Lucas sharpener

[bugmeist]

I have several questions for Lucas (and maybe other swing millers).

How do you determine that the sharpener is grinding the tooth face at 90' as per recommendation?

Is it critical that the 5 teeth are all ground to the same height within say .002 or .003"?  If so how do you measure the height (maybe not the right word but I'm hoping you can figure out what I mean)?

Thanks in advance.  This is a great forum with lots of amazing knowledge and experience.

bugmeist

[okie]

I used a speed square on the face of my blade to initially set the sharpener sq with the blade then tightened it all up. I never really paid much mind to tooth height, just tried to sharpen them all the same. If you wanted to, you could use a caliper and check from the center hole to the tip of each tooth. If one tooth is cutting much deeper than the others, it will be doing all the work.

[weisyboy]

when you get a new blade/newly retipped by a pro, line up the disk with the tooth.

sit the tooth against the tooth and look threw it from the front, there should be no light on either side, if there is adjust it till there isn't.

tehn look threw from the side and same deal, to get the hook angel right.

dont worie about getting the teeth the same thickness. from front to back there is only about .75mm of differance in height. so you can never be out by mutch.

wile sharpening watch the font edge of the tooth and stop sharpening when tehre is no black line visible. when you start sharpening there will be a radius on the front of the tooth, you will see this radius as a small shadow between the tooth and then stone. once this has disappeared the tooth is sharp.

[sigidi]

I keep threatening I will do a vid on the sharpening procedure I use, it's a bit long winded to type it, but I also am never available to video myself sharpening my blades  :D

I line the disc up as Carl has said; on a new blade, I always check the disc alignment with the teeth on the blade, lookin close for signs of daylight between the disc and the tooth, I check all 5 teeth and get the best fit for all 5, you will find that all 5 are never the same, but get as close as you can for all of them. Once the alignment is done, I take a quick run over every tooth, just one quick pass, then inspect each tooth. I then start on the tooth that needs the most work and keep count of how many passes this needs to get its corners sharp. (sharp enough to take a shaving of fingernail off my thumbnail for each corner) then I do the same amount of passes on each of the other 4 teeth - this way I figure I have taken an even amount off each tooth and keep them as close to 'even' in length as possible without getting too serious with digital calipers and the like.

Hope it makes sense, but I haven't got my video done yet  ;D ;)

[weisyboy]

dont you ever do anything allan.

have ya got that deck finished?

[sigidi]

Why ya reckon I don't do anything Carl? I've only posted twice on here in almost two weeks :D ;D

Got a bit too much going on at the moment, so posting on limited threads, but keepin an eye on things so you're not talking too much BS ;)

[tjhammer]

 

    bugmeist glad you broght this up I hear of a jig for lucas blades to install new teeth what type of jig is it and don't sharpboy have a bracket for sharpening the teeth?I'm 2/3 into my build and now some of these things are coming to mind for later on,I hope to be making saw dust this fall


   tj

[weisyboy]

it is a sharpboy grinder with a bracket made by lucas.

its quite easy to make one up.

i have a retiping jig, its quite easy so long as you know how to solder.
just make sure you use the right type of solder, needs to be 50% silver and no manganiese.

i can take pics of jig if you want.

[tjhammer]

    weisboy that sounds good I would like to see a photo of the jig did you build it? no poblem with the soldering I got a extra set of teeth for the blade I know a good sharp blade makes a big difference on a cut being a skill saw or a sawmill

   tj

[terrifictimbersllc]

I'd also like to see a video of you retipping if you have enough hands.  :D :D

[weisyboy]

you need 3 hands to do it and a 4th to hold camera.

ill get you a pic and see what i can do about vid.

i bught the kit from lucas but it could be made verry easily.

[terrifictimbersllc]

Thinking this swing blade maintenance thing through.  If you've got a saw doctor nearby or can send blades easily does it make sense to be retipping yourself  or instead just buy an extra blade instead with the money you would spend on a jig, and send blades out for retipping?   Don't they have to be side ground anyway to get a good cut, you can't do that with the field sharpeners can you?  10" swing blade costs US $340 (Lucas, Bailey) and about US $425 (Peterson).  The peterson retip jig costs about US $380 and the carbide tips about US $5 each.

