Welding on a tire rim

T Red · March 02, 2010, 04:04:53 PM

I'm sure we all know not to. This is an interesting video as to what happens. I had no idea.

The delay on heavy equipment tires is surprising. Worth a watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBUVzgCHHuA&feature=player_embedded#

T Red · March 02, 2010, 04:16:29 PM

For those of you with dial up here's what happens.

They only welded on the rim for a few seconds. A chemical reaction takes place in the actual walls of the tire after heat is applied called pyrolysis. For a period of about 2 minutes the inside of the tire heated up, 500+ degrees F, and the pressure increased just as dramatically. This reaction continues and degrades the walls of the tire. Eventually it explodes due to the pressure and weaken walls.

On heavy equipment tires it has taken 20+ hours after the initial heating for the explosion to occur.

Qweaver · March 02, 2010, 04:49:27 PM

Watch a car race and notice that the brake discs glow red hot. Red heat = about 1200 deg F. I've run several races that went to after sunset and I could see my brakes glowing red. I wonder why we don't get the same thing happening? I sure would not weld on a mounted tire rim after watching that.

beenthere · March 02, 2010, 06:27:51 PM

Hmmm? Seems to be in the same category as heating a can of beans with the lid still in place. ;D ;D

D Hagens · March 02, 2010, 07:31:14 PM

Quote from: beenthere on March 02, 2010, 06:27:51 PM
Hmmm? Seems to be in the same category as heating a can of beans with the lid still in place. ;D ;D

So I take I wasn't the only one that did this as a kid. :D

Slabs · March 02, 2010, 07:48:05 PM

Quote from: D Hagens on March 02, 2010, 07:31:14 PM
Quote from: beenthere on March 02, 2010, 06:27:51 PM
Hmmm? Seems to be in the same category as heating a can of beans with the lid still in place. ;D ;D

So I take I wasn't the only one that did this as a kid. :D

Yep. Them hot beans can also be classified as shrapnel.

zopi · March 02, 2010, 08:14:21 PM

Quote from: beenthere on March 02, 2010, 06:27:51 PM
Hmmm? Seems to be in the same category as heating a can of beans with the lid still in place. ;D ;D

Saw a dude heat beenie weenies in the rod oven once..when he opened the can all those angry little legumes jumped out and whooped him....little bean shaped burns all over his face....:D

Coon · March 03, 2010, 08:57:43 PM

Last fall we had a guy in the field next to us go under an overhead powerline with a tractor and grain cart. He was heading over to the combine to top off his load of grain and all of a sudden BOOM al of the tires on both the tractor and grain cart blew along with grain flying in every direction. It was investigated and found the powerline arc'd the grain cart due to being too close to the line. The operator ended up in the hospital due to shocking of nervous system. He was observed and is ok. The power company was sued for all damages as it was also found that the powerline did not meet the minimum height requirements.

Brad.

footer · March 03, 2010, 10:39:14 PM

You want to hear a good one. I worked about 16 years in industrial maintenance with a lot of heavy equipment, and more recently, 3 years as a tractor technician for a trucking company where I got a "michelin north america, truck tire technician" certification, and with over 20 years of working directly with heavy equipment and truck tires, this is the first time i have heard of this.

Ianab · March 03, 2010, 11:00:02 PM

I think thats what happens to airliners when they have to brake hard in an emergency. Over heats the brakes, they stop OK, then the tyres blow out from the heat.

Ian

CLL · March 03, 2010, 11:40:37 PM

Seen a guy in Vietnam heat a can of ham and lima beans with a little piece of c-4, everyone around him got to taste the beans.

dovetails · March 05, 2010, 04:46:30 AM

Well that explains why 6 of the 8 tires on the truck crane I was running went POW when the boom brushed the overhead power line! Didn't feel a thing,would not have known what happened if another worker hadn't noticed the power line swaying.
Good thing the outriggers were down,or it would have been on it's side.

Stan snider · March 05, 2010, 10:17:17 PM

Footer, I'm the same as you. I had no idea this could happen and am far from a novice repairman. I have been aware of the power line contact blowing tires but figured it was arcing to ground. That was a very good post T RED and could have saved someones life. Stan

easymoney · March 06, 2010, 12:44:46 AM

i got a chuckle from some of the comments. will try to rember this if i am ever tempted to weld on a rim with the tire mounted. i can not think of why anyone would do it any way especially if the tire was inflated.

Tom · March 06, 2010, 01:57:36 AM

The times I've seen it done was when a mechanic welded a short length of pipe around the valve stem to protect it from off-road hazards. It was tack welded and I guess the guy just got lucky.

