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Question for tractor trailer drivers

Started by PAmizerman, July 23, 2018, 01:24:25 PM

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PAmizerman

I am working on plans for my new mill sight and was wondering how big of a loop or parking lot is a comfortable size to turn a tractor trailer around in?
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PC-Urban-Sawyer

Well, according to the Willis Brothers, you need 40 acres...

Willis Brothers

Leigh Family Farm

Quick Google search says 100' diameter circle. 
There are no problems; only solutions we haven't found yet.

Grizzly

Less than 80ft and you just might want to call for the 40 sticks of dynamite but anything over 80ft is pretty much a breeze. Van drivers working in warehouse complexes most times have to work with less and many times in truckstops you don't get that much space but that's what I'd aim for. Overall length for a standard tractor/trailer rig is 75'6" max but all configurations after that are longer. Make it a good base with no soft ground and you'll be even happier. Also make sure your driveway is wide enough that you don't have the less experienced chaps dropping a trailer into the ditch. That's a nuisance for everyone involved.
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Ianab

The standard turning circle for the local milk tankers is at least 25m dia (that works out to ~82ft.), which lines up with Grizzly's 80+ ft.  Going a bit bigger helps with maintaining the surface as the steering wheels don't need to "dig" in as much, and the trailer wheels don't skid across the surface as much. Helps keep your gravel in place. If you are setting up a new dairy operation, they want the circle to be 30+m (98ft) 

Another thing to consider is the width of the entrance. These are usually splayed out, so they may be 30-40ft wide at the road edge, narrowing down to a regular track and gate width after about 30ft. This give trucks and trailers the space to get in and out without crossing into the opposite lane, or taking out your gate posts. 
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YellowHammer

We have 53 foot road tire (not off road ready) semis who are very worried about getting stuck (one guy told me he would get fired) come in to our place, and although some of them like to turn around on the clay it always makes them nervous, even when its dry.  I've seen some of them turn a 180 in a circle not much bigger than their total length, or pretty close to it, although its important to clear trees and obstructions a little further out so their rear ends can swing.

However, at the request of one driver we put in a backup spur or "T" where the driver can come in forward, we can unload him, he can simply backup and turn his rear end into the spur, until he is pointing out and drive off.  We put down a thick base, maybe 18 inches, of gravel on the "T".  So when its dry, the trucks will turn around anywhere, but when its wet and gooey, or its raining they have the spur with solid base to use and they will almost always use it over the turning circle.  I like it because I didn't want to put such a thick layer of gravel all over our turning circle.
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Southside

Somewhere in the range of 7 square miles if a SWIFT truck pulls in I have learned.  ;D
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Dave Shepard

Don't Google Swift acronyms. They can be pretty harsh.  :o :D
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DelawhereJoe

SouthSide your saying the Swift guys need 4480 acres to turn around lol , I've seen some guy ( not Swift ) just cut it hard and turn there 53' trailers turn around inside 60'.
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Southside

The stories I could tell about my experience with SWIFT trucks coming to our place....
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

mike_belben

no one puts more vegetables behind the wheel than swift.  The only company ive seen cross the median and wreck on the wrong bank more than once.  


I am all about the T.. Just make sure the radius into it and into the entrance (culvert?) Is generous to accomodate the trail.  A good driver can spin a 180 with the tandems in place but it'd be better if they could back the trailer tandems off to the side somewhere between 45 and 90 degrees before swinging the tractor the other way and pulling forward.   A vee shape off the side of a straight lane will work good.  This way the trailer is never rocking over the edge or going in the grass if swift does find you. 
Praise The Lord

Ianab

A decent size T turnaround will work easy enough for a simple articulated truck. I guess it depends what you are expecting to turn up. This is the size and config most log trucks and milk tankers use, plus a lot of the general freight trucks as well. The new higher capacity rating has an extra axle at the back as well.

They can turn them in a T, but they would much rather have a 100ft loop to drive around. 
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Grizzly

If a driver is capable of properly and successfully using a T, then he is capable of other maneuvers that allow poorer facilities. After 30 years of watching drivers and working with them I prefer to be prepared with a simple yard that has sufficient space for a simple loop. Nothing very difficult. That sounds like a slam on drivers and it bothers me because at least 40% of drivers are very skilled people. But we have to be prepared for the 20% that show up and can't do much of anything. That's the group that causes all the work, not the larger group of drivers that has all the skills required.
2011 - Logmaster LM-2 / Chinese wheel loader
Jonsered saws - 2149 - 111S - 90?
2000 Miners 3-31 Board Edger

brianJ

Well said Grizzly.    I needed a lot of practice to get good at backing up.   Half way thru my first summer of driving a guy at the grain elevator asked if I could back up into a tight spot.   Had to be within a foot or less.   My reply Yes I CAN.  Might take me two tries.  But to my left I know I can do it.   Wont try backing to my right in such a tight spot.  Nailed it perfectly on first attempt.   

