Question about what loggers will and will not take

[beemickdee]

Hey folks-

I'm new here, just registered! I live on a farm that was my wife's family's farm. Now it's owned by a landowner; the farm space is rented by a farmer up the road from us, and we pay rent to him. When my in-laws still lived here, my father in-law installed an OWB, and got most of his wood from the excavating company he worked for. After they moved, our neighbor, who also worked for that company, was able to get us substantial amounts of wood in addition to cutting dead fall from a stand of trees on the property. He moved, too.

So, last winter I went out to the stand and cut down about 10 trees, mostly walnut, and that's gotten us through most of this winter. At the end of last winter, I went out and cut down a few more, and started cutting them into rounds and left them there to get later in anticipation for the winter we're experiencing now, as well as next winter. The farmer never told me to stop, and we've never met the landowner, so I figured I was in the clear. Well, back in November or so, I noticed orange paint dots had popped up on most of the trees in our stand- dangit.

They've started cutting, and what I want to know is- will the logger collect all of the wood I've cut into rounds? I know they'll leave behind the tops of the trees which will probably yield a fair amount for me to pick from when they're done, but will the rounds be any good to them, or will they (hopefully) leave them behind? They're 18" in length and ranging from a foot or two in diameter to approaching three feet.

[WDH]

I seriously doubt that they will take the rounds unless they desperately need firewood at home. 

[thecfarm]

beemickdee,welcome to the forum. I don't see what they would want them for in stove wood lengths.

[clww]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum.
As the others have posted, your rounds should be safe.

[BBTom]

Oh my goodness.  Walnut logs are going for $2.00 to $2.50 bdft in this area.  If you where cutting down my walnut trees to make firewood, I would be quite upset. 

One walnut tree with 24" diam and 33' of trunk would be worth about $900. 

You will have lots of smaller limbs to cut up and burn.

[beenthere]

Welcome from here too.

Have they put a "cease and desist" order on you cutting any more trees for firewood?

Walnut, to me, is not very good firewood. ;)

[beemickdee]

I realize now that walnut is a.) worth a good bit of money and b.) burns quickly and isn't the greatest firewood. You live and you learn, ya know (I'm a young guy from the suburbs (29) so farm life has been an experience).

The trees I'm concerned with that I've started cutting into rounds are what I believe are locust, mostly probably about 1.5-2' in diameter and maybe 30' tall. The one I'm most concerned about is what I think is a very large oak of some variety (clearly I need to study species identification more) that I could probably get about 35 rounds out of, at about 3' diameter- I reckon I could get about a month's worth of firewood out of this sucker. I've already cut it into four sections, some of which I've already rounded out.

I have not gotten a cease and desist, but I did introduce myself to the logger the other day and he said they'll be taking all of the marked trees, and "possibly" clear cutting- for sawboard and pulp. I mentioned that I'd cut a few down last winter (long before any trees were marked) and he said that the deal was he could take whatever was usable. So there's that. I'm just trying to find out if what I rounded out will be gone when they're done.

[Southside]

Like the others said the wood you have already cut is probably quite safe - but personally I would not drop another tree until I spoke with the land owner, especially the oak you have your eye on.  Depending on the laws of the state you live in technically you could be committing timber theft.  Talk with the logger and see if he would be willing to set aside a few pulp / junk trees for you to use as firewood.  Broken pieces, rejects, rot, that they pile off the side of the landing would all be there for you. 

Just imagine if your land owner never spoke with you and took food out of your freezer when he was hungry  - and since you never told him to stop he figured he was in the clear - how would you react to that? 

This is not one of those situations when it is better to ask for forgiveness rather than permission.  If one of our tenants was cutting down trees and never asked they would be out the door and paying me back for sure, now if they asked ahead of time I would point them in the direction of what I wanted removed and would be happy for it. 

[beemickdee]

Like the others said the wood you have already cut is probably quite safe - but personally I would not drop another tree until I spoke with the land owner, especially the oak you have your eye on.  Depending on the laws of the state you live in technically you could be committing timber theft.  Talk with the logger and see if he would be willing to set aside a few pulp / junk trees for you to use as firewood.  Broken pieces, rejects, rot, that they pile off the side of the landing would all be there for you. 

