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Author Topic: LT35HD alignment issue  (Read 3459 times)

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Offline Southside logger

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #40 on: March 28, 2018, 09:45:06 PM »
Now the rest of the story comes out, the whole "I jumped out of the back hoe and landed on a chunk of asphalt" was just a cover to you head butting his mill.  It is true goats will climb on anything.   :D
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Offline Crossroads

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #41 on: March 29, 2018, 10:06:09 AM »
I have had a couple of times where I had the last board be thin on one end and correct on the other. The first thing I noticed was the cant wasnt touching the bunk on the front of the mill.First I thought it was debris under the log. Nope! Then I thought it was stress in the wood and made sure to flip the cant, but the gap was still there. Next I thought one of the bed rails was high and holding the end up. After several checks, I only found about 1/32 of variance. So, now the head scratching really begins. Then I read this post the other day and whenI set my mill up yesterday, I looked down the beam and could see a definite crown in the round rod. I gave the back outrigger one more notch and the crown went away. That will definitely be a step in every setup from here on out. Thank you for posting this thread, I was pulling out what little hair I have left..
2017 LT40 wide, Kubota l185dt, 2-036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins

Offline Deere80

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #42 on: March 29, 2018, 11:42:08 AM »
When I talked to the tech support guy at Wood-Mizer yesterday he told me there is supposed to be a crown up and out on the rod, that is the way they are made for any of you that did not know that.  I did not know that I thought it way supposed to be straight.  I still haven't heard anything back from them though.
Wood-Mizer LT35HD

Offline uler3161

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #43 on: March 29, 2018, 12:09:04 PM »
Have you tried putting your cant or straight line across the rails when the head is in the middle of the mill? I wonder if the weight of the head at the right point will straighten it out. Perhaps that's the reasoning for the crown. Maybe having no crown will cause it to dip in the middle when the head gets there. Just a theory.
1989 LT40HD, 12ft extension, WoodMaster 718, Fordson Major Diesel, Champ CB40 Forklift

Dan

Offline ladylake

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #44 on: March 29, 2018, 01:44:30 PM »
When I talked to the tech support guy at Wood-Mizer yesterday he told me there is supposed to be a crown up and out on the rod, that is the way they are made for any of you that did not know that.  I did not know that I thought it way supposed to be straight.  I still haven't heard anything back from them though.
 Sounds like you are getting the run around, I'd send it back and have them straighten that rod and then realign the bunks.  Steve 
Timberking B20 12000 hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Dino setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Offline Remle

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #45 on: March 29, 2018, 03:29:42 PM »
Interesting anomaly, if the top round bar is truly offset sideways as the OP suspects (which while improbable is not technically impossible if the welding jig was disturbed during fabrication) then the sawmill head vertical mast could tilt sideways in that section of the mill. This could allow the blade to rise or fall in relation to the bed in that section. If the OP was aligning the bunks to the blade they would follow the blade horizontal plane and be uneven over the length of the mill. All said Id be interested in what WM finds in this case, I dont have a WM mill but have the utmost respect for the manufacturer and the design. Please keep us updated on your and WMs determination.

I'm told one of the advantages of the monopost configuration is the ability to saw straight lumber even if the mill is not perfectly level, the WM mills I've run were quite stiff and rigid in their beam construction. I'd be surprised if you could twist that beam enough with the leveling feet to cause the offset in the round bar that appears in the OP's pics if the pics truly represent that offset. Interesting.


Joe
IMHO, I agree with Joe's assessment of the cause and effect of the rod being offset at different points along the length of the beam. While crown can be a matter of support the horizontal alignment of the rod is a different matter. Looking at my WM mill both the top and bottom rods are straight and proud of the beam's side, equal distances of the edge of the rod hanging over the beam. Hang a square over the top rail and compare this along the lenght of the beam. Any big deviations will certianly stick out. If as you suspect their are significant differances, then IMHO it would be a manufacturing issue.

Offline Southside logger

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #46 on: March 29, 2018, 04:08:09 PM »
Having a built in crown does not surprise me at all, look at a flat bed semi trailer when it is unloaded - crowned in the middle.  I suspect the outward deflection in the round rod serves to act as a torsion rod to only allow the frame to flex to a certain point when loaded with a log.

If you read the alignment specifications the outward side of the head is also higher than the inward side to allow for flex from the force of the band in the wood.  

At the end of the day if you are still convinced that the issue is with the mill and not stress in the cant you could always get a S4S dried beam, say poplar or white pine, that has a dead center pith, straight grain, no knots, etc and try sawing it, new band with tension right, and see what happens.  

These machines put out high quality lumber, but at the end of the day it is still considered to be rough sawn.  What looks like perfection becomes a bit less when you start to run a moulder, does not matter what saw it came off of.  
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Offline starmac

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #47 on: March 29, 2018, 04:13:59 PM »
I can agree with most mentioned in this thread, but none of it means it couldn't be a factory defect either, it happens to any manufacturer.
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

Offline Deere80

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #48 on: April 10, 2018, 12:56:04 PM »
UPDATE..

Talked with Woodmizer at Indy and was referred to a Supervisor because the tech could not help me.

Supervisor had me try a few things which didn't change anything and told me the saw is cutting with in specs.  If the saw cuts with in 1/8" it is what they consider rough cut lumber.  As far as the bunks being high low high low he can't explain that.  He said that was impossible to be.  So I really got no where.

