Framing Lumber

[AdamT]

Using a bandmill, what is the best way to produce 2x's for framing use?


If you take the cant and cut the width first, say three of them at 3 1/2", turn 90 degrees, skim the top, then saw the thickness at 1 1/2" all the way to the bed, thus producing 3 -2x4's each pass, how do you keep the boards straight during milling? I've seen lots of photos of it being done this way, and I've done it this way myself many times. When I saw for myself I don't mind a few culls that bowed before use. But when sawing for a customer, the last thing you want to to see is bowed boards coming off the mill.

The other way I've done it is to saw each cant individually, adding 1/16" per linear foot, then standing them on edge with the hump up, sawing, turning and sawing to final width. This has produced the best boards for me, however it is very time consuming, more time spent handling, more waste... And so on.


So how do you guys do it? Is there another way or something else I should be doing?

As far as efficiency and bd ft per hour, I prefer the first method.

Thanks everyone!

[drobertson]

Adam, I have encountered this issue as well. I have done it both ways too.  I make my first face parallel to any sweep that might be in the log, and make this face the one where I drop the 1-1/2. the two faces on each side I bring down to 3-1/2" with 1-1/2" drops keeping the center of the log as centered as possible. this give me center cut boards. the other boards I trim and flip like you described. It just makes better boards for me this way. A lil more time and some slivers,(waste) but for the most part straight boards.  david

[Magicman]

This is my way.  Note that you should always have an odd number of cants thus preventing splitting the center cant through the pith.  If I can't get 3 or 5, then I bring it down to 1.


 
The third face has been opened, the last side board taken off, and the cant split into three 3 5/8" cants.
The red crayon marks are for illustration.


 
Here the three "splits" have been turned, the fourth face opened and 2X4's are being sawn.

This log produced 3 side boards that were edged and then each made two 2X4's.


 
2X4 studs.  Also note the pile of studs in the background.

I have not had any issues with SYP framing lumber doing "bad things" like bowing or crooking, but I never split the pith.


 
The pile that is in the background of the above picture.  They are all straight.

This is for a "many times" repeat customer that I will be sawing for again beginning Monday morning.

[Kingcha]

Thank you MM for the pictures as I will be a new Sawyer(in training) this spring and 2x4 will be some of the first things I want to cut.   "but I never split the pith" Will be something I remember.   Odd is the only way.  Thats will help me.

[rooster 58]

    Woodmizer offers several informative dvd's. One of them regards dimension sawing. Very informative, I learned alot from those :P  8)

[Magicman]

Splitting the pith will guarantee that at least six of your 2X4's will bow.


 
Here I am sawing 2X6's.  In order to center the pith in the center cant, I will have to take some 2X4's from the right side.  That was the best option to insure quality and straight 2X6's from the other cants.

[AdamT]

I've never had the privilege of sawing SYP, but when I saw tulip poplar and Virginia pine, they tend to want to bow when sawing using the first technique I mentioned.  Piths not being split either. It just seems that this method wouldn't properly relieve stress in the log, causing the boards to move



MM- in your second post it looks like all 3 cants are the same width...? I'm using my phone so that may be the reason it looks that way...

[AdamT]

Oops! Virginia Pine is a specie of SYP... It's just never referred to as that around here.

[OneWithWood]

I saw plump and then dress the boards after drying, wether air or kiln or a comination of both.  Most of my dimension lumber is tulip poplar and big tooth aspen.  The aspen really moves a lot after milling.  I use the grade settings on the rule, producing lumber that is 2 1/8 x 4 1/8.  If there is a lot of stress in the log I will saw to the next dimension up to assure I can get a straight board.  It wastes a bit of wood and is more time consuming but I get the straight lumber I need in the end.

[Chuck White]

Lynn, your pic in post #5 has been baffling me.

I see your front, left side outrigger is above the bunk, so you must be sawing something other than dimensional lumber from those cants.  :-\

[drobertson]

I will say this to the dismay of many, but must be said for at least my sake.  I have cut many logs through for maximum 2x4 production.  There are many logs that will yield straight boards with this techique, but with what I have found with our timber, it yields allot of crooked boards on the outer quadrants, to the point of almost useless lumber.  I have found a little skim cut takes just enough stress out to relieve the stress and resulting in boards that can be used as is without making allot of short ones. 

[francismilker]

Great pics and tutorial on maximizing board production here.  I wish I had some syp close to me.  The nearest is around 65 miles SE of here and it's owned by weyerhouser if I heard right.  It would be nice to have access to a dozen or more good logs for making some framing lumber.

