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Managing a small hardwood lot?

Started by scgargoyle, December 02, 2014, 12:25:49 PM

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scgargoyle

I have about 5 acres of mixed hardwoods here in upstate SC. Trees range up to 24" DBH, and species include white oak, red oak, poplar, maple, hickory, and a few others. I'd like to thin it out to let the mature trees develop a bigger canopy, and keep it under control on the lower levels. It would open up my winter view of the mountains, too. Is there a science to this? Is it better to thin in stages, or just clear it all out? I have a lot of 6" or less tall skinny trees trying to fill in between the bigger trees. I figured I'd spend my winters cutting some of these out and hauling them up the hill for firewood. Luckily, i don't have much brush, vines, or kudzu, and I'd like to keep it that way. Any recommendations?
I hope my ship comes in before the dock rots!

curdog

A lot of variables in this. To release the poplar you will need to open it up to just about or to full sun. The oaks open it up to 30-40% sunlight. Maple is shade tolerant but will do fine in the sun. If the oaks have too much sun they will epicormic branch and get limby. The more sunlight the more of a problem you will have with brush or many invasives. Also are the small trees really younger or are they older trees that just haven't cut it so far. This can be due to suppression from surrounding  trees, they may be growing on top of a rock or other site issues or poor genetics. Releasing old trees that aren't making it won't buy you much, but if they are younger you can set the stage for a renewable forest.

luvmexfood

I would check with the state forestry division. Not sure but think here in Virginia if your wanting advice on how to best manage forest land they will come out and look it over and give you advice.

Course it's free advice but if you get a good one and explain your goals and then go from there. If you don't like what he recommends you don't have to do it and all you will have in it is a little time.
Give me a new saw chain and I can find you a rock in a heartbeat.

Clark

I think you have an ambitious but very worthwhile project on your hands. With some sweat equity you can improve that stand immensely, have "free" firewood (or lumber) and be able to see (or show others) the fruits of your labors.

You asked if there is science to this process of deciding how many trees and which ones to take? Of course there is! That is the foundation of forestry. With that said I would second the other opinions and recommend getting an opinion from a forester.

One thing that I would keep in mind is that there are many species of trees that grow in your forest but there are probably only a handful that grow really well. Not to say that they grow the fastest but that they produce the best formed tree in your forest. Due to soils, climate and precipitation different species grow better in one area or another. I would find out what species do best in your area and try to release those trees by cutting the species that don't do well.

Since you have the ambition to cut and you're living on the property I would not suggest clearcutting the whole thing. While there are species that do best under those situations, you can work with those species already in your woods, continue to have a forest and improve the quality of the forest while actively managing it.

Clark
SAF Certified Forester

scgargoyle

I'll have to look into getting a forester to come out. The large trees are mostly white and red oaks, and that is what I would prefer. My ambition is not so much generating good timber as it is to have a more open, park-like effect, but still fully shaded. From cutting we did for the house area, the largest trees are about 75 years old- will trees that age still release?

Sadly, I've lost a number of red oaks to what I was told is oak decline. We had on-and-off drought here for many years. In 2013, we had almost double our normal rainfall, and the red oaks don't seem to be losing any more limbs since then. I'm not sure if the disease has stopped, or merely slowed down. There are enough white oaks to take their place, eventually. Some of the poplars don't look too happy either, with small stunted leaves that fall very early.
I hope my ship comes in before the dock rots!

WDH

If you remove the small saplings and the suppressed understory trees, you should be fine.  Treat the cut stumps with herbicide if you want to keep them from re-sprouting. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

mesquite buckeye

Sounds more like a landscaping issue than a forest management issue. Not saying that is a problem, but I think it is good to realize that is what you are doing. That more open feel is a nice look, I would agree. Please realize that those oaks, especially the red oaks won't live forever, and you will be seeing some dead snags in your future. Trees with dead branches are on their way out, and if you do wish to get some lumber from them, it will be degrading each year as the rot and borers work them over.

It is nice to have big trees. It would be even better to have big healthy trees, which sounds like lots of yours are not. :-\
Manage 80 acre tree farm in central Missouri and Mesquite timber and about a gozillion saguaros in Arizona.

CJennings

Large dead trees aren't all bad if you want some wildlife around. But if you want a healthy forest you need to think long term. Think about what will replace the older trees as they eventually die. If you have shade tolerant trees coming up (i.e., maples) and those are your skinny 6" diameter trees, they may fill in the gaps, and aren't necessarily something that should be cut. A truly suppressed tree that will never grow good should be cut. If you cut out all of those young trees you may not get what you're looking for when the oaks die. Don't put all your eggs in one basket, especially if you have already lost some of those oaks. Someone on the ground (a forester) needs to sort out what you have.

WDH

@scgargoyle,

My wife and I have done a similar thing to what you want to do.  Over the years, we have cleaned the understory using herbicide, and sometimes felling the small stuff with a brush cutter or chainsaw and then spraying the cut stump to prevent re-sprouting.