[jph]

My first attempts at retipping have been fairly successful. I made a jig up myself to hold the tips in the right position. I found that on some of my blades (not original Lucas) the small rebate for the tips to sit in was not long enough and the tips would stick out too far.
5 tips cost me about £10, to have it done at the saw doctors  I was quoted £60 per blade, so definetly worth doing it myself.
John

[sigidi]

Personally, I don't think it works out economical for me. I don't have oxy gear to begin with and would need to buy the jig, then spend the time tipping the blades etc.

I get a full re-tip and hammer for $50AU and once I spend the time to set up the stuff, get oxy gear, blah, blah blah, I don't think there is much saving to be made and then after a days milling, I'd have to sit down doing blades when I got home :( nah not for me

[tjhammer]

             john

        on your jig,does your blade sit in a jig or do you have an attatchment that fit on the blade I'm with you at only 2.00 dollars a tip its worth it for me and I guess when it comes time for me to retip I will figure it out

        tj

[jph]

 I tried to describe  my jig but have given up  :
I will have to take a photo of it next time I am using it.
I too look forward to the Sigidi video.
John

[terrifictimbersllc]

Looking forward to seeing both of you retipping soon!!! :D :D :D

[snowshoveler]

About that re tipping thing.
How long do the tips usually last,providing you dont hit nails or dirt.
If you do encounter a nail...lets say a 3 inch common,is the blade scrap or can it be repaired
economicaly.
Thanks Chris

[bandmiller2]

I have watched retipping a guy I knew built industrial carbide blades.He hired girls that had studied jewlry making they know how to do fine silver brazing and are much faster than guys.A jig is easy to build,it needs to angle back aprox. 30 degrees from verticle,You have a peg the size of the arbor hole with three tapped holes from the back with adjustable screws and wing nuts to lock.One screw near the arbor hole one just below the gullet and the last in line with the back of the bit.Two screws align the saw then you adjust to center the carbide bit.The rearward angle alows you to flux and set the bit in its pocket heat and touch silver braze to the plate joint.If the saw seems wobbly just have a stack of washers or spacer around the arbor hole and align with the below gullet screw. Frank C.

[weisyboy]

my blades providing i don't hit a nail or rock will last about 60 - 100 cube of log. about 50 sharpening. i that is about 13500 - 22500 BF of sawn boards.

if i hit a nail, rock, coach bolt, batten screw, pipe, rifle , hills hoist, bullet, insulator or anything else non wood like in a log it smashes the tips off and i will have to get the blade re tipped.

small nails like a standard 2" nail dont worrie me that much i have cut 30 of them before the blade was buggered, that was in 1 log.

i only re tip if i have to, i normally send my blades off to be done but tehy can take up to a week and a half to come back and if i need one in the mean time ill do it. they are never as good as profesionaly done ones.

i run 5 blades in rotation.

[weisyboy]

i have a pic of retip jig on blade but cant find cable.

procedure is as folows.

place balde in vice with tooth to be done facing up.

heat tooth heat right back 3" from tip, but get tip just hot enough to melt solder.

brush of existing tooth and old solder.

flux tip pocket.

tinn pocket (fill tip pocket with solder)

repeat on each tooth.

now attach jig to blade.

tip to be soldered facing down.

place tip in jig.

flux back of tip.

heat tip and jig till solder melts. (solder on tip will go shiny)

lift jig so tip comes in contact with tooth. heat until the solder melts and sucks tip into pocket. (apply slight upwards force always.

cool down blade slowly.

repeat on all tips.



that is the jig in the middle of that box.

you have to use oxy as map gass dosnt get hot enough quick enough.

[terrifictimbersllc]

Weisy are your 5 blades in rotation all the same kind or do you use different ones for soft wood vs. hard?