Im a little more out of practice these days but could turn either right or left.

YellowHammer

Quote from: Grizzly on July 25, 2018, 11:08:32 AM
If a driver is capable of properly and successfully using a T, then he is capable of other maneuvers that allow poorer facilities. 
This is true, and its amazing how all the different drivers have different levels of skill, confidence and techniques for turning around, even though thy have several options, some laid out just for them.  I can say "Well, you can turn around here, or here, or back down here" and they still do their own thing.   :D :D

We live in the country, at the end of a couple two lane, dogleg roads, with trees on both ditches.  The nearest escape road is about 1/4 mile away, and I have had drivers roll in with the attitude that if they can get in then they can get out, even without knowing what we have for a turnaround.  

I've also had some stop on the road and call and ask if we have room for a turnaround, a probably prudent approach and I let them know to come on in, no problem.  

I had one guy who didn't call, and backed down the ENTIRE twisted, curving country road to our place, it had to be 1/4 mile, and then back down our driveway, to our yard.  Of course once he got in and the place opens up to acres of flat ground, he realized maybe it wasn't the best thing. :D  I told him if he had enough skill to back down that far, he should have known he could have turned around on a postage stamp, and since we were a sawmill, at least he would have had more room than that. :D
   

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

SawyerTed

US 129 NC to Tenn.  My motorcyling brothers will know that road as Tail of the Dragon.  SWIFT was notorious for dispatching drivers on this road that has 318 curves in 11 miles.  After a serious accident in 2015 SWIFT began to take steps to curtail their drivers from using US 129.  Some of the curves are such that the rear tires of a big rig cross the opposite lane completely.  Tennessee has banned vehicles over 30' on its portion (don't know how you can travel the NC portion without violating Tennessee law if you are over 30' there aren't other roads across that section of the Smokey Mountains).

This is a photo on US 129.  I am not the photogrpher.



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Magicman

Here is a short video that I made while traveling on the Tail of the Dragon.
IMG 1319 - YouTube
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rjwoelk

I pulled into a Flying J one time and asked over the cb if there was any room, a fellow came on and said sure 2 swift trucks pulled out and we now have 4 more spots. :D :D
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YellowHammer

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Ianab

Local truckies tend to have pretty decent skills. 

This is a few years back, riding with a buddy taking a load of wood chips out to a farm out East.

DSCF3693 - YouTube
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Raider Bill

I ride the dragon several times a year the last time a few weeks ago. It's a motorcycle mecca but I don't care for it.

You still see big rigs on it from time to time even with the ban. It's a long way around to get from Knoxville/Maryville to Robbinsville if you can't use 129.

Personally I'd like to see them ban more campers and trailers.

Actually if I never have to ride it again I'd be happy. First thing guys want to do when they come up to the Tenn house is "ride the Dragon". Too much work with no scenery and a bunch of jerks on sport bikes tearing it up or some fool in a cage that can't keep his line.

Lot's crash every year riding it. At the Deals Gap stop they have the "tree of shame" which is covered with bike parts, xrays and obits.

BTW Not to be outdone, Here in Florida we have our own motor cycle gauntlet.. it's called Tail of the Gecko. 11 curves in 318 miles.
This picture was taken on the Dragon


 
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

mike_belben

If you want your own private dragon adventure without all the poseurs, start at brushy mountain prison in TN and run 116 up to 297 or down to 330.  

Coal trucks and banjos.  Be careful.   For as close to civilization as it is, ill bet its one of the most rugged patches in america.  Like a miniature amazon encircled by highways.  James earl ray escaped from brushy mountain and didnt get far across frozen head.  
Praise The Lord

james

another good ride in WA is highway 20 from Sedro Wolley to Omak across the North Cascades
james

SawyerTed

Raider Bill I agree that the Tail of the Dragon is a lot of work to ride for just being able to say you did it.  I have ridden it a few times and like you if I don't ever ride it again I won't miss it.  Here in Stokes County, NC we have plenty of curvy roads to challenge a rider's skills and I can sleep in my own bed after riding.  Highway 66 North from King, to Highway 89 South is about as technical as the Dragon but without the hype. The scenery is pretty good and the roads aren't overly busy.  The Parkway is just 45 minutes away as well.  

I'm sawing at a site this week and next where there is a T for logging trucks to turn around.  They pull through the T then they do have to back to the right where there's about 40' feet of space.  So there's no problem with side clearance.  They turn left then back down to the unloading ramp where the big rubber tire loader unloads the logs.  From the ramp it is a straight shot out of the site back to the road.
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Raider Bill

Thanks Mike, I'm always looking for that next road to putt along on in that area.

Heading up again in September for a weeks riding.
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

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