So as I'm looking forward to when I get the mill building finished I thought I better start thinking about what colour I'm going to paint it as the rusty metal style doesn't really appeal to me :)
Being Scottish I thought I might go with a traditional finish .
(https://forestryforum.com/gallery/albums/userpics/52353/FB_IMG_1543569740579.jpg?easyrotate_cache=1543569988)
Do I need to remove all of the rust and scale right back to bare metal before I paint it or can I just take off all the loose stuff with a wire brush.
Also....for the ends of the hollow section.....I guess it's best to weld a plate over the end to stop water ingress but do I need to out any sort of treatment in first or not bother?
Thanks
What kind of a mill do you have mate. If its circular and cast iron get a wire cup wheel and angle grinder, prime and paint with rust oleum. If its steel, wire wheel it and coat with a rust killing treatment then rust oleum. Frank C.
Look into "Por 15" for painting rusty metal. I don't know what they make the stuff out of but from a wear standpoint it makes Rust-Oleum look like kids finger paint, it is absolutely amazing.
I have plenty of tubes that have open ends. was contemplating thinning paint to a water like thickness then filling the tube sloshing it around them dumping it into the next tube. This will only work on the small ones I will not try to do that on the 24' main rails. As for the ones that I have capped, I did not full weld them I will probably just get a close color matching caulk to seal the gaps. It does not need to be airtight but keeping water out would be nice.
As for color. If you plan on trailering it in the dark please don't make it black unless you plan reflective stripes or lots of lights. I cannot tell you how many times I have almost been taken out by black trailer. Either me not seeing them or them not seeing the trailer and thinking I am clear.
I ended up using a an oil base primer and am putting Behr Alkyd paint over that. So far seems to be working nicely. Only have 1 coat of color on it hoping to get second coat done today.
Quote from: Southside logger on November 30, 2018, 07:28:35 AM
Look into "Por 15" for painting rusty metal. I don't know what they make the stuff out of but from a wear standpoint it makes Rust-Oleum look like kids finger paint, it is absolutely amazing.
Only on a rough surface or it will peel right off. Also tricky to recoat and goes dull in the sun. It can last a long time on stable rust or sand blasted surface. I keep it on the shelf and have used it a long time. You can use it with fiberglass cloth to patch rust holes.
If you can't or don't want to remove all the rust and leave a ruffed up surface then a bit of sanding with course paper to remove any loose rust. either way to prep I will then clean with some low flash solvent and rags then two coats of rust primer and two coats of paint seems to work best for me.
Any colour will do but I will agree with the higher visibility colour, check the mis-tinted or dented can bargain bin for deals.
Rust-mort is a rust converter that I've had excellent success using on various items including some farm equipment. A light wirebrushing to remove loose rust is all that's necessary. Rust-mort doesn't do anything to bare metal. Three or four light coats of Rust-mort applied with a brush will convert the rust into black hard surface overnight. Think thin watery coats not a paint like consistency.
You can apply the primer/paint system of your choice once you wipe the surfaces with solvent.
Quote from: moodnacreek on November 30, 2018, 07:56:21 AMgoes dull in the sun
There is a UV top coat that you can apply and it will not dull.
Quote from: SawyerTed on November 30, 2018, 08:39:47 AM
Rust-mort is a rust converter that I've had excellent success using on various items including some farm equipment. A light wirebrushing to remove loose rust is all that's necessary. Rust-mort doesn't do anything to bare metal. Three or four light coats of Rust-mort applied with a brush will convert the rust into black hard surface overnight. Think thin watery coats not a paint like consistency.
You can apply the primer/paint system of your choice once you wipe the surfaces with solvent.
I have used several rust converters and the best value I have found is at The Rust Store - Solutions for All Rust Problems (http://www.theruststore.com), $50 USD for one gallon. Rust converters are not the final answer to rust, but they knock it back alot. What I like best about rust converters is that they are also an acrylic primer that really takes alkyd paints well, so you won't have to buy a separate primer.
As to your color selection, It would be a huge mistake to use too light a color (like white or a light tan) because these colors will begin showing rust bleeding through them within a couple of months if kept outside. I suggest either red or orange, they are both high visibility colors that will hide the rust that bleeds through your paint and keep your sawmill looking great for years to come. Oh and I would use rustoleum, two coats.
I was not aware of the uv protection for por 15. People are discovering por and slapping it on everything. Sometimes you have to go back to oil paint. I am down to my last gallon of the real rust primer, 769 damp proof, fish oil rustoleum.
For a rust converter I've been using Ospho, which is mainly phosphoric acid. Been getting good results and it's about $20 a gallon. Widely available. That approach doesn't work to well if your going for a concourse-ready paint job, but for machinery it's fine. If I get the loose rust off, treat with Ospho, and then use a two part epoxy primer, I get some pretty tough and durable results. Top coat with a good machinery enamel that needs hardener added. Never been worried about fading or chalking.
I've heard of the Por15 but never used it. I did use their product for cleaning and coating the inside of a gas tank and it worked well.
Lately for small jobs I've experimented with some of the rattle-can primers that contain a rust converter. Seems like everybody's got one these days. I used Rustoleum's version and it worked pretty well, but I'll have to get back to you in ten years on that.
