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Building a house with a sawmill

Started by Jmiller160, August 16, 2017, 12:08:39 PM

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Don P

Look up SDR, saw-dry-rip. I prefer to do especially yellow poplar framing that way. I don't try to compete with dimensional framing lumber so when I cut framing it is generally for me or farm use where the supply and the mill makes some sort of sense. In residential work I usually buy framing. Where the small mill shines in structural wood is in the specialty sizes. If we need exposed structural timber then it all begins to make sense. Depending on how it is treated locally, the timber, your equipment and time, where it works for anyone is a moving point. Normally when I buy kd T&G it is at 15%. I prefer it drier than that, whenever possible we air dry it further in the house under construction, our air dried emc is closer to 12% and inside with heat running hard we can get to 8.

We've been talking about sawing for a house, where it really pays is in the finishes. My house is trimmed in red oak, ever price red oak trim? The trim, cabinets, paneling, stairs etc are high dollar items and ungraded lumber.

MbfVA

Don's last post makes a lot of sense, but there's still the glow one gets from knowing that all the lumber in their house came from their land; and as has been said, a lot of it depends on how you value your time.  Opportunity cost is the operative term.

People have paid & will pay good money for sillier things.  Witness some of the geegaws in the McMansions that are now for sale for a fraction of what they cost to build & "equip".

I would agree 100% that trim and other specialty items are where having your own mill will be most cost-effective.  Wouldn't you include the big timbers for timber framing in there as well--good luck finding those type Timbers at Home Depot.  My understanding is you usually get those from somebody who has a mill just like you might have.
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MbfVA

 I am struggling with the physics on full speed ahead to get 8% emc wood in a house where I'm going to be trying to maintain 45 to 50% relative humidity  long-term.  Would that wood not try to equalize up to a higher moisture content due to what is ambient?  Why go so low, I don't get the advantage?  Doesn't that just potentially add expense?  I'm not being a smart aleck; I know Don can probably explain it.

My brain's logic section brain tells me it should be equalized to the environment it's going to be in (tho' it will likely never be equal to the room RH, will it?), not sure why I would want pay to go way way below it to install.

Maybe bugs are the concern?

I think I have heard it said that nature abhors a vacuum and in fact "imbalances", in most situations?  Things like vapor pressure etc. enter into it,  and that's getting into that stuff I don't remember.

I stopped in the middle of taking physics back in 1971 at Virginia Tech, to transfer to accounting, so I'm a bit more than rusty.  When our indoor RH gets below 40%, my nose starts drying out, respiratory stuff becomes much more of a problem.  Ultrasonic humidification from Costco to the rescue.
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Magicman

My Cabin Addition paneling was dried to 8% and then was stored inside of the enclosed Cabin until it was used.  I commented on having to move the stacks several times as my work progressed.  If I remember correctly it was up to ~10% by the time that I actually used it.

Quotebut there's still the glow one gets from knowing that all the lumber in their house came from their land
Yes, this is a very common comment that I hear.  After it was framed up one customer stood at his front entrance and picked out the Oak trees that he wanted to fell and have sawn into his wall paneling.  Only the tree tops of some of them were visible, but they were the ones that he wanted.


 
Clyde's wall paneling.


 


 
Red Oak paneling being installed.

Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

MbfVA

MM very nice.  Did you have to put sheetrock under that paneling for fire rating purposes?   I recall something about sheetrock being required over the OSB that faces inside with SIPs, to get the required fire rating.
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Ianab

You are correct that you should be drying with the intended location in mind.

The majority of US homes with their central heating do get very dry, especially over Winter. Although the outside air might be 50-60% RH, when you heat it up to a comfortable level you are down under 30%.

But if you are going to control that with humidification, then aim to have your wood at the appropiate level.

A piece of wood in my house sits around 13%. But then I have to run a DEhumidifier to keep my humidity down around 60%. And that's off today as it's a nice Summer day and the house is opened up. RH outside has come Down to about 70% by midday. It started the morning around 100% (Morning mist)

So 8% wood is not a good thing for me, it would need to gain moisture before use.

And bugs are killed by heat in a kiln. PBB beetles can live at 8% MC, which is what makes them so annoying.  :-[  The majority of bug that might live in green wood will die off as the wood dries out. But that's when the PBBs like to move in.
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

MbfVA

 It's cold here right now Ian, thanks for reminding us that you're enjoying a wonderful summer.  :snowball: :snowball: :snowball:
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Magicman

No sheetrock is under my SYP wall paneling and I have no idea about Clyde's Red Oak.  It's also in the same county with no permits or inspections.

