Impressive Sawyer/Mill - Video

[Cutting Edge]

Some of you may have seen this.  Some, maybe not.  Found this on YouTube and was very impressed.  Thought I would share.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dq6wrqEnqYc&feature=player_detailpage

Think this sawyer is expendable?

[terrifictimbersllc]

 

[JV]

Several things would stop me from ever being this fast; my wrists, arms, shoulders, eyesight, concentration, I could go on.   

[eastberkshirecustoms]

Nice, a cant in 24 seconds! Boy that turner really throws the log around.  Almost makes me miss being around the circle mills.  :(

[beenthere]

That Jeff in that cab? Bet his shoulders ache just watching that. ;)

[Jeff]

Beenthere, donethat.  That's only a 2 headblock carriage. sounds like he was crowding that beech log for the camera.

[Okrafarmer]

Oh my. I wonder what they were doing with the cants after that? If he was that fast, why didn't he just cut them up into boards? Or maybe he was making RR ties?

[Ohio_Bill]

I thought I was a Hot Shot sawing 6 an hour.  I can't even think that fast.

[pnyberg]

That's so fast that it's boring after about 30 seconds.

--Peter

[Okrafarmer]

It was so fast my computer couldn't keep up with the video! 

[Chuck White]

It's always impressed me as to just how fast a circle-saw can be! 

[Sixacresand]

I bet the operator station has AC.  Just think, there are crews or machines working just as fast, feeding and taking wood from this mill.

[WDH]

Thats why you cant ( :) make it as a small guy sawing ties when competing against the big boys.

In the big pine mills with the sharp chains and the curve gang saws, they can saw twelve 16' logs per minute and produce over 60,000 BF per hour.  Our best could produce 1 million BF a day of dimension pine lumber in two shifts.  No way to compete with that. 

Like Cedarman says, find the niche  :D.

[sawguy21]

I assume rr ties. That is some production from a small mill but as WDH suggests, no way anyone could meet demand and be cost effective with such a set up. It would have to be a niche market the big guys don't want to bother with.

[bandmiller2]

That job looks more stressfull than an air trafic controller,I'll stick with my handset thankyou. Frank C.

[Jeff]

That's the job I had for 25 years, and it is the toughest job in the mill and the hardest on the mind and body.  He's probably cutting ties as it looks like hes cutting dense northern hardwoods. He might asl be squaring up to go to a gang or resaw, but looks like ties to me. 

If he was that fast, why didn't he just cut them up into boards?

If you can pass the cant on to a gangsaw that resaws into boards in one pass, think how much faster that is than if he was to saw it himself into boards.

[Shotgun]

Jeff, why don't you put up the link to your sawing videos back in the day.  Good spot for it here.   :D

Norm

[Jeff]

There's not a whole lot of footage of me sawing, and what there is, is pretty bad quality, but there are two clips I have on youtube that I've posted on the forum in the past.  The first one was taken of me sawing, but not really showing the mill. The second one shows a little more mill. This is what I did 8 to 10 hours a day, and for several years an additional 6 hours on Saturdays.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3PftuULqdk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VPJ-Ojha-s

[stavebuyer]

Thats pretty typical of commercial tie mills in TN & KY. He is sawing 7x9 crossties. A two headblock Hurdle mill will cut 400 ties a day. Side lumber is often seen as a "by product" to some of the folks that run these mills.

[Ron Wenrich]

Put a vertical edger on there and your world starts to change. 

[Cutting Edge]

I could imagine how tired a fella would be after a day of that kinda work.  I would think the mental drain would be the worst.  Either way, I know I wouldn't be able to coordinate fingers, arms, eyes, etc. to even run at a snails pace.  If it was me, they'd be lucky to edge out tomato stakes...  :D

Jeff, in the video it appears you had more to do than a pilot...WOW     

[Okrafarmer]

Some peoples' lot in life is to be quick-thinking, quick-acting workers. Unfortunately I'm not one of them.  :(  :-\

[petefrom bearswamp]

Jeff I too noticed the laboring of the mill while sawing the Beech.
that thing goes too fast for me.
Regarding your video,  no grey in your hair back then eh?   

