance and just the right amount of lube. Most folks over grease bearings. The idler pulleys in your car or truck are the same sealed bearings many give you over 100,000 miles. This is just one old duffers opinion you mileage may very. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

pineywoods

I have never understood why guide rollers wear off more on the outboard edge. I acquired an older high time wm lt40. Never could get it to saw right until I found the guide rollers worn off to a taper. Came up with the bright idea to chuck the rollers in my lathe and turn them back flat.  Didn't work, a carbide lathe bit wouldn't even scratch them. HARD ain't the proper description. Used a tool post grinder to cut them back flat-problem solved..
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

bandmiller2

Piney, have you found them hard all through or just case hardened. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

pineywoods

Quote from: bandmiller2 on December 07, 2018, 08:04:04 PM
Piney, have you found them hard all through or just case hardened. Frank C.
Don't really know, but I suspect just case hardened. Properties of metals is a subject I don't even know enough about to be dangerous.
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

1938farmall

Kinda like piney on the knowledge part, but think for small parts not subject to impact, it's cheaper to throw 100 of them in a heat treat basket and harden all the way thru.  then a minimal grind for the bearing pocket & the o.d. and done.
aka oldnorskie

boscojmb

Quote from: bandmiller2 on December 07, 2018, 07:22:45 AM
Band guides have two basic modes of failure, bearings and physical wear on the roller, worst near the end. Alignment of the roller to band travel is important if its cocked off  the band in effect is scraping the roller. More important is the type of lube used on the band. Worst is plain water, it can't help but cause fine rust on the band and iron oxide is very abrasive. A little better is water with soap but theirs not really enough soap for lube and rusting is still a problem. Better is diesel it lubes and prevents rust. Best is light oil applied sparingly with a wick it not only prevents rust but also lubes the interface of band to roller. I have quit using diesel, I save drained hydraulic or ATF to lube my bands. Don't use engine drain oil it stains and has bad products of combustion. Diesel dissolves pitch, oil more or less prevents it from sticking. I prefer sealed bearings as they have less maintenance and just the right amount of lube. Most folks over grease bearings. The idler pulleys in your car or truck are the same sealed bearings many give you over 100,000 miles. This is just one old duffers opinion you mileage may very. Frank C.
A little something to add.
Sealed bearings work well when using diesel or ATF for lube as Frank mentioned. 
If you are using any type of water based lube sealed bearings do not stand up. 
You need to be able to give the bearings a shot of grease at the end of the day to push out any water that have made it's way past the seals. 
Before I switched to diesel I was replacing guide roller bearings way too often.
In my opinion diesel lube and sealed bearings are the way to go.
John B.

Log-Master LM4

Magicman

Quote from: boscojmb on December 09, 2018, 08:27:34 PMIf you are using any type of water based lube sealed bearings do not stand up.
I have not experienced this.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

gmmills

WM guide rollers are case hardened right around 1/16" in depth. When you get past that depth the blade contact surface of the roller will degrade very fast. Rough and dull in appearance. Looks as if you held a flat file to it. Also soft enough that you can cut it with said file. I usually have my worn rollers re-surfaced one time and when worn again, pitch them in the scrap barrel. After all, guide rollers are considered to be consumables along with blades and belts.    
Custom sawing full-time since 2000. 
WM LT70D62 Remote with Accuset
Sawing since 1995

Ga Mtn Man

Quote from: Magicman on December 09, 2018, 09:50:48 PM
Quote from: boscojmb on December 09, 2018, 08:27:34 PMIf you are using any type of water based lube sealed bearings do not stand up.
I have not experienced this.
Nor have I.  I think the felt washer that WM puts on the guides helps shield the bearings from the spray.
"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy." - Red Green


2012 LT40HDG29 with "Superized" hydraulics,  2 LogRite cant hooks, home-built log arch.

bandmiller2

Keep in mind there are two types of "sealed" bearings, the ones with an actual soft lip seal and ones with a shield. The shielded bearings do a good job of keeping sawdust and such out but are not really liquid tight. The shields are usually metal. Whatever mill you own its prudent to protect the guide bearings as much as you can especially from the drip type band lubbers. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Chuck White

Quote from: Ga Mtn Man on December 09, 2018, 11:23:22 PM
Quote from: Magicman on December 09, 2018, 09:50:48 PM
Quote from: boscojmb on December 09, 2018, 08:27:34 PMIf you are using any type of water based lube sealed bearings do not stand up.
I have not experienced this.
Nor have I.  I think the felt washer that WM puts on the guides helps shield the bearings from the spray.
When I got my mill (2008), it had "high performance" blade guide rollers on it!  I didn't really like them, due to the fact that in some applications they were in the way!

In 2012 I sold them and bought the standard blade guide rollers with sealed bearings and here, over six years later, they still work fine and are not severely worn!

All I use for lube is water with a cup of dish soap mixed in!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

Thank You Sponsors!