This pic was taken about a week and a half ago in front of my house.  That is my driveway in the foreground. 



  

Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

WmFritz

Danny, the work your wife and you have done is paying dividends. That looks great.
~Bill

2012 Homebuilt Bandmill
1959 Detroit built Ferguson TO35

thecfarm

Here's one that I have worked on for years. Nothing like what WDH has. But I just wanted the look. I have seen a few more that need to be thined out.



 

This is one side of the driveway. The other side is a field. I mow it with a push mower once or twice a year now.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

scgargoyle

WDH- That's it exactly! Nice work!

I have a lot of situations with too many of the same species crowding each other, such as tall skinny white oaks that are only 8-10' apart. I'd like to take groups like that and thin the less desirable specimens, leaving one to release. For some reason, many of the smaller trees have two trunks coming almost from the ground, like the one with the dog in WDH's pic. Maybe these were cut at some point and resprouted? I'm also assuming a single trunk is better than those doubles. A single looks better, at any rate.

There's just so much I can do. I'm 61 years old, so I can see the point where the body just won't be able anymore. We have a program at our church where the men's group harvests firewood every fall for families too poor for heat. If I drag the usable portions up the hill, the guys will cut them up and put them to good use.

The only trees I see not out-living me are the red oaks, and they now only represent about 15%, where they used to be more like 30% before they started dying. I'm also trying to diversify, having planted a few other species here and there. My tiny little beech tree, for example has more than doubled since I planted it 3 years ago.

Another question- If I remove a number of oaks, leaving one to release, is it at more risk from wind damage? I'm surprised how many trees come down in this area. Heavy rain softens up the clay, and they just fall over, roots and all. Right now, my trees sort of hold each other up, so I haven't been losing any, but i see them all the time driving around.
I hope my ship comes in before the dock rots!

WDH

I believe that there is a difference in a thinning versus cleaning out the understory.  In a thinning, some overstory trees are removed to allow more space for those remaining.  This opens the canopy more, allowing light to get to the forest floor.  This light will stimulate other plants to grow there, including some grasses, weeds, and trees. 

Cleaning the understory for aesthetics means not opening the canopy so that there will not be a flush of new plants that will defeat the purpose of cleaning the understory in the first place.

Even one if perfectly fine.  The thinning will benefit the stand more, for sure.
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

g_man

I really like the looks of those cleaned areas WDH and Ray. Very nice !

Banjo picker

Quote from: scgargoyle on December 03, 2014, 06:21:06 AM
. From cutting we did for the house area, the largest trees are about 75 years old- will trees that age still release?

I have no formal schooling on forestry, but I will go out on a limb here and say probably not.  Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

Clark

Quote from: Banjo picker on December 04, 2014, 09:38:18 PM
Quote from: scgargoyle on December 03, 2014, 06:21:06 AM
. From cutting we did for the house area, the largest trees are about 75 years old- will trees that age still release?

I have no formal schooling on forestry, but I will go out on a limb here and say probably not.  Banjo

Really depends on the species and how long or how much suppression it has been under. If the canopy is receiving at least some full sun light and it is a species that lives notably longer than 75 then it should respond to the release.

Clark
SAF Certified Forester

scgargoyle

Pretty much all of the trees are at the canopy level, which is why the skinny ones are so skinny. There are of course some very small trees in the understory, as well as typical understory trees such as dogwood. I would say that most of the trees of any size are oaks- a lot of white oak, and the surviving red oaks.

Whatever I remove, it will at least temporarily leave holes in the canopy, and thus sun will reach the ground. I imagine these areas will need more maintenance to keep the brush and vines at bay. I'm hoping that the remaining trees will then develop a wider canopy. Is this likely?
I hope my ship comes in before the dock rots!

WDH

Yes, the crowns of the remaining trees will take up the free space if they are healthy. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Phorester


You've briefly mentioned an important element in deciding what to do here, and that is the soil.  Soil type will determine what trees will do the best here for healthy long term growth.

As has been mentioned, and with your replies to the pictures posted by others, with 5 acres I suspect you are looking at a landscaping endeavor and not forest management.

I'd see if you could get that SC forester out there for a look-see.  I have that job in Virginia, and I routinely provide this service for small acreages since our local consulting foresters usually are not interested in small properties. However, depending on the detail the landowner wants, we might charge for this service. He should be able to advise you on what trees to keep.

scgargoyle

Thanks for all of the advice! I'll see if I can get someone to look at it. I'm overdue for a soil test, too. I have two very different soils. We are on a ridge, with the south slope being very hard, poor clay soil, and the north side (where the hardwoods are) being a nice loamy soil that drains reasonably well for clay soil. The south slope had been all Virginia Pines in a crowded, sickly thicket. We cleared it, and it has gradually turned into a lawn of sorts that I bush hog a few times a year. You need a jackhammer to dig there! The good news is that it is a very small percentage of our property, and it makes a good hard base for the gravel driveway.
I hope my ship comes in before the dock rots!

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