Odd Questions

Bigdogpc · July 18, 2003, 05:29:03 AM

Thinking about a personal mill based on 23 oaks and 3 pines. Oaks range from 30"+ to around 16". Most are 20"+ measured chest high. This would be intended to make money, not something to keep me occupied. I am attempting to make a reasonably informed decision without enough knowledge. Can someone give me a ballpark figure based on the description of the trees, assuming they are quartersawn and air dried. Would it show a profit after cost of small mill or this just a pipe dream? (small mill @ approx $6000 cost). If I can recoup my outlay and make a few bucks in a years time then I can play the "hobby sawing for profit" game at my leisure (read that "as I find logs") Thanks in advance for any replies!

Percy · July 18, 2003, 07:53:26 AM

Well BigDog
I dont know much about Oak but it sounds like you may have some decent logs to start out with. I couldnt say if youd make back your investment right off, BUT, if you are willing to work real hard(it will get you in shape) and you make the right choice in mills for what you are doing, you should be able to get your coin back and have a mill left over to boot. How long it takes will be up to you. Once word gets around, you will have lotsa new friends wanting their nail infested yardwood cut up :D and actually you can do O.K. cutting wood for others either for money or on a share basis. Ive done very well cutting for shares at times.

Before you buy a mill, do lots of research, ask questions here, and ........Good Luck

Bibbyman · July 18, 2003, 08:06:55 AM

Welcome to the Forum Bigdogpc!

For sure you're trying to count your chickens before they're hatched. But that's the risks. If you've not got your trees in log form, then you don't know if they are all sound and good. But, I bet if you get a mill, you'll also find other logs for free or saw on shares that will make up for any loss you may have of your initial inventory.

With the economy coming back, I'd think your risk is small. If all else fails and you decide to bail out after a year or so, you should be able to recover most, if not all, the original cost of your mill (assuming the cost of new mills go up as they have when the economy is good.)

BTW, do you have the equipment to harvest and move these logs?

Bigdogpc · July 21, 2003, 02:36:41 AM

Thanks Percy and Bibbyman for the answers.

The only support equipment will be my truck, ropes, chains, winch, grunts and sweat. I am looking the hardest at the Timberking 1220, no extra length since I figure the 12' will do anything I want.

I have the plans for a solar kiln found in an old issue of Fine Woodworking that will hold 1500bf. I expect to build it and fill it. I will probably build two since there is a 15 x 40 concrete slab available.

I'm still doing my homework and countin' those chickens I don't have. I am still inclined to believe the mill will pay for itself within a year, I'm just waiting to hear from the people who really know if it will or not. Thanks again!

ARKANSAWYER · July 21, 2003, 05:22:11 AM

Bigdogpc,
Lets just say that there is 500 bdft in each tree and there are 23 oak trees. That is 12,500 bdft est. I get $0.20 to saw so that would be about $2,500 or about half the cost of the sawmill. Now if you dry the wood and sell it for $1.00 a bdft that means you will have $12,500 for your work. It will be lots of work. There are more ticks to doing this then one would think. It is alot of work to Qsaw big logs on a manual mill.
Now if you fell the logs and get them ready and hire a mill to come in and saw for you and pay them the approx. $2,500 and get to help and learn and see what is done then you will have enough when the deal is done to pay cash for the mill you want if you still want one. Also if you buy a used mill you will most likly get blades and other stuff that goes along with the mill. Plus the mill you will need $400 worth of blades and several good cant hooks and lots of umph!
ARKANSAWYER

shopteacher · July 21, 2003, 05:28:46 AM

Hey ARKANSAWYER,
Where can I get some more of that umph? :

I seem to be getting pretty low on that here lately. I got plenty of cant hooks so I don't need anymore of them. :D :D :D

Bigdogpc · July 21, 2003, 02:02:50 PM

Thanks for the answer Arkansawyer!!!!

As is always the case, there is more to the questions than has been stated. On top of all that I am like most folks with more time than money. The trees stand on 3 acres which is my Dad's. It is a two hour drive from where I am which isn't too bad. My son will be walking and cranking the mill (he's in his 20's). I am pushing 50 real hard but still have a tad of umph left so, I will fell the trees (LOTS of experience with palm trees many moons ago with a tree service in south Florida). I fully expect to add value to the lumber by building with it (got a few ideas and I am a fair to middlin' woodworker) I considered just hiring a sawyer to do the milling but it would defeat my purpose as I am looking to find something for my son to do that he can make money at and perhaps develope a business of his own. If you want the REST of the story....drop me an email to dave=woodworlds.com. The = needs to be an @....I hate the bots that snatch email addresses!