[jueston]

i used to operate an excavator and the joy sticks looked similar, but simplier, and i sure wasn't operating them that fast....
i watched it twice and its just crazy....

[Okrafarmer]

On the other hand, when the way is clear, I do operate a Bobcat almost that fast. I have to be careful or I get whiplash.

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

Hes winding er out for the camera as thats about as quick as you can go  ;) just kick back crank the radio and get into the rythum with the mill and have a good laugh at the talkback announcers  ;) ;D 8) 8)

As afew have said he is loading the saw there is another one on youtube where they have upgraded the hydraulics and head saw motor to 150hp electric on a CMC or Morbark mill and he was twin edging small cedar at about 5 logs a min but you can tell he is getting dang close to hanging the saw   ??? there are limmits to how fast a circ can saw too ;) :D ;D

Regards Chris

[Jeff]

Chris aint talking about me, he's talking about the other guy.  ;)

[Okrafarmer]

Yes, I think what they didn't show us, is there was probably a day a year or two ago when he messed up the blade from running it too fast...

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

Nah Jeff You Got The Gift Mate  ;) :D ;D ;D 8) 8) Orka The Hurdle Sawyer is about bang on on most off the logs Mate  ;) ;D thers only afew cuts where he could have feathered the feed back just a little  ;) I have seen blokes feeding so dang hard that they have had the saw coming an inch outa line at the end of the log on the off bearing side and thats when things get real interesting esp when they take the log past the back off the saw and start the return     as a saw will take the line of least resistance  ??? :P ;) :D :D :D

also Ties or cants where you are not resawing or realy worried about grade or taper is easy going like Jeff and Ron said its only a two knee sawing ties  and put a vert edger on it and and the speed will change  ;)

Regards Chris

[Meadows Miller]

That's so fast that it's boring after about 30 seconds.

--Peter

Peter Come Down South  when Jesi n I get an Auto Meadows one day Ill give you a run  ;) Its not boring    its just about the best fun you can have with your pants on running a Sawmill Flat Stick  Mate  ;) :D :D :D ;D ;D 8) 8)

[BBK]

One of our local guy's has a Hurdle that look pretty much the same. It's an impressive setup but he doesn't run his as hard. Makes my old American look like is in slow motion.

[Axe Handle Hound]

I haven't yet had the chance to tour an active mill like this and have always wondered about who/what makes the decision on how to cut each particular log.  I've seen on TV that in some mills that specialize is 2X building materials there's a computer that decides how to get the most out of each log.  How is it done in a situation like this one?  Is it completely the sawyer's call whether to take another slice off a particular log?  I'm assuming there's some sort of setworks, but does it automatically bring the cant out a particular distance to give offcuts of 1", 2", etc?  Or is that also controlled by the sawyer?  I'm pretty sure I could never think fast enough for this job. 

[dail_h]

That beech log a little bigger, n heda been in trouble. I can do almost that good with my handset Belsaw  ;D ;D ;D "NOT"

[beenthere]

axe handle
Most if not all the decisions are the sawyer. Likely a button to push for thickness and other buttons to get on a run (although looks like he was sawing to a cant size and likely resawing that cant down the line.

[Red Pill]

From the title of the video, I'd say he was sawing cross ties.

[Ron Wenrich]

I haven't yet had the chance to tour an active mill like this and have always wondered about who/what makes the decision on how to cut each particular log.  I've seen on TV that in some mills that specialize is 2X building materials there's a computer that decides how to get the most out of each log.  How is it done in a situation like this one?  Is it completely the sawyer's call whether to take another slice off a particular log?  I'm assuming there's some sort of setworks, but does it automatically bring the cant out a particular distance to give offcuts of 1", 2", etc?  Or is that also controlled by the sawyer?  I'm pretty sure I could never think fast enough for this job.