Just imagine if your land owner never spoke with you and took food out of your freezer when he was hungry  - and since you never told him to stop he figured he was in the clear - how would you react to that? 

This is not one of those situations when it is better to ask for forgiveness rather than permission.  If one of our tenants was cutting down trees and never asked they would be out the door and paying me back for sure, now if they asked ahead of time I would point them in the direction of what I wanted removed and would be happy for it.

This has all crossed my mind  :-\

I'm definitely not looking to cut any more trees down- I'm just trying to get the most of what I cut down before they marked trees. I'm starting to think I probably shouldn't even continue cutting the stuff I've put on the ground until they're done and I can see what's left.

[thenorthman]

Yeah, you need to clear that with the land owner, chances are they don't care, but if they do...

The loggers have better and bigger things to worry about then a little pile of firewood, and since you talked to the guy the will probably leave it mostly alone, it may not be in the same location, and it may not be neatly stacked, but it should all be there.

Unless they come in with a chipping crew, there should be gobs of tops and culls that make excellent firewood, probably more then a few years worth.

And I would leave that large oak alone until after the loggers have gone.

[beemickdee]

Yea I think I'll leave the oak alone and just hope they leave it since I've cut into it a bit.

The logger did say there'd be a lot left behind; he didn't say anything about a chipper, but who knows what the landowner has in mind. The only thing I know about the landowner is that he's part of a family that owns a big concrete business and owns lots of land in our area. My understanding is the land we sit on is more or less being used as a trust fund for his grandkids. I certainly don't want to end up with concrete shoes at the bottom of a pond as a result of this. I've got a wife and 1.5 kids.

[Mooseherder]

He might leave you more than you need now that you have let him know.

[beemickdee]

That would be great. That's kinda what I was hoping to accomplish by speaking to him. Mom always said I have the gift of gab, haha.

[Mooseherder]

Bring them a Pizza around lunchtime. :D

[AvianQuest]

The landowner is getting paid out of what the loggers take away and sell.  So anything you take away is money out of the logger's and landowner's pocket.

It's no different than a farmer getting a crop harvested by a contractor and if you go in ahead of time and take some of the apples, corn, etc. home with you, then it's money out their pocket.

[beemickdee]

Bring them a Pizza around lunchtime. :D

That's a really good idea, actually. Maybe I'll have my wife whip up a batch of cookies for them or something. My job makes it so I'm not at home during lunch most days. Someone of the female persuasion bearing goodies may convince them to leave behind a lot more than I could.

I worked for a deck company in college, and I remember how much we appreciated the clients who would buy us lunch, and sometimes even beer, haha.

[beemickdee]

Thanks for the advice, fellas. I feel less uneasy now, and I think I'm just gonna keep myself out of the woods and hope they leave behind everything I cut down, even if it's not fully rounded out.

Any idea what the chances are that they take the stuff I didn't start rounding out for pulp?

[beenthere]

rounding out

What do you mean by "rounding out" ?  I'm gathering that it is bucking the logs to your firewood length.

If the material is in 8' lengths of longer, I'd suspect they will remove it. But firewood lengths, then I don't think they will mess with it. May push them aside so they don't have to drive over them.

[beemickdee]

Yea, I mean bucking. Guess I don't know my lingo that well.  :

[thecfarm]

Some are just more picky than others.  :( 

[Magicman]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, beemickdee.   

[stumphugger]

Loggers like cookies.  Chocolate chip oatmeal cookies will be scarfed up unless you give them to the boss and in order to keep them for himself, he hides them from the crew.  That has been known to happen and may make for a surly, mutinous crew if they find out.   ;) 

I have rewarded loggers with cookies for pulling my pickup out of a ditch, or for doing an excellent job of logging.  They can become spoiled though.

[treeslayer2003]

I need to speak with my forester about this cookie deal........I feel a bit cheated lol

[WDH]

When the logger gets finished cutting on my property, I give the crew some rib eye steaks  :D.  Nothing wrong with cookies, though  .

[thechknhwk]

Not to be a jerk, but if you don't have permission you're stealing someone's natural resources.  If it was my land I would be extremely peeved.