Your answer is a tad shy of my best guess but I will gladly accept your estimate since I honestly have no clue as to the value nor the work. Thanks again!!!!!

LeeB · July 22, 2003, 03:04:08 PM

I've got a 1200, which is the older brother to the 1220, and I can vouch for the work part of the story. I make a little extra coin with it now and then, about $150-200 a month. If you intend to make a living I would deffinatly suggest a bigger mill and some more equip. After 2 years I finally bought a small tractor and that helps a lot. I would agree with the others in that you should take down one or two trees and have them milled to get your feet wet before you jump in. Beware the sawdust though. Just a little on you and your hooked for life. LeeB :D

Bigdogpc · July 28, 2003, 03:22:36 PM

I'm hooked. I went up on Saturday to see a 1200 in operation. The guy let me start doing a few boards...he finally told me I would have to stop or he would have to put me on his payroll...

My order is in for a Timberking 1220 with the 20hp. Like everyone keeps saying, get a little sawdust on you and you're hooked!

Thanks again to all of ya! This is a great bunch here!

dail_h · July 28, 2003, 05:15:58 PM

Well go on Bigdog!!! yep,one line,and you'r hooked.Welcome and congrats on the Timberking.Good equipment,good people,good choice,good luck. Oh did I mention that you'r hooked?

LeeB · July 29, 2003, 10:27:21 AM

Good choice on the 20hp. I have the 15 and feel it is just a little under powered.

LeeB

Bigdogpc · July 29, 2003, 11:27:06 AM

The 1200 I ran had 13hp and cutting cedar it did real well. I just keep thinking about oak and how hard it is on my puny tablesaw...more hp just made good sense. Now I'm looking at building a solar kiln and perhaps some log handling/moving equipment. This whole site is a goldmine of information and ideas!

Jeff · July 29, 2003, 11:44:07 AM

See there, a ready made place to link to for that forum link on woodworlds.com ;D

Will_Johnson · July 29, 2003, 01:35:21 PM

Big Dog:

Welcome to the TK family! Please feel free to call me personally if you have any questions or comments. 1-800-942-4406.

Thanks to all others for your kind words.

Best,

Will

Bibbyman · July 29, 2003, 01:55:31 PM

Now Will and Bigdogpc, don't be talking behind our backs.

We want the details with pictures. The first board, the mandatory first time you saw into a back support, log dropped behind the mill, That kind of stuff. ;)

We'z all one beg family here. 8)

Bigdogpc · July 29, 2003, 02:14:18 PM

Hmmm....I do believe there is a digital camera around here somewhere...I'll see what I can do...won't get the mill for a few weeks so pics will be slow coming...provided I can figure out how to post them.

Bibbyman · July 29, 2003, 04:16:13 PM

Maybe you can start practicing now. Once you've done it, it's easy. But getting that first and second one up and posted is pretty traumatic.

Jeff · July 29, 2003, 06:21:07 PM

traumatic?

Yea, on me. :D

Jeff · July 29, 2003, 06:23:16 PM

Bib, we both used the word "traumatic". Thats a pretty spiffy word for us. Did you have to look it up to spell it? If it aint right It aint right for me either cause I copied and pasted it out of your post.

Bibbyman · July 29, 2003, 07:08:41 PM

I think I did get it right. I write my stuff in Word then spell check the heck out of it then check the thesaurus (had to look that up!) to make sure I got the word I ment.

Some things I write ain't in no dictionary. Wait until Tom comes along, he knows all the words and how to spell them. :P He's smart you know.

Jeff · July 29, 2003, 07:41:33 PM

Ya gotta be when you have such a long name.

Tom · July 29, 2003, 07:42:42 PM

Bibby,
Did you know that a Zebra is white with black stripes?

biziedizie · July 29, 2003, 07:51:07 PM

........And chickens can't fly unless you kick em hard enough. ;D

Steve

Tom · July 29, 2003, 08:38:22 PM

Yep, the longest recorded flight of a chicken is thirteen seconds. That's some hang-time. :D

Bibbyman · July 29, 2003, 09:09:43 PM

Tom, biziedizie, the category ISSSS! "Odd Questions". You-all disqualified because you gave answers to odd questions that were not ask. ;D

(I know lots of stuff that nobody want's to know.)