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Logs to saw but can't saw em. Need switch.

Started by Banjo picker, December 29, 2017, 12:01:20 PM

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Banjo picker

Had a man bring in quite a few logs to saw.  Going to make boards and framing lumber out of them.  Put the first one on the mill and made about 4 cuts and the mill just died.  It was a nice big denim pine and the mill head is about 20 inches above the deck.  I start trouble shooting.  Seems to be the switch.  According to Cooks it is a 35327CAV.  I took it off and it does appear to be a Lucas 35327.  Cooks don't stock it.  He suggested I contact Perkins, which I did.  After giving the man at Perkins in Columbus Mississippi the serial number, the build number and taking pictures of the control panel and sending them to him, he told me that was supplied by Tradewinds .  He don't have the part either.  Said that was added after Perkins sold the engine.  I called one of the Tradewinds numbers, and the man took my information and then in about 15 minutes he called me back and said that their outfit was shut down untill Tuesday, Jan. 2 2018.  Oh well .  I have went by the local Carquest with several cross refrence numbers and called Napa as well as a Cat dealer in Tupelo Miss.  Cat ownes Perkins I am told.  They cant cross the number either.  I do a good bit of business on ebay, so I looked there.  You can find plenty of Lucas 35327 swithches there....but they are all in England, and it will take about 2 weeks to get here.  I ordered one, but I would like to get one before that. 

I tinkered around with it some after it quit, an got it to start, but as soon as I turned loose of the key, it died again.  Its almost like there is a kill switch gone haywire. (There are two in different places) ( it also has a bunch of tattle tale safety switches)  There was a terminal on this switch that broke off and makes me think it had a problem .... all the other terminals are good and solid ... you would have to be really trying to break one.  This one just basicly fell off.  Any one have a Lucas 35327 they want to sell? 

Here is the logs (about half of them) that I guess I will cut someday.  Banjo

  

 
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

pine

It is frustrating when things like you describe happen. 
I think it is becoming more common as manufacturers do not maintain their supply lines as they once did. 
I fear that it will only get worse the way things are changing in the supply business.

ladylake

 They use that type of switch on some agriculture equipment and lawn mowers.  Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Peter Drouin

Nice wood, Too bad about the switch, ladylake has a good point,
Tell us more about the truck in the first pix. ;D
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

moodnacreek


Banjo picker

Pine you sure got the frustrating part right.  One thing that really got me wound up was that the switch I took off has no part number on it.  You know what that means... someone bought a box car load of them from a land far far away, and I don't mean England.   ;D  Then after I got the number from Cooks, its pass the buck time.  We didn't put it on....We didn't put it on...

Steve, This switch has 7 pins on it, and the wiring inside the control box where the switch is is loaded with an abundance of wires that go to different places and other switches, so I can't take a chance with something a little different.  The PM I got showed six...so I am scared of it.  It might work, but I cant take a chance.

I do like the hydraulics, but right now the mill is 20 inches up above the bed and I can't get it down until I can get the mill to at least run for a minute or two.   :(  Its already pretty tall, and  I had just started on a nice sized log when it quit.  You could probably rig an electric to come back down to earth.

Peter the truck is a 1957 Chevy.  It belongs to a friend of mine from North Dakota, who can't take the cold anymore.  This is his second winter to spend here on the place.  He pulls the Chevy here inside a 53 ft trailer with a tiny car on top of the bed of the Chevy.  The pull truck is a 1960 KW.  And it looks pretty sharp too.  I wonder if he brought all this cold weather down here with him.  Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

Hilltop366

Seems like some of these switches are not built heavy enough for the load put on them.

Had the same problem with my tractor once, it would run on the start position but when the key was let go to the run position it would stop.

I took the switch apart and it had plastic that had melted over the contact from over heating so I scraped the plastic off and used the switch until the new one came.

Banjo picker

Thats an idea, but this little booger is pressed together in 4 different places with a pretty good indention in each one.  If I try to get it apart to look inside i will probably bust it, and I need it for a pattern to hook up the new one with.  Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

Hilltop366

Mine has a pigtail with a plug on the end so it was easy to replace as far as wiring goes.

I use to draw wire locations out for reassembly when repairing things, now I will take a few pictures before taking things apart.

Banjo picker

I did both. :D  I got to loose the book and my phone to mess up.  Not that I am not capable.  Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

alanh

Can`t help with the switch but was taken by the truck pic, heres mine..

 

47sawdust

From the sound of it ,might be time to buy 2 switches.Most of my equipment is old and I've taken to doing just that,within reason.
Good story about your friend from North Dakota.
Mick
1997 WM Lt30 1999 WM twin blade edger Kubota L3750 Tajfun winchGood Health Work is my hobby.

Hilltop366

Quote from: Banjo picker on December 29, 2017, 02:55:09 PM
I did both. :D  I got to loose the book and my phone to mess up.  Not that I am not capable.  Banjo

Haha, probably not a bad plan.