Right now, I'm sawing red oak.  My cutting orders are for 5/4 F1F & btr, 4/4 3A Com and btr.  Blocking can be 7x9 for 13' and longer, or 8'6", 3½ x 6 - all lengths, and 5¼ x 6 in 8' or 12'.  I also have a vertical edger, so I'm doing the edging as well as the sawing.

At some point, you need to know when to stop sawing and when to put it into blocking.  I always saw to blocking, since it really doesn't pay to chase lower grade material.  You need to figure that out ahead of time.  Ties are going for $440/Mbf, blocking is going for $360/Mbf.  What value do you need on your lumber to breakeven for sawing a tie into boards and a piece of blocking?  Sounds simple enough, but the breakeven value is $14 or about $735/Mbf.  Better not have 1 board that comes out to 2 Com or you'll be making dust at a loss. 

When a log rolls onto the carriage, you have to position it to get your defects on the corners of your boards.  That way you can crop that defect out when you edge.  You also have to be able to read a log so you know when your grade is about to run out.  If my grade is good, I can take a 5/4 board.  If not, then I just cut 4/4.  I watch how my heart is running.  Not all logs are straight.  In our mill, not many are straight.  I have a Silvatech setworks, which regulates my thickness.  I just push a button to get the desired thickness.

When I turn the log, I lay it flat on the headblocks.  I don't like doing it the way the video shows.  Small, straight logs are a lot easier than a big log.  If you don't get it flat against those uprights, your cant will be off.

My second side will be the sawn very similar to the first.  When I get to the 3rd side, I have a pretty good idea on what I'm going to shoot for with blocking.  I also have a pretty good idea what my grade will turn out to be.  My options are to pick a target size - 6", 9" or whatever, then build a stack on the Silvatech.  You punch in the target size, then add all the boards you want to cut by order and thickness. The setworks will automatically come to that point.  Then, you can just hit your set button and you can peel off the boards in that sequence, or you can change the sequence. 

I used to do it with the gauge on board the carriage.  If you notice in the video, there is no gauge on the carriage.  I would bet he's using a computer to get all those sizes in advance.  Push a button and go.

Option 2 is to open up to a 6" face and saw until you are close to your target size.  Then take a shim cut to get down to your target.  That way you are taking your waste to the inside instead of in your slab.  It all depends on the log.

I'm not sawing at the speed this sawyer is going.  With a vertical edger, you can't have your saw waver too much.  If you cut into the log, the edging strips will remain on the board and you get a thick board.  If you cut out of the log, you get a mark on the log from the edger saws and you get a thin board.  When you sell lumber, you want a consistent product, or you won't have many sales. 

When you hear that saw bog down, I've always found that it starts to cut off line.  I always try to maintain the same saw speed from the beginning to the end of the cut.  When you start your cut, you don't want to ram the log into the saw.  You start slow, then build speed once you are in the cut. 

A lot of logs will saw the same way.  But, you have to have a lot of little tricks to get the best grade in the shortest amount of time.  You also have to have a plan B or C when things go either better than expected or worse than expected.

[bandmiller2]

Ron,you must be in a position to get a good look at the logs to make these decisions,do you have a cab or standing out by the saw.? It is said the skill of the sawyer is the profit margin. Frank C.

[Ron Wenrich]

From the outside:



Controls:

We've made improvements to this.  I also control the slab dump.



View from the seat:

[Okrafarmer]

Thanks for sharing, Ron. That is helpful to understand how it all works.

[Chris Burchfield]

Hurdle hosted an annual Forestry meeting in Fayette County a couple of years ago, just East of Memphis.  Father and son's company.  After the meeting they gave a tour of the plant.  The sons had gone to college and their studies enhanced the capabilities of the company.  Good people, good equipment, just a lot bigger mill than I was interested in.  http://www.hurdlemachineworks.com/

[Axe Handle Hound]

Thanks for the explanation Ron.  I've always wondered how that all works.   

[MapleNut]

Larger mills in my area always debark the logs, must not need it down there.