Are any of these species good for framing?  Oak, hickory, red oak, willow, cottonwood, sycamore, bois'darc, winged elm, or blackjack!!!!  If so, I've got tons of it.  Not many softwoods around these parts that are worth much to my knowledge.

[drobertson]

Board production does not mean useable lumber in all cases,  The list you gave can all be used if the builder has no problem with it and any codes don't  prohibit it.  Black Jack is a funny breed for sure, best for fire wood around here.

[AdamT]

I will say this to the dismay of many, but must be said for at least my sake.  I have cut many logs through for maximum 2x4 production.  There are many logs that will yield straight boards with this techique, but with what I have found with our timber, it yields allot of crooked boards on the outer quadrants, to the point of almost useless lumber.  I have found a little skim cut takes just enough stress out to relieve the stress and resulting in boards that can be used as is without making allot of short ones.

Especially in logs longer than 8 or 9'. Ive gotten away with it before on short logs and understanding customers. Same goes with poplar. I love poplar, dislike the amount of stress it has

[AdamT]

Great pics and tutorial on maximizing board production here.  I wish I had some syp close to me.  The nearest is around 65 miles SE of here and it's owned by weyerhouser if I heard right.  It would be nice to have access to a dozen or more good logs for making some framing lumber.

Are any of these species good for framing?  Oak, hickory, red oak, willow, cottonwood, sycamore, bois'darc, winged elm, or blackjack!!!!  If so, I've got tons of it.  Not many softwoods around these parts that are worth much to my knowledge.

I sawed over 4000 bd ft of walnut into framing lumber for a customer this past summer. I couldn't talk him out of it. To him, wood was wood.

1 log still stands out clearly in my mind. It was absolutely beautiful and it pained me turn it into studs.

[Magicman]

Lynn, your pic in post #5 has been baffling me.

I see your front, left side outrigger is above the bunk, so you must be sawing something other than dimensional lumber from those cants.  :-\

Chuck, there are a couple of pictures that the camera angle makes thing look as they are not.  The top of the "right" outrigger is well below the saw bed.  The "left" outrigger is not an outrigger, but the cam follower cover.

I was sawing 2X6's.

The first two pictures also look like very different sized cants and thicknesses, but they are the same.  The pictures were to illustrate technique only.

[red oaks lumber]

syp must be a very stress filled wood. w.pine and red pine around here i don't worry about "pith" sawing, throw the log on the mill and let the sawdust fly

[Magicman]

I would not make a statement that every SYP log is stress filled, but some are.  By following a few simple rules, you can saw suitable framing lumber from most any log.  There are times, especially with smaller trees, that the cant must be flipped after each pass.

[Slab Slicer]

I'll agree with MM on this one. Although my experience is limited, I have sawed logs that would need turning very frequently, and others I've sawed through and through with no issues. It just depends on the log itself, I guess.

[drobertson]

This is why I try to convince the custormer to make minimal 1" bringing the log to a cant.  This allows me to observe the log for any stresses that might be present.  Taking a log and just cutting through with no regards to retained stress is almost pointless. As mentioned, some logs behave very well, and make real quick 2X4's or 6's but just when you think you have the cat by the tail, it turns into an epic battle of just getting through the log with whatever can be salvaged.

[learner]

I'm not quite sure I'm understanding here.  I've sawn several logs where the first cuts on each side result in the boards either bending up on the ends or towards the sides.
Sometimes enough to make me think it was going to hit me.  And this has also happened when sawing the cant into the needed lumber.  So, here is my question.  When this happens, should I rotate the log to make my next cut and do this each time until the boards saw flat and true?
Magic, thank you for the info about splitting the pith. That's something I didn't know.

[drobertson]

In my opinion, the pith is the least of worries, concerning pine, the orientation of the first cut as related to the drops to cut straight through is the major decision.  there are too many variables with off centered hearts to try and battle the pith.  Stress is the enemy, and finding it as quickly as possible is the key for me.

[learner]

So what do you reccomend doing after the first cut shifts on you?  Go ahead and rotate for the next cut?  Do the same if it shifts again?  How can you best relieve the tension in a log so that you can get clean cuts?  I don't have a problem with tension in the bigger logs but they usually need to be turned several times to get a workable cant.  In the smaller cants, turning them can throw your cuts off if they bend up or down.  The clamp works Great horizontally, but Not vetically.

[Magicman]

Yes David.  I was geared toward the OP, but the first face that is opened on a SYP log is absolutely the most critical cut that you will make.  If you are turning 90° for each face, that opening will determine the orientation of the cant for sawing through.  Especially if the log has sweep and you get it wrong, the entire log/cant will be junk.

[learner]

I'm beginning to understand now Magicman.  Just one more ? and i'll stop bugging you sir.  How do you determine where the first cut on a log should be?