We have no fire (truck, etc.) protection so if it catches fire it will go to the ground anyway.  As long as we get out nothing else matters.  There is no fire insurance on it either because it is classified as an "unoccupied" dwelling.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

reswire

Quote from: Jmiller160 on August 16, 2017, 10:40:09 PM
I live in South East kentucky and there aren't any building restrictions other than septic and if you own over 25 acres you fall under a homestead act and you don't need plumbing inspection either.  I've cut about 60 tulip poplar from my land and are cutting them 6×8 to build a log house with my woodlands hm126.. I've only got 3800 In my mill.
Do you know many people who have used Tulip Poplar for a log cabin build?  I've got access to quite a few, but was always concerned if the poplar would withstand the weather.
Norwood LM 30, JD 5205, some Stihl saws, 15 goats, 10 chickens, 1 Chessie and a 2 Weiner dogs...

Peter Drouin

I do grade, but only lumber from my mill, It's the way the law is set up here.
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

Don P

Almost all the NE states now have native lumber laws, several down here do but not me yet.

Poplar cabins are out there, Dolly can't be wrong  ;D  there is one about a half mile above me that has newspapers from WWI on the walls. If you keep the wood dry it works. Tulip poplar, yellow poplar, tends to open up a wide check as it dries which is why most log home companies shy away from it.

8% is the emc for ~35%RH if memory serves. I've metered the wood in the house in the winter and that is where I bottom out around Feb. There is good reason for drying below the in service emc slightly, joints tighten slightly rather than the opposite and there is a hysteresis, lagging effect, you will stay slightly on whichever side of emc you approach it from. the wood is slightly more stable on the dryer side if you can get there. In the summer we will run up to 15%emc and higher for short periods, I'd really rather be lagging then. These are ideals, I've had to nail stuff up the next day and have also had the luxury of building a sauna on site... dry kiln  ;D There are houses where I've thought "good enough" and gone back later to more shrinkage than I liked. In shops we would accept up through 12% before sending a truck back.

Magicman

Tulip Poplar is our "go to" for B&B siding, but you want to avoid roof runoff spatter with any species.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

drobertson

As clear as much of the poplar I've seen sawn at the shoot outs at the Paul Bunyan shows, I have to believe I would and many folks around here would have made good use of the wood.  Now the sawing like went on at the shoot outs? well, it would not have flown very far here, but, what  I witnessed the wood act much like SYP but has the deciduous characteristics. I've never sawn a lick of it, but really wanted to, and all I have to say is if a house is to be built, and the codes allow it, then with some proper planning it can be done with much less cost than going through the lumber yards.  Now time is somewhat of a factor, so time has to be considered,,,and then considered again. And not only that, the amounts of crap you might see culled at your local lumber yard,,the stuff that may be on top or the real bad thrown off to the side,, well figure on this happening with anything you saw out.  The ones that accomplish the task,, start to finish, and dried finished interiors, Well, it is a prize to show off in my book, you can do it, but be ready for set backs and disappointments along the way.  Knowing whats ahead helps a little on being ready for what you about to arrive to and face. 
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Peter Drouin

W Pine here works well for siding. We have poplar here, I have cut tons of it, For me here I have no market for it. And I think it smells bad. :D :D
I have cut timbers for customers [customers logs] and I have seen 6x6 timbers twist while cutting on the mill. :o
Having a sawmill is a handy tool to have, Opens a lot of doors for you.
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

michaelyares

Quote from: Jmiller160 on August 16, 2017, 10:40:09 PM
I live in South East kentucky and there aren't any building restrictions other than septic and if you own over 25 acres you fall under a homestead act and you don't need plumbing inspection either.  I've cut about 60 tulip poplar from my land and are cutting them 6×8 to build a log house with my woodlands hm126.. I've only got 3800 In my mill.
How did this end up working for you? We are planning on using tulip/yellow poplar to build and I have just stacked the logs. I have read if it a good idea to saw over sized, dry and then rip/resaw after things are dryer and done moving. Thanks

fluidpowerpro

When I first saw the title of this subject I thought you were talking about building a house with a room in it for a sawmill.  :D
Kind of like Building a house with a swimming pool or sauna, etc. 
On second thought, there are probably a few guys on here that do have one in their house....
Change is hard....
Especially when a jar full of it falls off the top shelf and hits your head!

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