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Most useable Mill length?

Started by OlJarhead, October 24, 2012, 10:54:53 AM

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OlJarhead

So while I'm asking all the questions here's another:

If you had a 14 foot mill (LT10) and were making a trailer for it and could lengthen the mill as part of that process would you lengthen it to make 14', 16', 18' or 20' lumber?

I've been thinking about this lately and at first I was gungho to extend the mill to 20' but then it occurred to me that the most bang for my buck might be no more then long enough to mill 12 or 14 footers.

Thoughts?
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

nas

No matter what, it will be to short ;D.  I find that I cut a ton of 16's so the ability to do that would be a minimum for me.

Nick
Better to sit in silence and have everyone think me a fool, than to open my mouth and remove all doubt - Napoleon.

Indecision is the key to flexibility.
2002 WM LT40HDG25
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haywire woodlot

Go as long as is practical, when I first set up my old mobile dimension mill, I only used two track sections, thinking the 16' of cutting capacity was enough. After that every conversation with a neighbor went like this
Neighbour-"cool sawmill, how long a log can it cut?"
Me-"16'."
Neighbor-" That's too bad, I really need some 18' 2x8 rafters."
So, the longest you can make it, and still have it practical for you to move, is the best.
Dave

Chuck White

I tend to agree with the others, I would set it up so I could saw at least 16 feet!
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

bedway

Built mine to handle 16 ft but 14 ft. is the max ive cut. Most of the wood i cut is hardwood and not for structural use.

Nomad

     Go for at least 16'.  Realistically logs, cants any boards longer than that get hard to handle, store, etc.  And if your most common length is 12', for example, you've got plenty of wiggle room on the mill.
Buying a hammer doesn't make you a carpenter
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Riggs

Quote from: nas on October 24, 2012, 12:25:52 PM
No matter what, it will be to short ;D .

Nick


+1 I've already sawed a good bit of 20' beams.
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Norwood ML 26

OlJarhead

Excellent feedback!

As I'm having the trailer built for the mill (Woodmizer LT10) I wanted to be sure it was a length I'd use but not so long that the expense of building it longer outweighed the possible returns.

In this case I have to go at least long enough to do 12 foot logs which means extending the mill a foot or two at the very least -- a 14' bunk on the LT10 only allows for about 11'4" of log because the mill head takes up almost 18" on either end of the bed.

So I'd be looking at a trailer at least 16 feet long which means a 20 foot trailer isn't much longer or much more expensive I think.

To do 16 foot cants I'd need a 19 foot trailer/Mill bed -- so 20 feet seems about right.  Plus I can pull it easily behind my F150.

I'm also looking at tandem 2000lb axles for stability, 8 stabilizers and some custom log loading ramps.  Also, I'm seriously considering setting it up to add a whinch at a later date and making it so the mill can be removed from the trailer.

I want to mill logs without having to remove the wheels so it will be a deck over arrangement but I'm thinking I can do it with shorter trailer tires and some fancy metal work so the bed of the mill sits a little lower then the top of the bed deck....I'll have to draw some pictures of that.

Anyway, thanks again -- I think 20' deck is what I'm going to do.

Then, if the business actually does more then just weekend sawing I'll look at a bigger mill :)
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

Dave Shepard

I vote for 16' minimum as well. I can saw 45' on the LT40 and it's still too short. :D
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Red Clay Hound

If you plan to mill the logs on the trailer, 2000# tandem axles might not be stout enough.  By the time you include the weight of the trailer and the mill, you're not leaving a lot of room for the log.  I think I would use 3500# axles.  Just my 2 cent's worth. :)
2007 Wood-Mizer LT40 Super Hydraulic with 51 hp. Cat; 2007 Wood-Mizer EG200 Twin Blade Edger; Woodmaster 718 Molder/Planer; Stihl MS460 and MS362 Chainsaws; 2011 John Deere 5065 with JD 553 Loader

Brian_Rhoad

Build the trailer for 16'. Build it so you can add extensions to the mill to saw longer. If you build the trailer with the frame directly under the mill frame, make the trailer frame longer on each end so the extension sits on the trailer frame.

