Blades Jumping off the Wheels

[Stephen1]

I picked up an older Norwood (Silvacraft) with a 10 horse tecumseh. I spent some money on new parts  and had it cutting pretty well. the blade started stalling in the old dry pine I am cutting. I am using water with antifreeze, I tightened the belt to the motor , now the blade is jumping of the wheels. I readjusted the wheels so they are both even, readjusted the guides, the blade is jumping off the front of the wheels and guides.
What am I missing?

[Nate Surveyor]

Missing? Missing a Peterson Swingmill! :D :D :D I've never had mine jump off! ;D ;D

Happy New Year.

Nate

[Bibbyman]

Are the wheels solid or they V-belt type?

If they're solid,  maybe they need re-crowned.  I've no experience with solid band wheels so  I'm just offering a guess.

[pineywoods]

MY guess would be the blade is slipping on the wheel. Not enough tension , dull blade, pushing into the log too hard.

[Stephen1]

Thanks Nate ;D  Happy New Years to you also!
Bibbyman , a v-belt runs from the motor to the wheel and blade runs on top of the belt. even when I am mounting the blade and turning the wheels by hand as I tension the blade, it is working its way forward, off of the wheels.
Pineywoods, I put on a new blade, tensioned the motor belt, and now have the blades coming off the front.

Happy New Years to all!

[pineywoods]

If itgets worse when you put more tension on the blade, look for bad bearings in the idler wheel.  been there

[ADAMINMO]

Depending on how old the machine is and how much it has been used you may need to change both belts.( the one on the idler wheel and the drive belt.)They may be wore enough that there is no crown or hump on the belt that the blade runs on.The hump creates a crown that allows you to track the blade.You may want to check that.

[dad2nine]

Time to either rotate the B57's or replace them? Only time I have a band jump off is when I try and cut in reverse, now just how did that dog jump up there right in the way of my cut anyways?  :

[Stephen1]

Adimino, I will change out the belts, I do not know how old they are, but they definitely are not new

Time to either rotate the B57's or replace them?

dad2nine  - What are the B57's ?

[mburrow]

on my mill I can not run the band wheels perfit in line my drive wheel is 1/16 different measured from the inside to the outside and the undriven wheel is 1/8 different. I use the same spoke on the wheel to measure by turning it half way around. by adjusting the toein or toeout on your band wheels you should be able to get the band to stay on without the guides.

[dad2nine]

B57 is a bomber :D No it's the belt on my WM that sits inbetween the band and band wheels. They need to be changed out every so often when worn or I started having tracking problems. I usally rotate them as the drive (engine) side get far more wear than the idle side. once both are wore out I replace them before they become so worn I have tracking problems. I consider it part of routine maintance...

Link ----> http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/5L600

Thanks

[Furby]

Shephen, do you have the book for that mill?
Is there any build up of sawdust on the outside of the belts or inside the belts in the V groove of the wheel?
I get a little build up and simply scrap it off with a knife or screwdriver.

[ljmathias]

Sure sounds like bearings to me- like the man said, I've been there and done that (twice in fact) and bought the tee-shirt and both sets of bearings.  First real clue I had that my bearings were the culprit is when, on the third try to get the blade to stay on and finish cutting out the board I was working on, ball bearings started falling out the side.... duh!  I don't know how hard it is to "wiggle" test your blade wheels but I'd do that first and hardest.  Good luck!

Lj

[Furby]

It's actually pretty easy on that mill.
Are the brass washers worn at all?

[Robert Long]

Stephen1

Contact Norwood :P

Robert

[gharlan]

Stephen1 I too have a norwood and had some trouble with the blade jumping off the front. I finally adjusted my wheels with a band on and turning it by hand. I watched as I turned and the blade walked. I kept toeing in the wheels till it ran true right where I wanted it to about one eighth off the guides. I have not had any trouble since. The wheels do not really run in line with the blade. Hope this helps --good luck and happy sawing----gary

[woodbowl]

If itgets worse when you put more tension on the blade, look for bad bearings in the idler wheel.  been there

Sure sounds like bearings to me- like the man said, I've been there and done that (twice in fact)

I third the motion on the bearings. It has happened to me several times. An old and new bearing sitting side by side is hard to tell difference. Wiggle the pully and note how much play is showing up.  Check the pully housing too. I've had to get a new pully because it wallowed to the point that the bearing was a loose fit. It doesn't take much. The blade just can't stay on in these conditions.

[LeeB]

I say try the belts first. Easy enough to get an idea by looking at them. If they're anywhere near flush to the wheel they're worn out. I,ve suffered from both ailments on a different brand mill.

[ely]

if i turn the bandwheels by hand before the tension is up to where it needs to be, the band will walk around pretty bad. if i get the tension i need on it first the band settles in and tracks just right every time.

not sure if it would walk alll the way off the front though.

[barbender]

I used to squirt my blade with a diesel/bar oil mix to lube the blade and cut pitch. I discovered it was making the blades jump off. Decreases the friction to the point that it is less than the tracking exerts. If you are using regular antifreeze (green) that stuff is a bit slimy, maybe doing the same thing. Make sure your wheels are clean and dry and try running it without lube once.

[ladylake]

How cold is it? I've used windshield washer fluid mixed with water that would run through the tube ok but freeze on the wheels. The blade would come off barely turning.  I switched to diesel in the cold now, just a drop every 5 seconds around 1 gallon in a good day will do. It's a lot cheaper than 5 gallons of washer fluid, the only trouble is it smells.  Steve

[Stephen1]

OK guys, here is where I am. The drive wheel had some play in the bearing. The free wheel was falling off, it was half way off the bearing. The belts are a little worn. The belt pulley on the motor has a little play in it. I am going out on Monday to pick up new bearings and belts. I am not sure about the belt pulley on the motor as it has no bearing, just a brass housing it spins on, I do not know if I need a new one, but I am going to take it to a small engine place I use all the time and see what the boys there think. The clutch or shoes in it seem fine. the only  question I have for it is, the blade did not stop  moving when the engine returned to idle. The blade was always going and I had to be conscious off that.

Thanks everyone for their input, and I will post some pictures later in the week when I get cutting again.

[Furby]

Yes, mine don't always fully release/stop spinning at idle either.
If the bearings were falling out, I assume your brass washers were totally gone?

[Stephen1]

Hi Furby, the brass washers were there, in reasonable shape, but the bearing on the idler side were the ones half out of the wheel,( I am trying to figure that out also) I will install the new bearings tomorrow, I hope, and will see what happens with  the brass washers.

[Furby]

Guess I'd have to go look at mine again.
I replaced the brass washers and the lock collars that holds things in place, didn't cost that much, but wasn't cheap either. I really didn't need to replace them, but did anyways as there was some wear on some of the washers.
Motion Industries is where I got my parts.