353 to a cummins or duetz

stoneeaglefarm · May 13, 2015, 06:33:21 PM

Any one out there replaced the 353 with a different diesel motor like a cummins/ or other style engine, 20 years since I ran a 353 and I am wondering if I can get use to the noise, Ran deere and cummins before. Thoughts.

Jhenderson · May 13, 2015, 09:28:31 PM

Used to be money in doing conversions to Cummins from Detroit. It became popular after the major mfgs switched in the late 80s and early 90s. Never heard of anyone wanting to go back.

BargeMonkey · May 13, 2015, 09:43:57 PM

I should have done it when my 353 puked but couldnt tie up the machine any longer. Doesnt look like an extremely hard swap. I would go 4.5 Powertech personally. :D

treeslayer2003 · May 13, 2015, 10:10:01 PM

Peter you would need a different converter for the cummins, i checked into it. the duetz would have to be a 5 cylinder and will be to long. i opted to fix the detroit and get good ear muffs.

deastman · May 13, 2015, 10:38:18 PM

20 years ago I swapped out a 4-53T Detroit for a 6BT Cummins in a Clark 667 grapple skidder. It was a fair amount of work and did all the fabrication myself to make it fit but it was well worth it. Transformed the skidder into a totally different machine. Instead of stomping the throttle to the floor to get it to go you had to just crack it above idle and it was pulling, the difference was like nite and day. I would highly recommend making the swap, you'll have a totally different machine

HiTech · May 14, 2015, 07:37:05 AM

I like the Deutz. A 5 cylinder Deutz is around 97 HP and sips fuel and has great lugging ability. Not to mention starting real good in cold weather. They are even a fairly quiet engine even with a straight through exhaust. If my Ford diesel ever goes up I will have a 4 cylinder Deutz which is around 78 HP, which would be good power for a C4. The biggest thing with a Deutz is to keep the cooling fins clean. Also there are not many people who will or can work on them....at least around here. The good thing is they don't seem to need much work.

stoneeaglefarm · May 14, 2015, 08:04:26 AM

Forgot to mention, Have a Clark, and a 208 timberjack, Anyone done swap overs on ether one.

logger123 · May 14, 2015, 10:55:24 AM

stick with the detriot

Woodhauler · May 14, 2015, 07:10:20 PM

Quote from: stoneeaglefarm on May 14, 2015, 08:04:26 AM
Forgot to mention, Have a Clark, and a 208 timberjack, Anyone done swap overs on ether one.

Guy I haul for put a deere motor in his older 225, not a big deal!

rkultra · May 14, 2015, 07:45:07 PM

I put a 6 cylinder deutz in a 1980 Clark and it went in easily, the motor is long but without the rad there is plenty of room. It matched up to the machine nicely, it pulled well and I ran it for 5 years without any troubles.

rkultra · May 14, 2015, 07:47:32 PM

It was a 664 C, I forgot to mention.

David-L · May 14, 2015, 07:56:34 PM

I have had a duetz 5 cylinder in a 225A Jack and it was a great motor but expensive to fix when you had to do jugs, etc. The bosch injection pump aint cheap either. I'd stick with the Detroit and make a muffler/ baffle system.

lopet · May 14, 2015, 10:04:07 PM

I agree the Bosch pumps are pretty pricey, but don't think the engine parts are that bad. You can buy the after market kit for $ 250 per whole or $ 350
- 400 for the original parts.

David-L I think you and I have something common, but we are just wired different. :D :D

timberlinetree · May 17, 2015, 05:57:43 AM

Our franklin 132 forwarder was converted to a JD 4.5 power tech. Would love to do the same to the 230 e skidder but probably never happen.

stihlboy32 · August 07, 2015, 04:59:19 AM

What all did you have to convert on your clark skidder deastmen to make the cummins work. I have a old 667 myself with the 4-53 Detroit

dgdrls · August 07, 2015, 07:41:39 AM

When I was surveying and doing lots of lay-out for homes, roads and utilities we worked
almost exclusively for one Earthworks contractor. They had Detroit powered pans, loud and thirsty devils
but they ran all day without issue. The shop mechanic pulled the oldest pan from the fleet and did a Cummins
conversion to it. Fuel cost dropped about 50% and you could actually have a conversation on site.
Operators quickly learned that was the machine to have.

