skid steer

slider · April 20, 2012, 01:42:55 PM

anyone using a slid steer around their mill ? i'm thinking about a used bob cat.i need one that will move a fairly big log say 2000 lbs maybe .the bigger ones are real pricey.what size do you think i should be looking for ? and how many hours before you start getting big repair issues .i could get by with one with wheels instead of tracks . thanks al

ruren · April 20, 2012, 03:05:14 PM

My bobcat is one of my favorite tools. I have only had the sawmill a month or so, but I have used a skidsteer to move a lot of logs for other purposes over the years and it works great. The biggest issues I have with it are traction and visibility. It has a lot of blind spots, especially to the rear, and it is easy to spin the wheels in mud or snow. A tractor is much better in those categories, but the loader on the skidsteer is much better than one on a small tractor.

Mine is a S175 bobcat, which is 'rated' at 1,750 pounds. As I understand it, that is half the weight it would take to tip it, so a 'safe' rating rather than its actual limitations. I have regularly moved 2,000 pound loads, plus the couple hundred pounds of the forks, without trouble on even ground.

beenthere · April 20, 2012, 04:29:42 PM

The downside for a skid steer (for me) is getting in and out.
If a short, quick job, then one gets a good workout in the legs and knees crawling in and out of a skidsteer.
Much rather step up onto the platform of a tractor with FEL and forks to move material. Even then, on and off can get to the knees in short order. The pits to get old, but one doesn't need to rush it any.

Too often a load in the bucket is held off the ground for a period of time (bucket in the air) which means the unsafe exit and entry into the skidsteer (or stay put while someone else tends to the load held high.

However for longer tasks, one stays put for longer periods of time than just loading a log or two onto a mill. Bibby's Terex looks easy to get in and out of.

chevytaHOE5674 · April 20, 2012, 04:53:46 PM

I love my bobcat but it is a pain to climb in and out of as Beenthere pointed out. Once in it is comfy and a pleasure to run, but if you are doing small quick jobs that require frequent enter/exit then it gets tiresome in a hurry. And you really can't/shouldn't exit the machine when you have a load up in the air. They are very hard on the terrain, no matter what surface you run it on the ground will get torn up; that's just the nature of how they turn. Also as stated visibility to the sides and the rear isn't that great but you get the hang of "knowing" where the edges of the machine are.

Having said that I wouldn't give up of my skid steer without a fight. It makes quick work of many jobs and fits lots more places than even the smallest loader tractor.

JBS 181 · April 20, 2012, 06:20:07 PM

Will have to agree with previous remarks on skid loaders. Hard to get in and out of, Yes! some are worse than others. Tear up the ground. They are hard on the ground but I have always said because they are so quick and agile that you can repair what you tore without much effort. That is all I use is a skid loader. I think they are much easier to see out of when picking up logs doing bucket work etc. There are blind spots behind them. All the weight either empty or loaded is much more compact. I have a grapple I use with mine and wouldnt do without it. Attachments are a huge plus and easy to hook up.

T Welsh · April 20, 2012, 06:22:03 PM

I use both. and like both for different reasons. but if I had to choose just one it would be the skid steer,because of the attachments that can go on it,small and compact,enough hydraulic power to lift 2500lbs. draw backs are they tear up the ground anywhere you go,worthless in mud unless you have tracks (we have them) and getting in and out of them is a real pain in the knee,s and back. visibility is not great unless you have the arms raised. But with all that said they are great tools for the right job. Tim

ArborJake · April 20, 2012, 08:26:47 PM

I like skid steers for the same reasons as Tim. We bought one to run tree spades for digging tree's and find it gets more use than we thought it would. Uses for a skid steer are infinate. They are also built real solid and can take alot of abuse if you get a little rammy like I do.

mikeb1079 · April 20, 2012, 09:07:27 PM

i bought an old skid steer off of craigslist for cheap. it can only lift around 800lbs but even so i use it all the time. i'd hate to lose it. a real back and time saver. 8)

red oaks lumber · April 20, 2012, 09:18:53 PM

i dont know what brand of skidsteere you guys are complaining about. mine is real easy to get in or out and the visability with the boom down is great.
so that is some thing to take into account. if they took my skid loader away i would quit the wood buisness on the spot no mistakes about it. yes they rip things up but alot depends on the operator.

chevytaHOE5674 · April 20, 2012, 10:01:28 PM

Quote from: red oaks lumber on April 20, 2012, 09:18:53 PM
i dont know what brand of skidsteere you guys are complaining about. mine is real easy to get in or out and the visability with the boom down is great.

I've driven all different brands and everyone I've operated required you to climb over the bucket and through the ROPS to get to the seat. A tractor with FEL you just step on and sit down.

