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More Observations from a New Sawyer

Started by SawyerTed, October 14, 2018, 08:48:40 PM

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SawyerTed

Just a few more thoughts from a new sawyer about this hobby/business.  I'm far from an expert but am beginning to see the possibility that I will eventually live up to the title of "sawyer."  In no specific order....

1. A portable sawyer requires a good truck.
2. Portable sawmilling is hard on a truck.
3. Blade storage and management requires forethought.  
4. You don't know what's involved with blade management and storage until you have to.  It's a "Catch 22"
5. A new sawyer doesn't know what he doesn't know
6. No matter how much a new mill owner wants to, leave the walnut log until you've sawed several hundred board feet. (See #5)
7. Some wood just will not behave after being cut no matter what.
8. It's hard to get too much help at the mill,  it is hard when you have too little help.  
9.  There's a difference between being a sawyer and a machine operator.  You must think differently to become a sawyer. 
10.  Every log is different, a sawyer learns why and saws accordingly.
11.  A machine operator will produce a lot of material for the fire pit, stove or burn pile.  A sawyer not so much.
12.  Look at free logs with a jaundiced eye.  There's usually a catch.
13.  Your business model/plan needs to be flexible - follow the market as necessary.
14.  Learn to instruct helpers on safety and efficient off bearing.
15.  Teaching proper stacking and stickering requires persistence and patience.  
16.  Customers require education sometimes - they sometimes want 2x10s from 10" logs.
17.  Don't under estimate the value of your labor.
18.  Get a bigger truck/sign/tractor/shed
19.  When you plan your sawmill shed, plan what you think.  Then double that.
20.  When you build your sawmill shed, go ahead and grade the site for the addition.
21.  Good gloves are consumable, nobody wears crummie gloves so they last forever.
22.  Between May and October, set up in the shade if you can.  
23.  Read the manual first.
24.  Marketing and sawing are codependent. Neither one is easy.
25.  Free onsite customer consultations pay for themselves.
26.  Cookies are easy money especially on short notice.
27.  30 blades are not enough, 45 is a start if you are sawing 3 or more days per week. 
28.  Blades purchased at the same time will likely have a similar life expectancy.  Stagger blade purchases.
29.  Maintenance pays for itself.
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

WV Sawmiller

Ted,

   Very good points. One of my favorites is #12.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2011 4WD F150 Ford Lariat PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Stihl 440 Chainsaw, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once

azmtnman

1983 LT 30, 1990 Kubota L3750DT, 2006 Polaris 500 EFI, '03 Dodge D2500 Cummins powered 4X4 long-bed crew cab, 1961 Ford backhoe, Stihl MS250, MS311 and MS661--I cut trees for my boss who was a Jewish carpenter!

SawyerTed

Yes Magicman does but he prefers to coil blades.  My preference is flat storage.  Either way, sharp blades and dull blades management is something that one has to do to understand.
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

Magicman

Yup, whatever works best.  I have never found a way to transport the flats in my truck to suit my liking.  For trips lasting a week I put two cubes on my truck's back seat in addition to the waterproof Magic Can in the back.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

samandothers


Brad_bb

Keep the prevailing wind direction in mind when you set up.  Nothing worse than dust blowing in your face -Ash, because it's so dry already, is particularly bad.

Best gloves I've found is the Stihl Timbersports gloves, but they are not ideal.  They fit great and since they are like a batting glove, give you better feel.  I also moisturize the leather to make it last longer.  The downside is the black spandex material between the leather and the top nylon.  It starts failing after 2 or 3 weeks leaving holes for your fingers to slip out of.  I really wish they'd get rid of the spandex and use a tougher static material like rip stop.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

YellowHammer

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

SawyerTed

YH, that transition from operator to sawyer IS really important.  It isn't a smooth curve.  Sometimes it's learning about the logs, sometimes it's learning about the mill, other times it's blades, and sometimes it is material handling and so on.  Sometimes it's looking at a stack of lumber and realizing it was a tough fight that day.  But when things come together for a new sawyer, it feels good.

Last week I had a day when things just weren't going right.  My helper and I quit before something went really wrong.  We came back the next day and had a 1000 board feet day! I felt like we really made progress after that one tough day.
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

scsmith42

Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
Smith - Gallagher dedicated slabber
Tom's 3638D Baker band mill
and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

YellowHammer

I charge almost twice the local standard rate for customer sawing and get more business than I can handle.  I usually ask them why they don't go down the road to the seemingly dozen other guys who own bandmills?  Typically, the answer I get back is "I've tried them because they are a lot cheaper, and they have a nice mill, sure, but they don't know what they are doing".

Being a sawyer is a lot more than buying a mill and reading the brochure. 

Unlike many highly specialized trades, with bandsawmilling, there is normally not an apprentice period.  Buy the mill, get to sawing. 

Who would hire a guy to brick their new house if they knew he had just bought his first trowl a few weeks ago, and learned to lay brick and mix mortar by watching YouTube videos?

