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Oregon forestry co. reportedly hiring immigrant forestry workers..

Started by chain, October 24, 2011, 08:03:16 AM

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chain

..with stimulus money....according to Fox News.......what's new?

Bandmill Bandit

Its the price you have to pay the locals that have little or no work ethic.

Provincial minimum wage here is $9.50. The local fast food joints were having to pay 12 to 15 to get LAZY, show up about half the time school kids to work at all.

A few of franchise owners got together and made application under the provincial governments seasonal/foreign workers program and brought in a bunch of top notch Philippine workers to fill those jobs. this year ALL of the fast food joints and a few of the restaurants have joined the program.  What a difference. The restaurants are clean again.  Service is awesome and these people treat you with dignity and respect and they deserve and receive nothing less for the most part.

Now the parents are screaming that there is now work for their kids. There is work for the ones that want to work but not for the ones that want a pay check for sitting on the butt watching customers wait for service.

 
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

Jeff

Immigrant, or Illegal Immigrant?  There is a difference.

I can see however, this topic will probably end up being discussed in the restricted board. We'll see.
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mad murdock

There was coverage of this story on the local talk shows.  Many of the contract forestry crews are east european, or from south of the border.  They are hard workers.  Hard to get a gringo to work that hard.  Not saying that there aren't any hard working americans to b found, but they are getting harder to find these days.  Why work when you can collect unemployment for up to 99 weeks or longer!  The problem is multi faceted, and it will not be solved easily.  For starters, states could roll back on the labor laws, and let kids begin working at 12 yrs old.  In Oregon you can't get a job until you are 16.  A lot of entry level jobs in many industries here are held by esa (english second language) workers.  I do agree with Jeff's sentiment-I am all for immigration as long as it is legal immigration!
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zopi

The american dream is not getting rich, it is having enough, and maybe a little more, a dignified career...a stable family life....dunno about you guys...but my ancestors were immigrants...came here and busted hump to carve a niche...just different niches, and different humps...
Buncha guys in my field,immigrants, some undercut me, and work harder...but I bet my customers are happier...I do not begrudge them...if what I am doing does not work out...there is always something for a guy willing to work.
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chain

Actually, employing immigrants has been going on for a long time such as when the Transcontinental RR was contructed shortly after America's Civil War in late 1860's. The Central Pacific RR heading East was in critical need of labor, at the time the "Coolie Slave Trade" was active and thousands of hard-working Chinese peasants joined the work force for the RR. Consequently, the Union Pacific [heading west] workers came mostly from America's Civil War Vets, both Blue and Gray worked side by side along with many Irish immigrants.

I think maybe the point of the Oregon forestry company's hiring of immigrants was controversial because of our tax supported stimulus monies, you would think the priority  would be the resident forestry workers unemployed in Oregon hit with hard times.

jueston

Quote from: zopi on October 24, 2011, 05:09:42 PM
my ancestors were immigrants...

unless your 100% native, all our ancestors were immigrants if your in america, so I see a certain hypocrisy in people who think we should close up the borders, I am all about immigration, they just need to pay taxes, play by the rules, not be criminals, I don't think that's too much to ask.

I live in mn and every roofing crew around here is our friends from down south, most don't even speak English. They can do it cheaper, and faster, and they don't whine about their union rights when they need to finish up the work after 5 or on the weekends.

There are some historical examples of what happens when a society doesn't have enough laborers and low paid, unskilled/semi-skilled workers, it becomes a huge drag on the whole economy. When the Berlin wall went up, most of berlins lower income workers ended up in East Berlin, West Berlin invited any Turk that wanted to a job a come on up, they filled the countries need and the economy benefited.  Now the Germans have decided they don't like the Turks anymore and there is lots of racial tension. 

Bandmill Bandit

What I find interesting is taht the underlying principle is not unique to any one race or culture.

ENTITLEMENT

When a society reaches a point where ALL of it citizens feel that THEY are entitled to EVERYTHING, that society gets transitioned out of the very society that THEY think the are entitled to including the country that they believe they are entitled to.