Visibility in the front of the skidsteers is usually great, its the visibility to the sides and behind you that isn't good. Between the ROPS, and the rear motor and counterweight there is a lot of blocked visibility. Compared to a tractor where you can look all directions and see just about everything.

IMO/IME each one has their own unique characteristics and specialties. I wouldn't trade my skid steer for anything but I wouldn't give up a tractor either.

Kansas · April 21, 2012, 06:46:44 AM

We have two at the mill. Both New Holland. We used to have Bobcats and I tried a New Holland. Never looked back. They have done us a wonderful job. Any skid steer worth a hoot will be pricey. But they are invaluable. you can do just about anything you want to with them. And you can always rent an attachment to do something else for a one time application. We run an L185 and a 190. The 190 will pick up a full bundle of OSB off a truck, about 3800 lbs. Its not rated for that, but it does it. Bear in mind that low to the ground, when you get used to running one, you can kind of scoot and get the log to where it needs to be. We have never had a log, either with Bobcat or New Holland, that we couldn't get a log to the mill.

Al_Smith · April 21, 2012, 07:30:28 AM

I don't own one but have access to a New Holland 550 Delux .It will lift a tad over a ton with no problem .

I actually used it to move a red oak log that weighs around 12,000 by moving one end of the log around at a time .It won't lift it but you can move it .

sparky1 · April 21, 2012, 08:02:29 AM

I grew up with skid loaders. They like everyone said are one of the handiest tools you can own. I wanted to purchase one (used) last year, but you cant find a decent used one for under 15000. So i opted for an older tractor with a FEL.

So comparing the two. I can get around alot easier and alot faster with a skid loader. I can see what Im going to pick up with the bucket alot easier with the skid loader. My tractor I cant see the cutting edge of the bucket. I feel alot safer in a skidloader operating in the woods too. Their built like tanks. You have a full rollover cage, and Ive droped trees on top of the cage before. no damage done to the skidder. You do that to a tractor you will have major damage. I dont recommend droppin trees on skidders, just say it can happen!! 8). The attachments are endless as stated before.

Like others said though. Skidloaders arnt worth a crap in ice, or deep mud. You can get tracks though. Then there hard to stop. They are very pricey. I dont know what to say about a good machine and the price, It all depends on how the person beofre you took care of it. Unless its someone you know, im guessing it got the crap beat out of it. they can be unhandy to get in and out of, but no way does it offset how much time it will save you in other way!

on a side note they do make skid loaders that you can actually get in and out from the side. Ive seen them. It was a track machine. I dont recall the name of it. I never tried to get in and out of it either, so i dont know how ackward it was.

slider · April 21, 2012, 08:07:53 AM

thanks guys for the input now what do you think for hours on a used machine .what would be high hours on one of these machines ?

Al_Smith · April 21, 2012, 08:36:37 AM

:D I wouldn't go as far as to say they are entirely worthless in mud but to navigate mud you'd best have a good set of tires .The machine I have access to is used in the tree service biz and has intentionally somewhat "bald eagle " tires to lessen the effect of tearing up the sod .

I don't care if it's a wheel tractor,crawler or skidloader mud can mire the best of them .Trust me I've stuck them all at one time or another . :D

If it were myself using a skidder in the woods it would most likely have a set of tracks .

Then comes the greatest problem of them all which is finding a decent machine for a reasonable price .Few and far between .

Norm · April 21, 2012, 10:13:05 AM

Now all you have to decide is if you want to go with tracks or wheels. :D

Kansas · April 21, 2012, 10:32:01 AM

We have always gone with tires. The reason being, most of our time is on concrete or gravel. I just replaced the factory ones at 750 hours. There wasn't anything left to them. If you are out in the timber, and that is the main place you would be using it, then I would go tracks. The alternative is you can get some fairly cheap steel tracks that go over the tires. They look to me like its pretty easy to put them on and off.

sgschwend · April 21, 2012, 11:46:04 AM

All Terrain Fork Lift: made for working in soft soils or gravel, easy to climb in, excellent lifting power, can load trucks (even dump trucks), price is better, portable, has the safety devices for lifting and climbing out of machine with the forks up.

This may not be popular to add this next part; I do so with the greatest respect to everyone here:

If you have a skid steer you should only climb out over the bucket with the engine off: If you are climbing out under the bucket you have the wrong application. This link has some good info:

http://nasdonline.org/document/1934/d001877/skid-steer-loader-safety.html#3

kderby · April 21, 2012, 01:16:07 PM

Thanks for this thread. I use a Mustang and just got an offered a New Holland 185 as an upgrade ($$$).

The Safety info is superb because I am new to skidsteers and the crew will need some training as well.

