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forked trees

Started by JD_Kid, April 30, 2002, 06:34:11 PM

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JD_Kid

Hi ya
I looked at a stand of firs yesterday (3 year old) some have 2 leaders ,they are in a high wind and maybe snow area ,should these be removed (whole tree) or one of the leaders cut off at a young age??
catch ya
JD Kid
I used to smoke camels but found them hard to light and kicked to much

Ron Scott

Did you plant the trees or are they naturals? If planted and you want landscape or Christmas Tree stock of symmetrical shape, then prune them as such leaving a dominant leader.

If naturals in nature, just leave them alone. One of the terminals will usually prevail over time unless you have an insect problem on the terminal leader. Then some insecticide spraying may be in order.
~Ron

Tillaway

Out here on the left coast, we usually don't bother doing anything until the stand reaches 10 or 12 years old.  Then we precommercial thin and take out most of the ones with multiple tops.   Usually, you can cut them all and not leave a hole at this age.  Sometimes if a forked one is left to fill a hole, then one of the forks is cut out, provided the fork is below DBH.  If it is above then we just leave it as is.
 
Basically you can do either right now if you so choose.  I can't see that it would hurt a thing, but you are spending time doing something that is not real productive at this stand age.
Making Tillamook Bay safe for bait; one salmon at a time.

Frank_Pender

JD, on a patch I ploanted 20 years ago I had a number of them that had developed double tops.  I went in on third year and removed the less dominate shoot.  During the 4th year the dominate did very well.  Whe the 5th year rolled around the dominate developed a double top again, on every tree I had pruned the first time.  so, again I prune the less aggressive shoot and the cycle begins again.  When the 7th year rolls around again, I found that the double tops appear.  Long story short, after 20 years I have removed those double top prone trees in my post harvesting stage.   The stand is now on a 20' spacing.  In another 10 years I will have them on a 40' spacing.    
   My conclusion in all of this is that it must be genetic to produce double tops as these trees had done.  I also know that doubles will develop due to snow, wind, birds, etc..
Frank Pender

JD_Kid

Hi ya's
the stand is planted thick .as they did not think all would grow, 99.9% did .i also heard they were not 2 leader trees but were planted on a windy day and this made them grow this way??...with the high planting rate they could be thined in the next few years as shadeing, fighting for food and water will be a prob ..myself when planting we used to put them on the end of rows or leave them to die  we could not see the point in planting twin leaders ..
thanks
JD Kid
I used to smoke camels but found them hard to light and kicked to much

Tillaway

JD,
This wouldn't happen to be some of those famous Kiwi Doug Fir plantations are they?  From what I have heard, in three years they are nearly big enough to cut logs out of.  Something like a twenty five year rotation and the logs don't float?
Making Tillamook Bay safe for bait; one salmon at a time.

L. Wakefield

   In light of the question about thinning- and maybe not doing so til 10-12 years- I have some white pine that came up very thick- at 6 y/o they are about 8ft tall, and a full glorious 3/4" diameter DBH (like an asparagus). Some years they've grown a foot or more in height. My question is, do they need thinned- you need to push through them at this point to walk. Is there an advantage to waiting in terms of discouraging lower branches? The general advice I've heard is to leave space between crowns of taller trees- but these are strictly babies.
              lw
L. Wakefield, owner and operator of the beastly truck Heretik, that refuses to stay between the lines when parking

JD_Kid

Hi Tillaway
yep ya right about the trees ,i have heard of people takeing beam's at thining stage but it still takes a few years ..it's more the forks i'm worryed about tho if left ,in 20 odd years a big snow could split alot of trees..
catch ya
JD Kid
I used to smoke camels but found them hard to light and kicked to much

Tillaway

JD
I would not worry too much but since they are Doug Fir but since they are not native  there,  I can why you should be concerned.  I think it really depends on where the original seed stock came from.  If they are a coastal strain then snow load could be a problem, but if they are and inland variety there should be nothing to worry about.  Remember, that it is normal to throw some tops no matter what so micromanagement will not buy you much. What elevation is the plantation?  If the original seed source was over 1000 meters in elevation, then it is probably inland.  Less than that and it it could be anywhere.
Making Tillamook Bay safe for bait; one salmon at a time.

Frank_Pender

LW, I would tend to feel that letting them go for a while longer would be a good idea, because of their DBH.  They sould awfully spindly to be thinned and then let the wind or shear top weight bend them over.  It sounds like they may well be depending on one another quite heavely right now for support.  I would keep an eye on them for the next two or three years and see how their rate of growth is progressing.  If it looks like they may be putting on less growth in each succeeding year, then perhaps it would be time to do some selective thinning, based on growth rate, etc..
Frank Pender

L. Wakefield

   Good idear (reminds me, have you heard the joke that starts 'what do you call a deer with no eyes?')   lw
L. Wakefield, owner and operator of the beastly truck Heretik, that refuses to stay between the lines when parking

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