Warbird · March 06, 2010, 02:29:47 AM

Which brings up the question that immediately popped into my mind the first time I saw this: Has this always been the case with tires or is it just newer tires, due to new chemicals/process associated with making tires these days?

dovetails · March 06, 2010, 05:39:54 AM

Quote from: Warbird on March 06, 2010, 02:29:47 AM
Which brings up the question that immediately popped into my mind the first time I saw this: Has this always been the case with tires or is it just newer tires, due to new chemicals/process associated with making tires these days?

In my case it happened about 23 years ago,and the tires were probably about 10 years old at the time, so I would say not just new tires. I have welded up some cracked rims in the past,but never with a tire on them as I welded both inside and outside of the rim to be sure it was solid. Also have welded big washers tocover valve stem holes on tractor rims where they rusted out,again, both sides of the hole,so no tire on the rim at the time.

T Red · March 06, 2010, 08:08:03 AM

Quote from: Stan snider on March 05, 2010, 10:17:17 PM
Footer, I'm the same as you. I had no idea this could happen and am far from a novice repairman.

I'm right there with you. I've worked with, around, and on equipment for the majority of my life and never heard about this. That's why I posted, so get the word out.

Now that it has been mentioned I remember seeing someone weld the pipe around the valve stem at least once with the tire on. The Lord looks after us many times and we don't even know it.

thecfarm · March 06, 2010, 08:35:54 AM

I welded stuff around all of my valve stems.But I had the tire off. I was afraid that I would melt or weaken the tire in that area.

Tim/South · March 06, 2010, 02:39:44 PM

I have also wielded covers to protect the valve stems.
I wonder if breaking the tire down but leaving it on the rim would be enough?

I have simply pulled the service truck up to the tractor, wielded and driven away.

chevytaHOE5674 · March 06, 2010, 03:14:57 PM

I too have welded around the valve stem and other places on a rim. I pull the valve core out and leave it out until the tire and wheel has fully cooled.

Tom · March 06, 2010, 03:29:31 PM

The video is accompanied by a lecture. One of the examples given in the lecture is about one person killed and a helper injured when the dismounted tire exploded. It had the valve core removed and was pulled back from the rim but still hanging in the rim. The heat expanded the air so fast that the tire reseated itself and the core-less valve couldn't vacate the air fast enough. it exploded.

rbarshaw · March 06, 2010, 07:17:40 PM

Here's a good argument for tires inflated with nitrogen, no oxygen, no fire. In hind site it's obvious, heat and compressed air and flamable material in a confined space equals an explosion. I welded on the rims for my first mill with 50# in them and welded for 24" around a plate to mount a shaft to, made several passes, suprised i'm still alive.

Tom · March 06, 2010, 07:53:06 PM

according to that article, nitrogen wouldn't help. The heat starts a chemical reaction in the material of the tire. The tire generates its own heat. Nothing is burning, on the other hand, it is heating without burning.
The explosion is caused by the containment of any gas in the tire, as I understand it.

edwardj_ · March 06, 2010, 08:14:12 PM

hmmmm.... not sure i am happy that i watched this. I work in a motorcycle shop that also deals with argos. I have had a few instances where i have had to use a torch or die grinder/cut off wheel on the lug nuts. I guess I will have to pay more attention next time and only use a grinder and stop and cool it fairly often. Its surprising how many things we do in life only to find out how lucky we were well after we got away with it...

As for the cans of beans... if you insist on heating them up without opening the top of the can there is a "safe" (notice i put quotes to point out some danger still...) way to do it. I have done it many times and have never hurt myself or others with any flying debris. Put a dent in the can... smack it hard on the side and then throw it in the fire, on top of the boiler, exhaust or whatever. when the dent pops pull it off and open it. if ya wait too much longer there is a mess everywhere.

footer · March 07, 2010, 12:28:19 AM

Quote from: edwardj_ on March 06, 2010, 08:14:12 PM
hmmmm.... not sure i am happy that i watched this. I work in a motorcycle shop that also deals with argos. I have had a few instances where i have had to use a torch or die grinder/cut off wheel on the lug nuts. I guess I will have to pay more attention next time and only use a grinder and stop and cool it fairly often. Its surprising how many things we do in life only to find out how lucky we were well after we got away with it...

As for the cans of beans... if you insist on heating them up without opening the top of the can there is a "safe" (notice i put quotes to point out some danger still...) way to do it. I have done it many times and have never hurt myself or others with any flying debris. Put a dent in the can... smack it hard on the side and then throw it in the fire, on top of the boiler, exhaust or whatever. when the dent pops pull it off and open it. if ya wait too much longer there is a mess everywhere.

I work for a major food company that makes canned beans, and other products, and I know for a fact that the beans are cooked in the sealed can, so I know that they can be reheted in the can. That is, as long as the temperature doesnt exceed the temperature that the factory "cooks" them at... ;D...