From the list you've made, and your posts, I'd say you are doing just fine. 8)


YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Brad_bb

The only way to learn to mill is to just do it.  You'll learn 80% that way, and the other 20% from other sawyers(this forum) ;D

When Woodmizer sells you a mill and you pick it up, they'll demo it for you.  But if you think you're going to learn to mill that way, think again.  There's too much to absorb right off the bat.  It's a good start, but you can only absorb a little at a time.  That is why it's important to do it.  You can build your knowledge bit by bit as you go along.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

Crossroads

That's a good list with some very valid points. Knowing what you need to work on is half the battle. 
Not sure if it will help you or not, but I made 2 plywood boxes to carry  2 different degree blades to jobs. Then when blades come off the mill they get coiled. At the end of the day all the coiled dull blades go around a gas can. 
With the right fulcrum and enough leverage, you can move the world!

2017 LT40 wide, BMS250 and BMT250,036 stihl, 2001 Dodge 3500 5.9 Cummins, l8000 Ford dump truck, hr16 Terex excavator, Valley je 2x24 edger, Gehl ctl65 skid steer, JD350c dozer

Darren

Great post. New to sawmilling myself and dont know much of anything yet, definitely inspirational for sure.

kelLOGg

I find myself saying that operating a sawmill is easy but sawing a log is much much harder. Still learning.
Bob
Cook's MP-32, 20HP, 20' (modified w/ power feed, up/down, loader/turner)
DH kiln, CatClaw setter and sharpener, tandem trailer, log arch, tractor, thumb tacks

SawyerTed

Thanks for the encouraging words. There have been several new people here lately.  Since I'm a few months into this, I wanted to pass along some of my thoughts.

The more I've learned the more I find I need to learn.  Some learning doesn't come in this business unless I make a mistake.  Usually those mistakes are caused by either thinking I know what I'm doing or trying something new.  Even with all the valuable knowledge here, there's some stuff you just have to do to understand. 

Being a retired educator, I suppose reflecting on my progress is in my nature.  
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

Mad Professor

Come winter, if you're cold, you're not working hard enough.

Resonator

Great post! One of the first things you have to decide is whether sawing is a hobby, or a business. A hobby is something you spend money on, for leisure and enjoyment. A business is trading goods or services for money to create income, and has to break even or (hopefully) generate a profit. If your running a business, be very careful about #18, and #19. You could get in over your head in debt, before you generate enough cash flow to pay it back. (Too many new businesses fail this way). As far as becoming a sawyer, you have to learn first hand (practice, practice, practice) to get good at any skill.
Under bark there's boards and beams, somewhere in between.
Cuttin' while its green, through a steady sawdust stream.
I'm chasing the sawdust dream.

Proud owner of a Wood-Mizer 2017 LT28G19

boonesyard

Excellent post/thread. We've been cutting for ourselves this season (practice) and #11 has definitely been in play. Between school of hard knocks and this forum, the fire pit fuel has been less prevalent. Huge respect to the sawyers.
LT50 wide
Riehl Steel Edger
iDRY Standard kiln
BMS 250/BMT 250
JD 4520 w/FEL
Cat TH255 Telehandler
lots of support equipment and not enough time

"I ain't here for a long time, I'm here for a good time"

SawyerTed

Quote from: Resonator on October 15, 2018, 10:35:25 AM
Great post! One of the first things you have to decide is whether sawing is a hobby, or a business. A hobby is something you spend money on, for leisure and enjoyment. A business is trading goods or services for money to create income, and has to break even or (hopefully) generate a profit. If your running a business, be very careful about #18, and #19. You could get in over your head in debt, before you generate enough cash flow to pay it back. (Too many new businesses fail this way). As far as becoming a sawyer, you have to learn first hand (practice, practice, practice) to get good at any skill.
You are absolutely right!  This is a business for me.  And decisions about equipment, even small items, have to be within means of the business without pulling excessive amounts of personal funds into play.  At only 7 months, the bigger truck and other equipment is on the wish list.  I have to make do.  On the other hand a sawmill shed/drying shed is a priority!  Not being able to saw on rainy days is hurting my productivity.
Woodmizer LT50, WM BMS 250, WM BMT 250, Kubota MX5100, IH McCormick Farmall 140, Husqvarna 372XP, Husqvarna 455 Rancher

wooddog


kelLOGg

Quote from: SawyerTed on October 15, 2018, 07:37:04 PM

On the other hand a sawmill shed/drying shed is a priority!  Not being able to saw on rainy days is hurting my productivity.
I wish I had built my shed bigger to accommodate not only the mill but also lumber stack(s) and truck and trailer. That would have made it about 60 feet longer but I could have used it.
Bob
Cook's MP-32, 20HP, 20' (modified w/ power feed, up/down, loader/turner)
DH kiln, CatClaw setter and sharpener, tandem trailer, log arch, tractor, thumb tacks

WV Sawmiller

KelLog,

   Trust me 60' is not a lot of lumber storage. It fills up real quick.
Howard Green
WM LT35HDG25(2015) , 2011 4WD F150 Ford Lariat PU, Kawasaki 650 ATV, Stihl 440 Chainsaw, homemade logging arch (w/custom built rear log dolly), JD 750 w/4' wide Bushhog brand FEL

Dad always said "You can shear a sheep a bunch of times but you can only skin him once

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