I do appreciate my rough terrain forklift. The skid steer with bucket and forks makes a good contribution to my operation.

Kderby

ruren · April 21, 2012, 01:46:51 PM

Quote from: slider on April 21, 2012, 08:07:53 AM
thanks guys for the input now what do you think for hours on a used machine .what would be high hours on one of these machines ?

I think thats an "it depends" question. My machine has 980 hours and is as good as a new one except for a few dings and scratches. I have seen 4,000 hour machines that were well maintained and 2,000 hour machines that were junk. From what I have seen I think once you get around 4,000 hours they are getting up there to the point of being old, but I am not an expert by any means.

When I bought mine I got the impression that the condition of used skid steers varies widely. Seems like some people take care of them as an expensive tool they need to maintain, and some people consider their durable nature a license to abuse them.

Al_Smith · April 21, 2012, 02:04:07 PM

Oh come on now they aren't that bad to get in and out of .Geeze I'm 64 years old and perhaps still spry as a cat but I don't have any problems .--A product of clean living perhaps --- :D Now off for my daily dose of Geritol .

Shawn S. · April 21, 2012, 02:58:51 PM

Quote from: sparky1 on April 21, 2012, 08:02:29 AM
I grew up with skid loaders. They like everyone said are one of the handiest tools you can own. I wanted to purchase one (used) last year, but you cant find a decent used one for under 15000. So i opted for an older tractor with a FEL.

So comparing the two. I can get around alot easier and alot faster with a skid loader. I can see what Im going to pick up with the bucket alot easier with the skid loader. My tractor I cant see the cutting edge of the bucket. I feel alot safer in a skidloader operating in the woods too. Their built like tanks. You have a full rollover cage, and Ive droped trees on top of the cage before. no damage done to the skidder. You do that to a tractor you will have major damage. I dont recommend droppin trees on skidders, just say it can happen!! 8). The attachments are endless as stated before.

Like others said though. Skidloaders arnt worth a crap in ice, or deep mud. You can get tracks though. Then there hard to stop. They are very pricey. I dont know what to say about a good machine and the price, It all depends on how the person beofre you took care of it. Unless its someone you know, im guessing it got the crap beat out of it. they can be unhandy to get in and out of, but no way does it offset how much time it will save you in other way!

on a side note they do make skid loaders that you can actually get in and out from the side. Ive seen them. It was a track machine. I dont recall the name of it. I never tried to get in and out of it either, so i dont know how ackward it was.

The skidsteer in question is a JCB Robot, very nice machine.

WoodMiller · April 21, 2012, 06:51:26 PM

I use a Bobcat 753 with a grapple, built in 1997 and has about 6700 hours on it. Starts and runs great, has a couple of hard-to-get-to hydraulics leaks that will force me to spend some money on it, eventually. I can handle most any 8 to 10 foot logs that fit in the grapple (about 36"). If it can't lift them, it can still move them to the mill with some damage to the landscape, and it can help load and turn the really big ones when you have a mill operator and a skid steer driver available. They are also great for breaking down a pile that has sawlogs mixed in with the firewood. You don't get in them - you put them on like a coat and follow all safety rules including the seat belt for any use. I paid about 5300 at auction for mine, and have stoppped using the Massey Ferguson 245 with FEL because the skidsteer is so much safer and nimble. I won't load a log on the mill with a FEL and forks, but the grapple makes it easier to avoid dinging the mill. If you can find one that doesn't require starting fluid, doesn't smoke, doesn't leak engine oil and has good cylinder seals - go for it.

DR Buck · April 21, 2012, 08:06:53 PM

I bought a used 2003 Gehl 6635 2 years ago. I don't know how I got by without it. It's not all that hard to get in and out of. Maybe it depends on the size of the operator.

Mine is rated at 3800 lb lift. I have the regular bucket, grapple bucket, and pallet forks. The pallet forks are on it most of the time.

It's a wheeled unit but I have steel over-tire tracks that I leave on all the time now. It's kind of like driving a roto-tiller if you're not careful. ;D I still use my Kubota a lot around the mill because it's a little easier to handle.

slider · April 21, 2012, 08:17:55 PM

thanks again for all the input ,i think ruren got it right on the hours of service ,some people do maintenance properly and others just wear them out and get rid of them.i have been trucking for years and know what to look for on a used truck but on a skid steer i'm lost as an easter egg.the hard starting,oil leaks ,physical damage ,cylinder leaks or hoses i can work that out .building an engine is not a real big deal but the transmission is something that i have little knowledge of.i'm in no hurry ,just window shopping.i was hoping to find one for around $8500 but that may be wishful thinking.anyhow great thread thanks for your opinions al