Detroits are dandy and certainly worth keeping, the magic is to find a way to quiet them down.

DGDrls

dustyhat · August 07, 2015, 08:45:05 AM

I do know it can be done, we have a 353, load and cranky. a freind has the same skidder only its got a cummins . comes through the woods and all you can hear is the brush popping and cracking.

loggah · August 07, 2015, 05:45:27 PM

My first skidder was a 1979 230 Timberjack ,great little skidder,but after a few years i got tired of listening to the Detroit, i bought a 1986 tree farmer C6D long frame 6 cylinder Deutz and 24.5 x 32 rubber!!! pull half again as much wood with half the noise!!!

larry1 · August 07, 2015, 08:26:34 PM

My 230 is currently under repair as you can see in my post . I have the 3-53 out and also wondered about changing over to something else with equal torque and H.P. but for now I'll put up with the noise . My buddy has a 240 3-53 with a turbo and it sounds quit like a cummins in the bush and pulls real good . When I was a kid the guy I worked for had a 200 gas , it failed and we extended the frame to fit a 6 cyl int. gas . It pulled real good but could never keep gas in it .

stihlboy32 · August 07, 2015, 08:29:52 PM

ive heard of ppl pulling the 453 out and dropping in a cummins i was really woundering if the bell houseing are diff. my clark has a 3 speed power shift

deastman · August 07, 2015, 09:48:11 PM

Quote from: stihlboy32 on August 07, 2015, 04:59:19 AM
What all did you have to convert on your clark skidder deastmen to make the cummins work. I have a old 667 myself with the 4-53 Detroit

I think the bellhousing had to be changed and the motor mounts had to be fabricated. I also built a new intake pipe from the engine to the air filter using aluminum pipe and elbows and welding the joints. It really wasnt that bad to make the switch but it was well worth it, totally different skidder when I was done

Ryan D · August 08, 2015, 07:58:05 AM

I used to run a 207TJ that had been converted over to a perkins. That thing was so quiet half the time I would forget to put my ear muffs down. I'm looking to get rid of my 230 right now because of the Detroit. It's a great motor but I can't stand the noise anymore.

BargeMonkey · August 13, 2015, 11:08:37 PM

I let a friend borrow my 230 forwarder for a bit to cut a long skid job, he hadn't been around a 353 in a long time, after about 4-5hrs in the cab you want to put your head under a wheel. A 4.5 powertec deere would be my choice, nothing wrong with a 4BT, just prefer the deere parts and I think they live longer with proper care.

ga jones · August 14, 2015, 03:25:46 PM

Put a turbo on it and a bigger muffler. It'll be as quiet as a cummins. If you have the time money and know how to do a swap then you should be able to upgrade your Detroit to a silver clone. (Way easier and cheaper).If your going to do all the work a swap takes then inframe the 353 put 18:1 trunked pistons n50
Injectors and a Green turbo. get the head gone over. All readily available. $2-2500 done. Get a Detroit guy to set your rack or you'll waste your money

BargeMonkey · August 14, 2015, 11:39:46 PM

Quote from: ga jones on August 14, 2015, 03:25:46 PM
Put a turbo on it and a bigger muffler. It'll be as quiet as a cummins. If you have the time money and know how to do a swap then you should be able to upgrade your Detroit to a silver clone. (Way easier and cheaper).If your going to do all the work a swap takes then inframe the 353 put 18:1 trunked pistons n50
Injectors and a Green turbo. get the head gone over. All readily available. $2-2500 done. Get a Detroit guy to set your rack or you'll waste your money

It's called "load it on the trailer and let it be someone else's noise maker", kind of solution. Forwarder is a tough sell around here without a dozer bunching that's why I haven't chased a 6 wheeler. Mine gets used about 2x a yr. Kind of on the bottom of the list for replacement right now. Swenton's in lake George did my engine 3yrs ago, and it runs well but if I can avoid sinking 1 dime into the machine I will between now and upgrade.