I've never been happy putting a top coat on machinery unless it used a hardener. Paint without hardener just doesn't get real hard.
There's lot's of ways to skin that particular cat.
Like mentioned above, wash, dry, clean with metal prep solvent, don't touch it with your bare fingers. More problems come from improper prep than anything else.
I like the tartan paint you have. Not the correct one for my clan though. I want to see how that comes out of the spray gun.
Quote from: btulloh on November 30, 2018, 01:26:59 PM
For a rust converter I've been using Ospho, which is mainly phosphoric acid.
Most converters are phosphoric acid. I've forgotten that I've used Ospho with good results as well.
Quote from: Southside logger on November 30, 2018, 07:28:35 AM
Look into "Por 15" for painting rusty metal. I don't know what they make the stuff out of but from a wear standpoint it makes Rust-Oleum look like kids finger paint, it is absolutely amazing.
I second this. I bought an old flatbed Hino from a fence company in Long Island. Bed was 24' and badly welded beat to crap. Spent a week grinding most rust off, found I had done more than needed, let it sit two weeks, painted, then came over it with same sort of paint they use in off road racing. Por was amazing. Just amazing. I think you need to keep it out of sunlight if I remember. Anyway, you might have to paint over it. We've had logs just dumped on the bed, forks scraping, etc etc. 3 years later and 95 % of finish still on, takes a helluva thing to scrap it to metal.
Quote from: SawyerTed on November 30, 2018, 02:42:03 PM
Quote from: btulloh on November 30, 2018, 01:26:59 PM
For a rust converter I've been using Ospho, which is mainly phosphoric acid.
Most converters are phosphoric acid. I've forgotten that I've used Ospho with good results as well.
It sounds like there's a lot of difference between rust converters because the only converters I have used have Tannic acid and leave an acrylic polymer primer coating ready for paint after 24 hours. I wouldn't use them if they didn't leave an acrylic primer behind. We're talking light rust here, and no salt.
Quote from: Skipper11A on November 30, 2018, 07:05:16 PMI have used have Tannic acid and leave an acrylic polymer primer coating ready for paint after 24 hour
Sounds interesting. Need to check into that.
Used Ospro years ago and really liked it but have not been able to find it. I will have to try harder. Also they used to say that green was the longest lasting color.
Doing a little research.
A Low Cost Tannic Acid Rust Converter Formulation | Rust | Phosphoric Acid (https://www.scribd.com/document/261465794/A-Low-Cost-Tannic-Acid-Rust-Converter-Formulation)
Rust converters (https://corrosion-doctors.org/MetalCoatings/rust-converter.htm)
Seems that phosphoric acid is a major component and tannic acid is necessary for the formation of a primer-like layer. I'm wondering if Ospho has any tannic acid. I'm guessing it doesn't. It would be nice to have a better understanding and comparison of some these products.
Nativewolf, that's a good testimonial for the Por15 paint. Was their rust remover used prior to painting?
POR-15 Rust Remover - Rust Dissolving Solution - Works in as little as 20 minutes and will not affect plastic, PVC, Viton, or most paints. (https://www.por15.com/POR-15-Rust-Remover)
POR-15 Top Coat - Paint directly on prepped bare metal surfaces (https://www.por15.com/TOP-COAT_p_102.html)
POR-15® High Build Primer (https://www.por15.com/POR-15-High-Build-Primer_p_128.html)
It would be right pricey to use the Por15 primer + top coat, but it is in line with any other good paint.
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I think we may have over-answered the OP's question here. Hope we haven't scared him off. Maybe he's busy trying to source that plaid paint. ;)
We seemed to focus on the rust converter part of his question a little more😂
Well btulloh , that plaid paint gets screwed up if you spray it on . It can only be done with a brush. You have to brush in only one direction . No back and forth like with solid colors.
Plaid??? Somebody's not of Celtic descent. :D I learned not to call it plaid any more when dating my wife.
:D :D I thought I'd get a reaction from somebody with that.
I guarantee that if you buy a can of tartan paint you can spray it on as well as brush it on. :)
Quote from: Don_Papenburg on November 30, 2018, 09:05:27 PM
Well btulloh , that plaid paint gets screwed up if you spray it on . It can only be done with a brush. You have to brush in only one direction . No back and forth like with solid colors.
If you spray it you need a steady hand or the tartan has waves. Nobody likes a tartan with waves, it makes the Scots dizzy!
I use Rusty Metal Primer (brown) followed by oil based red paint to match the mill. (I think they are Rustoleum products) They have served me well. My mill is almost always under a shed so it get only wind-blown rain and humidity. Given that, the expensive stuff is just not worth the cost to me.
Bob
Thanks for all the suggestions and information.......seems prep and painting may be as big a job as building it!
bigger. I am currently working on it now. My hands look like I strangled a smurf :)
Quote from: Crusarius on December 01, 2018, 01:32:10 PM
bigger. I am currently working on it now. My hands look like I strangled a smurf :)
Bigger is apparently right. When I ordered my mill from Cooks 16 years ago they said that the painting process took longer than building it.
I would have to say proper prep takes just about as long as building it. If you take the days spent in the shop staring at it and re-engineering something out of the equation.