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Cat has a hairball...getting hot.

Started by snowshoveler, June 26, 2012, 08:05:41 PM

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snowshoveler

My caterpillar power unit, a vintage 1935 D4400 has been running a bit warm the last few times I used it.
Just around 200 or so.
This is a bit much I think.
We had some warmer weather a couple weeks ago and it was fine running at 170 to 180.
Tonight I sawed 2 little red pine that werend even good to make an 8x8 out of and it got to 190. And its not hot at all out, just comfortable working for me.
To be fair the engine rad is out of a 1/2 ton pickup and only 2 row.
I can't see something happening to the motor that would make it heat that fast unless a bunch of rust somehow disloged in the motor and plugged up the core.
Dosen't seem like it as there is really good flow throught the top, it sure does flow past the opening for the cap.
I have not been using a thermostat, just  the empty shell of one.
Old guy told me that this would slow the flow of water enough to carry the heat out of the block. Perhaps this is a poor idea.
I do have a much bigger rad from a Ford Louiville. I should be able to install the big rad if you folks think I should.
Will have a bit of trouble adapting the hoses to fit ...little rad uses 2 inch, big rad uses 3 inch by the looks of it.
thanks for now.
Chris 
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

bandmiller2

Chris you could try flushing out the radiator,but its probibly of marginal size for that engine.Your not geting any bubbles in the radiator are you? that would indicate a leaking head gasket.Its easy to tell the best fix its always the hardest and most expensive.Your going to end up putting the larger radiator on.Their steel but you can get the handy exhaust system adapters 2"to3"you run antifreeze anyways the'll last years. Frank C. Oh if you can have a good thermostat in the system.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

lyle niemi

Hey Chris, did ya check your fan belts???

snowshoveler

The big Ford rad looks to be copper. Atleast I can move it around.
I have 2 old steel dozer rads and those are the same size but are so heavy they would need a foundation to hold them.
And I did check the fan belt , its tight enough I can spin the motor over with the fan.
I will put the big rad in I guess.
I think I have enough water pipe connectors gathered up to do it.
Might not be pretty but as long as it dosen't leak.
Regards Chris
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

Weekend_Sawyer


My thinking is to put a thermostat back in it. It allows the coolant in the radiator to be cooled down then the engine warms up, thermostat opens up swaping out the hot stuff in the engine , cool stuff runs around through the engine and up to the thermostat, it shuts off allowing the radiator to do it's thing again. Just my thinking.

Jon
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

hackberry jake

Running without a thermostat can make engines run hotter, because you are speeding up the water thought the radiator as well and it doesn't have enough time to cool down.
https://www.facebook.com/TripleTreeWoodworks

EZ Boardwalk Jr. With 20hp Honda, 25' of track, and homemade setworks. 32x18 sawshed. 24x40 insulated shop. 30hp kubota with fel. 1978 Massey ferguson 230.

hackberry jake

Dang , weekend sawyer beet me to it
https://www.facebook.com/TripleTreeWoodworks

EZ Boardwalk Jr. With 20hp Honda, 25' of track, and homemade setworks. 32x18 sawshed. 24x40 insulated shop. 30hp kubota with fel. 1978 Massey ferguson 230.

Weekend_Sawyer

Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

snowshoveler

I can sure try the thermostat.
I will however say that the entire engine gets uncomfortable warm and so does the rad,top to bottom.
You can put a bare hand on it but be carefull , going to say ouch.
Chris
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

thecfarm

I did some copper piping to make a radiator work in a truck once. Should of used some exhaust pipe and had the ends made bigger on one of those machines.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Take a water hose and wash out the radiator. Could be clogged just enough from dust to raise the temp.
I have to wash out the old backhoe during the hot, dusty summer days.
If you've already tried this....well I don't know, but good luck.
And yes, like the others said, reinstall the thermostat.
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

thecfarm

At work they use to run a sprinkler on the big radiators for the chillers until the upgrade came in.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

snowshoveler

I was over on the acmoc board and there was a discussion about running a cat without a thermostat.
It is indeed a bad idea.
I can't explain it like they did but I will indeed put in a thermostat.
All I have to do now is get one that fits.
Thanks Chris
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

ALWOL

   The purpose of the thermostat in a your Cat (or any engine) is only to keep the engine operating at a very steady temperature, instead of fluctuating all over in relation to the load imposed on it. If your engine runs hot without a thermostat, it will still run hot with one. I would be inclined to think your radiator may have some mineral deposits built up on the cores, or may simply be to small. The engine could also have an internal cumbustion pressure leak, causing cumbustion pressure to leak into the cooling system.
   I have a D8800 power unit, built about 1939, and a D318 engine in my 1947 Cat 977 loader. Cat really built some great engines in the early years of diesel power.

       Alan
   
There's a big difference between staying busy and making money.

snowshoveler

Well I was a good boy and drained the antifreeze and then put in a the thermostat.
When I tried to put the antifreeze back in...I discovered my problem.
Its plugged up with seeds and grain.
The rad was stored in a shed for a few years and must have had a mouse living in it.
I have tried to flush them out but some have swelled in the tubes.
Replacement seems to be a good idea right now.
regards Chris
 
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

hackberry jake

If you have a radiator shop nearby, they might have an acid tank that they can soak your radiator in. I don't know if acid would dissolve seeds though.
https://www.facebook.com/TripleTreeWoodworks

EZ Boardwalk Jr. With 20hp Honda, 25' of track, and homemade setworks. 32x18 sawshed. 24x40 insulated shop. 30hp kubota with fel. 1978 Massey ferguson 230.

snowshoveler

I think I have enough hose and fittings to install the big rad on it.
Might take me few hours to sort it out.
Chris
 
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

snowshoveler

A buddy of mine just showed up to get some slab wood.
He has no idea he is going to help me put that rad in the building.
Sometimes things just work out.
Chris
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

Weekend_Sawyer

Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

snowshoveler

We got the rad in , not much trouble at all.
I got the top hose installed and just need a piece of pipe to connect the bottom.
Only bad part is the rad is so big  can't walk all around the engine now.
1 side no problem but only 6 inches clearance on the other.
Oh well I can make do with that for now.
I have about 2 good days sawing then I am cought up and will take a break.
Chris
PS he even gave me beer money for the slabwood. 
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

snowshoveler

Got a few fittings in town on the way home from work.
Put it all together and it holds water.
Sawed 6 logs and missed supper.
Its all good though because the temp only went to 165.
Much releived now.
Got a very small leak that I can fix with a bit of teflon tape on a threaded fitting.
Thanks for the help and ideas.
Regards Chris 
International T5 dozer
JD M tractor
MF skidloader
Jonsered chainmill
Vintage Belsaw

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