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Timberjack winch worm gear oil

Started by Mooseknuckle, October 13, 2014, 08:44:15 PM

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Mooseknuckle

Hey Guys,  I looked through previous threads in regards to worm gear oils and the fact that they are very difficult to source in quantities less than 20 litres.  I checked with Napa, B&B Dixon, Cumins hydraulics, Acklands Grainger and barious others.  And yup I could not find anything in less than 20 litre quantities.

I stopped into a Massey Ferguson dealer and found a 4 Litre jug of AGCO special high pressure worm gear lubricant. Its rating is AGMA 5EP with an ISO viscosity grade of 220 which would be around and SAE 104.
This oil would be the right spec according to the operators manual for running in the winter as you can go as low at SAE 90.

The second oil I found is Mobil 600W cylinder oil packaged in 1 litre containers by Boston Gear. ( www. Bostongear.com )
They have distributers all over the world just go to the website and search.
I tried to paste the specs below for the Mobil oils used by Boston Gear in their brass worm gear boxes. The Mobil 600W cylinder oil has an ISO viscosity of 460 which is at the SAE 140 level and AGMA rating of 7/7C. So this one would appear to cover the Summer operating Temperatures. Now i'm going to call Mobil and find out if 7/7C would be a high enough standard to run where a AGMA 5EP (extreme pressure) is recomended.  You can get the EP rating Mobil Oil from Boston gear as well but its rated at AGMA 8EP. Below are pictures of both products I found! Hope this helps out with budget!!

RECOMMENDED LUBRICANTS ENCLOSED WORM GEAR REDUCERS
Ambient (Room)
Temperature
Recommended Oil
(or equivalent)
Viscosity Range SUS @ 100°F
Lubricant
AGMA No.
ISO Viscosity Grade No. +
–30° to 225°F** (–34° to 107°C)
Mobil SHC 634* Synthetic
1950/2150
——
40° to 90°F (4.4° to 32.2°C)
Mobil
600W Cylinder Oil
1920/3200
7 or 7C
80° to 125°F (26.7° to 51.7°C)
Mobil Extra Hecla Super Cylinder Oil
2850/3600
8 or 8C

  

  

  

 
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Neilo

I think the things to look for are the corrosion rating, being a worm or sliding force oil, and the viscosity.

For corrosion, the Agco just says 1. Normally these are 1a, 1b or 2a. Anything with 2 should be avoided. I think the Mobil is 1b, so they are probably similar.

Both are worm drive oils.

It is warm here so I went the 460 Mobil, the manual does say lighter can be used in winter.

So it is probably up to you.
Neilo

Mooseknuckle

I just spoke to Tech Support at Mobil and they found it odd that Timberjack would call for an AGMA 5EP rating in a yellow metal or brass worm gear.  He advised that perhaps the temperature doesn't get hot enought to activate the EP additives.  If these additives are activated they will damage the brass.
He advised that the Mobil 600W cylinder oil is a compounded oil with an viscosity rating between 320 to 460 which would be in the low end of SAE 140.  The AGAM 7/7Comp is for compounded.  He advised the Mobil 600W cyclinder oil will not dammage the brass, so I'm going to go with the Mobil 600W cylinder oil in the 1 liter containers from Boston Bearing.

thanks for you info Neilo.


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Mooseknuckle

Mobil specs and yes corrosion rating is a 1B for the Mobil products

Mobil 600W Cylinder Oil is recommended for the following applications:
•   The splash lubrication of enclosed worm gears operating at moderate to high speeds and temperatures. (Mobil 600 W Cylinder Oil)
•   Steam cylinders, couplings, bearings, and break-in of compressor cylinders (Mobil 600 W Cylinder Oil)
•   Mobil 600W Super Cylinder Oil and Mobil Extra Hecla Super Cylinder Oil are recommended for the above applications but under higher temperature and load conditions
•   Mobil Extra Hecla Super Cylinder Mineral is recommended where ready separation from condensate is essential, for example, where exhaust steam is used for process work
•   Mobil Extra Hecla Super Cylinder Mineral may also be used as a tempering oil for bath temperatures up to 290C

Typical Properties
Mobil Cylinder Oils   Mobil 600 W Cylinder Oil   Mobil 600 W Super Cylinder Oil   Mobil Extra Hecla Super Cylinder Oil   Mobil Extra Hecla Super Cylinder Oil Mineral
ISO Viscosity Grade   --   460   680   1000
Viscosity, ASTM D 445               
cSt @ 40ºC   375   460   680   1000
cSt @ 100ºC   28.0   30.5   35.8   42.0
Viscosity Index, ASTM D 2270   95   95   85   80
Pour Point, ºC, ASTM D 97   -9   -6   0   3
Flash Point, ºC, ASTM D 92   282   282   282   288
Density,ASTM D4052 @15.6º C kg/l,   0.90   0.91   0.92   0.92
Copper Strip Corrosion, ASTM D 130,3 hrs @ 100º C   1B   1B   1B   1B
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Neilo

This is good information for others on these products.

It is worth noting that I don't think the 5EP rating listed in the manual is anything like a 90w EP gl5 gear oil. These ordinary sulphur based EP oils are what will corrode the brass, and the manual states never to use them.

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