Big grapple skidder question

[killamplanes]

Well I have had a great little 440 cable skidder for years. But have really found the need for a grapple skidder for long runs to a landing. I think the 440 is great for selective cuts. But on clear cuts on field edges and along creeks where it's a matter of getting alot of wood moved and damage to timber is not in question I think the grapple skidder shines. I don't have to have a winch on it either. I've always went jd but wow, 20k doesn't get much. Though tree farmer are cheap. They any good say c6, i here franklin parts are tuff, maybe I'm dreamin for the $. I just want a brute that can pull alot of wood and not break down. Is this possible...

[mills]

I just finished a job like you described, and my old Cat was doing some roaring. Like you said, open fields and clear cuts are where the grapple machines shine. But they also work well in select cutting if you take your time, and discipline yourself to use the winch when needed. Especially for a one man operation when you can make another turn with a grapple in the same time it takes to hook the cables. The problem is finding an older grapple machine that isn't worn out. I like the 518 I have, and it does a good job, but I don't have a lot of experience with other grapple machines. Good luck.

[Spartan]

I run an old TJ 450 cable skidder.

I would love a TJ 380 with a dual function grapple and a cummins 6BT.  That would be my machine.

[BargeMonkey]

 Grapple skidders can be funny with pricing, and usually you get what you pay for. I've had 2 diff dual arch Jack's, 450C + 460C and they are both animals, fast but they can be big on maintenance and love fuel, I'm easy 30 gal a day not pushing it. I've seen alot of nice machines in go to the woods shape for 30-40k. My winch rarely gets used, if your keeping your 440 it's just something else to break. As much as I love deere iron if I went with another grapple it would be a cat or tigercat and something 535-620 size, they move alot of wood quick.

[Riwaka]

Almost everything breaks down at some time so you have to be prepared for when that happens.
https://www.deere.com/en_US/docs/non_current/skidders/440A%20cable%20skidder.pdf  (which model 440?)
Probably better to stay with a cable skidder, maybe get a heavier, more powerful one to reduce the trip time for the landing route. With a cable skidder you can winch the logs across mud when there is insufficient traction for a grapple skidder to haul loaded.
Check you environmental rules are not changing, you might need a forwarder/ logging trailer to carry logs to the landing rather dragging logs along the ground.

[killamplanes]

Mines an old 440a. Bought from original owners son. Paid a premium but really been a good one. And yes lots of maintenance and parts to keep abusing them in the timber. And I agree I always look for that great deal but seems when u go look at somethin it's priced for what it is. Funny how that works..

[quilbilly]

I've got a c7f . Electrical issues are a pain but it will out pull that 440 no problem. 6bt motor powershift transmission. I really like it over the cable skidder, it's more comfortable, better stability and better traction. If you get stuck in the mud you can push yourself with the boom and scoot forward. I doubt the fuel difference is really that much if you look at gallons per ton of wood to the landing. Also you're saving much time.

[BargeMonkey]

 Around here in select cut good large HW on a decent skid a cable skidder will out perform a big grapple if your not working behind a buncher, yes they are safer, your not beat to death at the end of the day as nad. I watch some of these videos of "big operations" coming out with 3-4 average sticks behind a 648H and being an owner I would blow a cork. Honestly yeah a grapple is nice, I wouldn't buy a single arch, that's my biggest recommendation, that dual arch will do alot more than you think, push, reach, pile.

[tj240]

for the money i would go with an older 648, they work great and are fast, spendy to fix. Or look for an older model TJ, that is not all electric, but make sure there is an accumulator to keep pressure on the grapple. Good luck

[killamplanes]

I'm not grapple smart accumulator on grapple?? Meaning there's constant pinch? Been around 548 and 648 from a distance..

[snowstorm]

think of it as a big hydraulic spring.   

[BargeMonkey]

I'm not grapple smart accumulator on grapple?? Meaning there's constant pinch? Been around 548 and 648 from a distance..

My 450C didn't have a lock, my 460C you push the handle detent and the grapple keeps squeezing tighter all the time, as you turn corners your drag will loosen up and it gets real irritating when you realize the drag is behind you in a pile that's shaped like pick up sticks 😂 biggest thing is learning how to set your hitches up right, and cross your wood when bunching, and all depends on the size of your logs. The Esco I have likes tall narrow piles, alot of the newer grapples aren't as fussy I guess. Another local guy has a 548E and for what he drags versus the fuel he burns I think he should go back to a horse 😂 I know the 648-460-525 look huge but mine is pretty nimble and goes places a 440 would be flopped over and walks out with 6-8-10 sometimes.

[AlexHart]

I fear if 20,000 is really the budget limit we're looking at a 648D or 518 dual arch with no winch type machine.  Not that there is anything wrong with that but 30-40K is probably starts to open a lot more options.   

I used to haul for a fellow in Mass that had a rough go during the 2007 recession and kind of had to start over from scratch and found a 648E dual arch/no winch for like 26K.   Honestly I don't know how many jobs and probably literally millions of feet he pulled with that thing and I believe he's still got it.   It broke every once in awhile but looking back it did a heck of a lot better for him than the big fancy 8 wheel state of the art forwarder and whatever else we had before 2007 happened. 

[longtime lurker]

All I can tell you is what you already know.

You'll get what you pay for, sometimes more, sometimes less. And for sure two months after you finally buy something the perfect machine will come along at a bargain basement price.

Time is money. And everytime I work beside a grapple I know he's shifting more wood at lower cost then my cable machines can. Save enough time and the extra money you'll pay for the machine and diesel becomes irrelevant. Here we're all big single stick hauls, and sometimes only half a stick and maybe that changes it a little but a grapple has picked up that log and is halfway to the landing before I can get a choke around the thing.

I've been looking for a 667/F67 dual arch. Eminently rebuildable and near indestructible anyway... So long as the frame is good I'll bring her back to new 1 major component at a time.

[treeslayer2003]

All I can tell you is what you already know.

You'll get what you pay for, sometimes more, sometimes less. And for sure two months after you finally buy something the perfect machine will come along at a bargain basement price.

Time is money. And everytime I work beside a grapple I know he's shifting more wood at lower cost then my cable machines can. Save enough time and the extra money you'll pay for the machine and diesel becomes irrelevant. Here we're all big single stick hauls, and sometimes only half a stick and maybe that changes it a little but a grapple has picked up that log and is halfway to the landing before I can get a choke around the thing.

I've been looking for a 667/F67 dual arch. Eminently rebuildable and near indestructible anyway... So long as the frame is good I'll bring her back to new 1 major component at a time.

thats the kind of work i do and the same skidder i'd like to have. they seem to hold their value.. i sure will have a DA next time no matter what brand. i wonder about a later 450 tj DA, seems to look comparable.

[Duramax3500]

I like to put a chain and binder around skids with my old Treefarmer, I pull a lot of aspen and with the bark coming off this time of year it seems to work great, I get about a dozen 10" poles on a skid, and with the chain binder once you get rolling  you can stop and rechain if it gets tighter,I've found it better than having to go back and pickup sticks, I do a lot of right away clearing with long runs, just a thought!