The american Revolution was the battle against the entitlement of the British Empire and actually allowed that empire to survive the first yet another round of entitlement thinking.

they are very near that point again as is much of the western world THe USA and Canada being at the front of that pack. Will we survive? those of us that are over 50 probably wont have to worry much about it but those at 30 will not only see it they will have rebuild from and I am not sure they have the skills and stomach to do the job because they are to far removed from the reality and experience of world war II. this continent has been spared the atrocities of a full out military conflict but I fear that it will not always remain so. History could very well show World war II to be but a very insignificant preamble to what could be come a reality on this continent in the next 30 to 50 years. 

Too many things that were present in Europe in the first 40 years of the 20 th century are very present and much more fully developed because of technology, here on this continent.

I fear for the future of our country's and our children

   

Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

zopi

Jueston...that was pretty much my point, even if I was being a little flip...my thirteenth great grandfather owned two hundred acres about eight miles from where I live today...in 1638...he busted hump to get ahead...heck...to stay alive...his great, great, great grandson was one of the riches men in southern misouri...and one of the original land grantors at columbia university...they showed up, and over generations carved out their own piece of history...I have alot of native blood...but even they were immigrants...they just got here first...
Got Wood?
LT-15G GO chassis added.
WM sharpener and setter
And lots of junk.

edkemper

The division of rich and poor is the problem. Always has, always will be. The greater the divide the greater the discontent. We have gone from a three tier system, the rich, middle class and poor, to the rich and the poor. If we want to look back, why was it we stole this country from england? The rich, collecting taxes and telling the rest how to live with what they have. No voice in the system.

We've gone from a world leading country to a country that has been instrumental in bringing down the world's banking system that we then have to pay to prop up. Then, the ultra rich don't participate in paying for the bailout. But the money tends to end up in their pockets in the end.

You don't find the best of the best in D.C. or on Wall Street. 8)
Old Man

jueston

i think bandmill bandit has it right, a great change is coming, i look at greece and i wonder how long before a U.S. politician finally says that the hand outs are over, and the mobs take to the streets demanding what is "rightfully thiers".... we have created a state which is unsustainable, and its only a matter of time...

i hear a lot of people complain about the bankers and how they are the problem... it was the government who garenteed the subprime mortgages and it was the government who FORCED the banks to make the bad loans. and then it was government who bailed out the banks when the bad mortgages failed.... the bankers made a profit, there is no disputing that, but i think they profited off a bad situation, they didn't create the situation.

this thread is doomed for the restricted area....

Bandmill Bandit

May be some definitions are in order?

Is "rich" different than wealthy?

What in reality, is  "poor"?

can and are poor people in reality the wealthy ones in many situations?

If 1% of the world population are considered to be ultra rich then how is it that the middle class is shrinking since the ultra rich number was very near 6% 150 years ago?

When a country like Canada calculates the poverty line income at $21,666 (2007) before tax income as the poverty cut off, which is 47 times higher ($1.25/ day) than the world bank figure for the entire planet what does that say about our society?

How much of the wealth generated in the world is a result of the economic impact of the continual investments and asset holdings of the 1% group called the ultra rich?

How does increasing tax on 1% of the population level a playing field when that 1% are providing most of the jobs for the other 99%?

Is it possible that our current attitude of entitlement has skewed the view of what "middle class" really is to the point where we think we are poverty stricken if we cant afford a new car every 2 years?

I could go on for a while yet! Lets hear from a few others though.

Most of the people that did not survive the 2 world wars were the ones that thought they were the most entitled ones. Most of those were not the ultra rich either. I dont know of a single "old money family that did not survive the 2 world wars save the russian royal family "the Romanov family" and their death was execution/murder by the Communists/socialist liberals of that time period.

Is 25 ish years since the fall of that horrible system so long that we can't remember how terrible it was? And most of us didn't even have to live under it, only with it on the planet.

Like I said I fear for our Youth and their refusal to see the reality of history because they have not experienced it.    

 
Skilled Master Sawyer. "Skilled labour don't come cheap. Cheap labour dont come skilled!
2018 F150 FX4, Husqvarna 340, 2 Logright 36 inch cant hooks and a bunch of stuff I built myself

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