[weisyboy]

all 5 of my blades are 5 tooth standard lucas blades.

[tjhammer]

     weisyboy

    nice green box and looks like solder,flux,mapp tourch and wire brush but how does the jig fit on the blade,does the jig hold the angle and center?anyway you could set up a blade with the jig on it,right now I'm haveing trouble trying to imagine how the jig in the box fits on the blade,does the blade have a saddle for the tooth to set in,I don't have a tooth in front of me,does the tooth have a slot in it to fit to the blade,thanks.
   tj

[weisyboy]

i have a photo but i dont have a cable to get the photo onto my computer.

the blade has a pocket for the tip. a small piece cut out that the tooth sits in.

[weisyboy]

found i can put card from camera straight into computer.

the tips have solder on the backs of them when i buy them.






the second screw back in this pic is the adjuster to get the tip in the center.

[tjhammer]

    weisyboy



    thanks for the photos,a picture is worth a thousand words,I see said the blind man as he picked up his hammer and saw.
     I like the saw design
   tj

[sigidi]

Biggest thing with a Lucas blade is getting that tip centered on the blade so there is equal side clearance on both sides - especially as we only run 5 teeth. You can be super pedantic and see the tooth Carl has photo'd is slightly off more to the left of pic than the right when compared to the blade itself... I don't re-tip myself as I, firstly don't have the gear, but feel it's too much of a skill to learn and do well. I make sure the engine, and all parts of the mill are running 100% and I leave the blades to a saw doctor, so good onya for having a crack Carl.

[weisyboy]

allan that tooth was put on by peacocks and is dead on in the middle.

they put them on and gind the faces.

i ran out of teeth but i willl order more on mundy and do a vid when i get them.

[sigidi]

must be something to do with picture angle, it looks a bit off... ???

[weisyboy]

i think it is the jig making it look off. the bits of steel taper making the angels look funny.

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

You should have a crack All it aint that hard Mate  ;) ;D 8) I have to go into my uncles saw shop and do a full retip on 3x8" blades and 4x10" blades soon as Im runnen low on fresh ones fellas   ;) :D :D and I havn't even been doing as much sawing as I would like to lately   :( :( :'( thats about to change soon though going to pick up 150 ton of ash on wed&thurs and ill be a happy man again  ;) ;D ;D ;D 8) 8)

Regards Chris

[cid]

 smiley_swinging_board

hi -----------

would like to know where i can buy teeth for my  lucas mill --- in the casino and grafton area

the  lucas mill the best  toy i have ever bought myself

[Ianab]

Try Baileys, link to their page is over there  <-----------

They list spare tips @ $1.95, and shipping shouldn't be much for a bunch of them.

Ian

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

And Welcome to The Forum Cid nice to have another Aussie here Mate  ;) ;D ;D ;D 8) 8) They are a great little mill  ;)  ;D 8) What model do you have and what are you milling with it Mate  ???

With tips just give the Lucas's a call for pre tinned side ground tips Mate they run at $2.20 au ea and they post them out to you in the mail I get mine from them  I have to order some more as i used some the tips for the 8" to get a full set for the 10" as little experiment on two saws and i have to say they are working well as i have milled pine, box & sugar gum this week on the same blade but I will have to see how it goes in pine once the tips are down alittle more ;) do you have a jig  ??? as I reckon it makes it alot quicker personally  ;D  I cleaned up and retiped 5 10" blades in 2 &1/2 hrs the other day i still have to retip the 8" blades so i will have to do a clip for youtube when I do them as i was in a bloody rush as usual    ;) :D ;D

Regards Chris

[fishpharmer]

Hi Cid, welcome to forstry forum!!

I look forward to hearing about your mill and milling.

[Ianab]

Ahh.. didn't click he was in Aussie.  :

Yeah, get them direct from Lucas themselves.

http://www.lucasmill.com/ContactUs/tabid/63/Default.aspx

That way you know you are getting exactly the right profile etc

Ian