Banjo picker

That is a very sharp truck you got there.  Vehicles back then had soul.  You could see one coming a quarter of a mile away and know what it was.  Now I need to be 20 feet away to even find my wife's kia.  It looks like a multitude of other small cars.  Its good they have come up with all the weird paint colors, its the only way to tell the difference sometimes.

I will be on the look out for another switch.  I keep a list of items that I could use a spare of for the mill and when I get a chance to pick one up at a bargain. I put it my box at the mill.  I got a relay and a woodward solenoid on the list to go with it.  I keep a small supply of toggle switches and such as well on hand.  Things that I have found will go out and are hard to find in Iuka Mississippi.  Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

Kbeitz

Collector and builder of many things.
Love machine shop work
and Wood work shop work
And now a saw mill work

Oliver05262

Lucas; now there's part of the problem. Joe Lucas, the prince of darkness. Here's a sample of the wit and wisdom concerning Lucas electrical thingamabobbery.
http://www.mossmotoring.com/prince-darkness-joseph-lucas/
and there's more. Just do a Google search.

Get home before dark.
Oliver Durand
"You can't do wrong by doing good"
It's OK to cry.
I never did say goodby to my invisible friend.
"I woke up still not dead again today" Willy
Don't use force-get a bigger hammer.

starmac

It kind of sucks that they would use a switch that is not common and do not stock it either, but I guess that is just business anymore.

On a side note, what does your friend use the truck in the frst pic for?
I have a very similar truck, GMC short nose with a 453 Detroit for power.
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

Alyeska Pete

If you follow Kbeitz's link to Lucas you will find a detailed wiring diagram of the terminal layout. Should not take long to jump around the bad terminal. Depending on which one is bad, you can add a SPST or a momentary on switch externally until your new one arrives.

mike_belben

Does this thing use any contactors or PLC's? 

It sounds like a contactor losing its hold voltage, the way it turns on and kicks out when you let off key.
Praise The Lord

Banjo picker

Thanks for the responses so far.

Kbetiz: I have ordered a switch just like that one you have pictured.  Question for any who can help,  What does the Piercing C F mean on the diagram Kbetiz had on his post?  I think I have the rest of it figured out.

As to Lucas having a bad name....not much you can do about it, as they just about have the market corned on some things.  Seems they might have been on the receiving end of some bad jokes.  I had an MG once and the main thing that it gave trouble with was the hydraulic slave cylinder on the clutch not the electrical, which I would think had a lot of Lucas stuff in.

As to the 57 Chevy truck... I think its kind of like the sawmill in the weeds that the owner just cant part with.  He did use it to pull a trailer that had all his handy man tools in... now he just cranks it up and drives it a little to keep it limbered up.  I haven't seen that he has a real need for it, but don't we all have a few things like that?

Pete, I think you have an AC 36, so you know how many wires are in that control box.  If I had pretty weather and the time, I might give it a try to try and do some by passing.  But after today there is not going to be any decent sawing weather for a week or so at least.  Supposed to be about 11 degrees here Tuesday morning, and cold all week.  My southern blood just can't handle that. 

Mike I can't answer your question cause I just don't know.  Its just a switch with contacts in it or so I would think.  Kbetiz has a picture of the back of the switch in the link of his post. 

Thanks for your interest, I will let you know how things go.  Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

JB Griffin

Banjo, sounds like your gonna have a heat wave, monday morning it's supposed to be 1. :(
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

starmac

Well at this point, I hope it is your switch, some ignition systems have a power source when cranking and another for when the starter kicks out, which is not controlled by the switch itself.
I still think there are plenty of generic off the shelf ignition switches in use, that the engineers did not have to use one that was not a common item for this application.
Old LT40HD, old log truck, old MM forklift, and several huskies.

Banjo picker

JB. I just cant hardly imagine the cold some of these forestry forum members are having to deal with.  I have enough wood at the house to last some of these guys maybe 4 days.  I have an insert that I bought when I first built the house 30 + years ago and it does a fine job for here.  But I cant imagine burning a half cord a day....even if they are talking about a face cord.

Starmac I hope it is the switch as well.  That would fix the problem pretty quick...if I could get my hands on the switch.  :(  I totally agree with the "why use this exact switch"?  If I were more of an electrician, I might be confident enough to try something else, but I am not.  I can see how I could jump a hot wire to the solenoid of the injection pump and alternator then jump the starter, but I dont understand how two kill switches and a circuit breaker come into play as well as two switches that will shut the engine down if the oil pressure is low or the temp is too high.  I don't know if the rpm meter is hooked up to the tateltale switch or not.  There is a whole bunch of wires in that control box.   :o  Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

JB Griffin

Is the throttle electronic?  I wish I could help more but a electrician I ain't.
2000 LT40hyd remote 33hp Kubota with 6gpm hyd unit, 150 Prentice, WM bms250, Suffolk dual tooth setter

Over 3.5million bdft sawn with a Baker Dominator.

Peter Drouin

Banjo, It's -5°F here this morning 75°F+ in the house.
I use 2/ 2½ wheelbarrels fill with wood a day in this cold, Not too bad.
The thing with the cold is the birds and wildlife. I'm feeding 2x a day till it gets up to +20°F
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

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