They were all decent to talk to but I have not got any where yet.
Wood-Mizer LT35HD

Offline redneckman

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #49 on: April 10, 2018, 08:43:37 PM »
Deere,
First of all. thanks for begining this post.  It has a ton of good info and discussion in it.  I have a 2017 LT 50.  My mill has 30 hrs on it.  I was sawing for a cutomer last week, and I noticed a couple of differnt things.  One, was when I used the pattern mode, the last baord was just a little thinner on one end than on the other.  The other thing I noticed had to do with the speed.  If I set it really slow, once it got over the axle it would stop.  I would have to speed it up a little to get it going.  It was like it was riding over a hump in the frame, which makes sense to what has been posted.  I figured the frame was crowned a little because I was siting on really soft dirt.

Stick with me here a minute.  The cantilever design of a WM consists of the head moving along the beam.  So, if the beam is straight, the head should move straight with it. So, set your mill up.  Forget the level.  Levels can get off.  If someone went crazy on the paint on the mill in one spot and got it thick, it could through you off a little too.  Move the head all the way to the front (tongue end). Tie a string from the bottom of the head to the other end of the mill, just off the rail.  Slide a 3/4" thick block between the string and the frame at the head and the end of the mill.  Do the same at the tail end.  The 3/4 block sets the line off the frame 3/4".  The string will be perfectly straight.  Take a third 3/4" black and use it a  guage block along the rail of the mill.  Slide it between the rail and the line at every cross rail.  The line should just kiss the block.  If it is out, you will see the string down on the face of the block, or a gap between the line and the block.  Use the levelers to get it perfectly straight.  You can use a level to level it side to side.

Your situation reminds me of a shop teacher I had one time.  He said that if you need to do good work, make a jig.  Once you get the rail perfectly straight, make you a jig that you can slide down the rail and check the height of each cross rail off the main rail.  If your main rail is straight, the height of each cross rail off the main rail should be the same all the way down the mill.  If not, adjust it.

Once you a 100%  sure that the cross memebers a set correctly, you can start the process of elimination.  Just the other day, I had a bolt to fall out of my barker.  The rest of the bolts were very loose.  If someone left one of the cross rails on your mill loose, and if you loaded a heavy log with a knot on it that came done on that one rail, I could see how it would knock it out of adjustment.

Sometimes a simple string can do miralces.  The Egyptians proved that.  There is a simple explaniation for your troubles.  

Hope this helps.

Offline terrifictimbersllc

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2018, 06:46:33 PM »
Make sure the feed motor is not rubbing on the tire as it goes over it, this could happen if the mill is not jacked up high enough, at least on my LT40. 
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT   2001 WM LT40SHDD (42HP Kubota, Accuset2, FAO's, Lubemizer, debarker, hydraulics everywhere), Peterson WPF 10-30 with chain slabber. Logrite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.

Offline Deere80

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #51 on: April 12, 2018, 08:35:22 AM »
Make sure the feed motor is not rubbing on the tire as it goes over it, this could happen if the mill is not jacked up high enough, at least on my LT40.

Thanks for the suggestion but my feed motor is not even close to touching a tire.  So they must be designed different from the 35 to the 40.
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Offline ladylake

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #52 on: April 12, 2018, 11:12:34 AM »
 
  That track rod needs to be cut off and welded on straight and then the bunks leveled to it, I'd sure think its a warranty  issue. No way is 1/8 " or so close enough on 6  x 6 beams.  Steve
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Offline Brucer

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #53 on: April 14, 2018, 12:45:44 AM »
When I bought my first LT40 in 2005, the dealer told me there was a slight vertical arch built into the main tube. If the mill outriggers were set up "by the book", the arch would straighten out under the weight of the mill (and the log) and the mill would cut true. I checked with a water level, and yes, the main tube was arched up in the middle.

I found that mill was very easy to set up and I had no issues with the cants lying flat. The setup was so forgiving that I didn't even have to go strickly by the book.

My second LT40 was a little touchier. I had to pay more attention to setting it up and I suspect there was a little more arch in the tube than in the first mill.

That mill still cut true but I couldn't get lazy about setting it up. And when it sat in one place for any length of time I would have to re-adjust the end outriggers to compensate for compressed soil. When the new screw-type outriggers came out I replaced the two end ones and it was much easier to keep the mill set up properly.

That main tube might look perfectly rigid, but it will sag about 1/16" under its own weight if it's only supported at the ends. You want to have a little more upward pressure near the ends.

When you adjust the bed rails, you need to be consistent in all your measurements. I always measure to the underside of a downward set tooth, and I always you the same one on each bed rail (I mark it with a black permanent marker). I also use the marker to make a line on each bed rail directly under the tooth (I use a level to set it). To speed the whole process up, I've also painted white stripes on the main frame that line up with the front carriage roller housing when the blade is directly above the rails. This may sound extra picky, but I am always sure that my measurement from rail to tooth is consistent.

On the LT40 (and probably the LT35), the blade is 1/16" higher at the outboard side of the mill. The head will pull down parallel to the bedrails as soon as the blade bites into the log.

I also make a point of adjusting the mill alignment when the weather is mild and dry (or I'm under a roof). If I'm cold or wet I always tend to rush things and that's the last thing I should be doing when truing up the mill.

Unless the log moves from sawing out the stresses, with a good blade I'll be within 1/32 of an inch from one end of the cant to the other. Doesn't matter if it's 8' long or 32' long.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw with two 6' extensions.
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Offline Southside logger

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Re: LT35HD alignment issue
« Reply #54 on: April 14, 2018, 12:55:28 AM »
You are correct about the LT35 blade being set 1/16" higher on the outward side.  
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
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Riehl Edger
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Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.


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