OlJarhead

Quote from: Red Clay Hound on October 24, 2012, 01:49:18 PM
If you plan to mill the logs on the trailer, 2000# tandem axles might not be stout enough.  By the time you include the weight of the trailer and the mill, you're not leaving a lot of room for the log.  I think I would use 3500# axles.  Just my 2 cent's worth. :)

I think that becomes a non-issue when you put the stanchions down.  They take up all the weight and stabilize the mill at the same time.  Am I wrong about this?
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

OlJarhead

Quote from: Brian_Rhoad on October 24, 2012, 02:17:01 PM
Build the trailer for 16'. Build it so you can add extensions to the mill to saw longer. If you build the trailer with the frame directly under the mill frame, make the trailer frame longer on each end so the extension sits on the trailer frame.

I'm wondering, though, if the LT10 is really going to cut long stuff all that well?  I haven't had a problem with it yet but it seems a bit light to be milling 16+ foot lengths for long right?

If I'm wrong, great!  But my hope is to get as much work with it as I can and then replace it with a bigger mill but to start I don't want to hamper my chances of success either.

So 16' millable lengths makes sense.

I like the idea of adding additional rails to make it longer but I think I'd have to do a lot of work for that - i.e. making the extensions stand the same height as the mill deck, not rack or dip etc and not require a lot of work to add (i.e. changing out the guide wires).
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

Red Clay Hound

Quote from: OlJarhead on October 24, 2012, 02:27:56 PM
Quote from: Red Clay Hound on October 24, 2012, 01:49:18 PM
If you plan to mill the logs on the trailer, 2000# tandem axles might not be stout enough.  By the time you include the weight of the trailer and the mill, you're not leaving a lot of room for the log.  I think I would use 3500# axles.  Just my 2 cent's worth. :)

I think that becomes a non-issue when you put the stanchions down.  They take up all the weight and stabilize the mill at the same time.  Am I wrong about this?

You are correct.  If you will be using outriggers on your trailer then the weight of the log becomes a non-issue.  Why didn't I think of that? say_what
2007 Wood-Mizer LT40 Super Hydraulic with 51 hp. Cat; 2007 Wood-Mizer EG200 Twin Blade Edger; Woodmaster 718 Molder/Planer; Stihl MS460 and MS362 Chainsaws; 2011 John Deere 5065 with JD 553 Loader

hackberry jake

I would vote for 16, minimum as well. A lot of 16" trailers out there need new decking. I can cut 22', and have done so twice (for the 6x6s I have the mill sitting on), but never want to again. I don't have the equipment for 22' long logs. That's a lot of weight and they have to be gun barrel straight or you waste more wood than you make into lumber.
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Ianab

QuoteI'm wondering, though, if the LT10 is really going to cut long stuff all that well?  I haven't had a problem with it yet but it seems a bit light to be milling 16+ foot lengths for long right?

Length of log doesn't really affect the saw head, just takes longer to get through the log. No more stress on the saw head etc. The Woodmizer site actually shows the ability to add unlimited bed extensions as one of the mills selling points. Not sure how you are supposed to handle a 40ft log, but if you lined up enough track extensions the mill could work it's way through it

The only issues are supporting and turning the longer log. If the mill rails are supported by the trailer frame, that's supported by jack stands, then holding  the log isn't an issue.

Turning it? Well you are on your own there  :D But it's the same as any other manual mill in that respect.

I'd go long, because then you have to option of cutting things like longer beams and rafters etc. The "oddball" jobs that you will be looking for, and the little mill will handle quite well. You want to be able to cut the stuff people can't buy off the shelf. 8 ft 2x4? Meh, probably buy those cheaper than you can mill them?  A 16ft 8 x 10 beam? 4 cuts and it's done, load the next one... Charge $50 an hour, no worries. You won't be much slower than any other manual mill.

Ian

Edit - log handling become an issue, but hopefully anyone wanting heavy stuff like that has a tractor or similar on hand to move logs and beams around, or else how are they going to move the stuff after you do cut it?

Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

beenthere

QuoteI haven't had a problem with it yet but it seems a bit light to be milling 16+ foot lengths for long right?


If you are just adding track extensions, the mill really doesn't know it is cutting 8' or 20' logs.  Or am I missing something?

Or is the operator going to get tired being in the cut that long?   ;D
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JustinW_NZ

As Ian said, watch for things getting more problematic as logs get longer the weight does seem to pile on them!

Cheers
Justin
Gear I run;
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Nomad

     Don't forget that longer logs usually mean fatter logs.  The LT10 can only take so much diameter.
Buying a hammer doesn't make you a carpenter
WoodMizer LT50HDD51-WR
Lucas DSM23-19

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Quote from: nomad on October 24, 2012, 09:03:22 PM
     Don't forget that longer logs usually mean fatter logs.  The LT10 can only take so much diameter.

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Bill Gaiche

I would go for 16.5' at least. You may get some orders for trailers that need new floors. That extra 6" lets you trim the lumber to an even 16'. I have 2"x6"x3/16" tubbing under the 3" angle iron frame rails and it is very strong. Build your own 2" schedule 80 tube axle You can buy axle stubs with hubs pretty reasonable,weld them in the end of the tube. Make you some spring pads and spring hangers also. Build the axle only as wide as the width of the saw frame plus a little clearance. The wheels don't need to be removed because they don't stick out far enough to get in the way. Purchase you some springs that will handle a total of about 2000lbs to go under the rectangle tubbing. Your mill can be welded to the tubbing or bolted down so you can remove it if needed.Add you a tongue and you will have you a portable mill that will work great for you.My mill will only cut 12.5' lumber and that all I need 99% of the time. bg


  

  

  

    

thecfarm

I have a manual mill that will cut 20 feet. I never have cut nothing longer than 16. But this longer mill gives me 4 feet of extra room to play with instead of 6 inches on each end when cutting 16 foot logs.It also allows me to get the head out of the way to remove boards too.Ever had to move even a 10 foot log,16 inches through, 6 inches, length wise on a mill? I think you will be cutting alot of 16 foot but not many 20's. That extra 4 feet is great when cutting 16's. I brought the longer mill just in case. I had no idea how much easier it would be to have the extra room. I would make it 20 feet if I was doing it.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

OlJarhead

Bill I'd love to learn more about your mill!

One 2000lbs capacity axle and tires would be a lot cheaper then what I was looking at (a pair of them with brakes on both since the state requires it on 3000lb gross and above) and the simple design would work fine I think -- only I need a walkway beside the LT10.

I'd like to see more detail on your clamps too!
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

WDH

The really long logs on the LT10 will kill you.  You might not be able to turn them without damaging the mill, yourself, your tractor or all of the above.  It is not designed to cut long length construction lumber in my opinion.  If your strategy is to cut long construction lumber, I believe that you have the wrong mill.  You can make it do it, but you are pushing up a rope in my opinion.  Also, if the mill is trailer height, it is almost impossible to turn the big long logs by yourself with a cant hook.  You need help.  It is many times easier to turn bigger logs if the mill is low to the ground, because, otherwise, you can't get leverage to turn the logs. 

This log took an hour to load, was very dicey, and ended up too big to fit between the blade guides.  Much more chainsaw work ensued.  A lot of suspense and drama for sure.  I was scared a few times, said a few DanGs, but finally got it done.  The 22" wide by 9' long 6/4 oak was nice, but almost impossible to handle and stack.  And, this is a LT15, which is much beefier than the LT10.



 



If you are going to be cutting big, honking, long logs, then HYDRAULICS. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

OlJarhead

I envision mostly cutting pine and fir around where I'll be -- not much hardwoods growing.

Also imagine I'll be cutting mostly smaller stuff (15" to 20" max most of the time with a lot of stuff in the 12-15" range probably.  That's just from what I've been falling and cutting on my own property but I think it's pretty representative.

My trailer plan was to have at least a walkway along the mill on one side, if not both sides -- so I'd have a place to work to turn the logs from.
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

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