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Buying a skidder

Started by buck5611, January 09, 2005, 08:13:31 AM

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David_c

guy was telling me there (Deere) iscomming out with a 848 :o

Scott

 That's just what the operator told me, they just bought a new excavator(kobelco) and small dozer(deere) so I'd think they shopped around. I'm pretty sure Deere's 848 is already available ???. I'd still buy a cat dozer over any other brand and i think their excavators are right up there. A lot of loggers seem to like thier 535, 545 and crawler skidders out west. Those are pretty rough conditions out there and they seem to hold up well. I'm not  trying to knock other brands, just putting my 2 cents worth in.  :)

duramax

The 848 is actally the Timberjack 660 painted yellow. Jd engine and axles.
1999 Timbco T455D , 1999 Timberjack 560 dual arch grapple, 1987 Timberjack 450 cable , 1998 Husky Brute XL235 loader w/slasher

skidderman

I first started running a john deere 440 a cable skidder in 1969 at 8 years old.today I am 45 years old and am skidding with a john deere 440b cable skidder still setting my own ckokers and bumping the knots.

timberjack240

skidderman
sounds like you and my pap would get along good. hes 58, had his femur bone busted in december of 03 , and still cuttin/draggin himself except for a day now and then when my uncle cuts a couple for him. i work with him in the summer but hes still goin strong - knock on wood - he even cuts em apart by hand when he doesnt use his slasher

Frickman

timberjack,

You wrote that it's not that hard to learn to steer a Timberjack, and once you do it comes naturally. That may be so, but I have employees, and I don't need something else to complicate things for them. With most of them the steering wheel is the only thing they can figure out, and I don't need to take that away from them.
If you're not broke down once in a while, you're not working hard enough

I'm not a hillbilly. I'm an "Appalachian American"

Retired  Conventional hand-felling logging operation with cable skidder and forwarder, Frick 01 handset sawmill

Pretend farmer when I have the time

tiny3

hi
our logging operation is looking at buying a 848g(660 timberjack)to replace 1 of our older 748e ;),any one know much about them.also can you get them direct drive or are they all powershift.
regards tiny3
artest formely known as tiny

duramax

As far as I know they only come in powershift. They have the JD engine, axles and grapple. You can check out the specs here:[ftp]http://www.timberjack.com/downloads/pdf/skidders/660D-Brochure-NA.pdf
1999 Timbco T455D , 1999 Timberjack 560 dual arch grapple, 1987 Timberjack 450 cable , 1998 Husky Brute XL235 loader w/slasher

tiny3

thanks alot duramax, ill see how i go
artest formely known as tiny

timberjack240

frickman

"but I have employees, and I don't need something else to complicate things for them"  :D  i know how that is not knowin but they ll catch on 
my pap says it takes a real logger to run a timberjack with all the levers sticking at ya. he was kiddin but i thought it was funny   ;D

Ironman

440s are great machines.  I am trying to buy a 440C right now.  The 518s are awesome but you can't find them anywhere and salvage parts are extremely hard to come by since people who own them seem to always repair them and keep them running.  Reason being the South Americans and other very remote logging operations are sucking them all out of North America.  They are extremely reliable in very high humidity regions because they have no electronic components.

You can sell a completely ragged out, salvage 518 to someone in Bolivia or Brazil or Africa for $10-12,000 USD.  They will take them and completely rebuild them using CAT technicians overseas that are top-notch and earn only a dollar or so per hour.

The 518C has acheived cult status, just like the 450C TJ and the JD 440C.  I beleive the new machines are just as good, but with the only exception being they are complicated.  The more complex somethin gis the more likely it is to fail.

Also the new machines are so big.  It seems to me that CAT and JD, if they were smart they would come out with a smaller machine that could satisfy the mom and pop select cut logger as well as overseas eco-sensitive markets where wheelbase dimmensions drive much of the loggers buying criteria in an effort to appease governmental restrictions.

Ironman

Jesse Sewell
Ironmart Sales
888-561-1115

Ironman

CAT 525B - JD 648G3

The JD is a great Skidder but it is at least $20k more than the 525B and that is if you are here in the Southeastern US where prices are more competitive and JD makes a real effort to discount there machines.  I can't say that the G3 is that much better of a machine.  If you have a logging operation, how much wood do you have to skid to pay for that extra $20 or $30k plus interest over several years.  In some parts of the country the difference is even more significant, as the previous fellow pointed out.

JD has the reputation for Skidders...but CAT is killing them on price and the 525B is a great machine.  If it is taken care of the drivetrain will easily outperform the Deere.  I have seen CATs with ten and eleven thousand hours with all original components.  What's more when er run pressure tests on the main hydraulic pump, transmission and engine they are all spot on spec.  Granted these are machines that had one-owner and were properly maintained.  Since Deere changed there engine design they have not had the same famous reliability.  I talk with loggers from all over the country and this is just what I am hearing.

Ironman
Jesse Sewell
Ironmart Sales
888-561-1115

tiny3

hi guys
well im finally retiring the jd 748g and have brought a 560 d timberjack(748g3 painted green)with low hours on it.in ten years(22000hrs)the old 748g has had 3 sets of tires,9 hoses and 3 hrs welding on it.were now going to re bush it and give a paint job to be used as a spare skidder.have had ALL the other brands of skidders but nothing compares with the jd,not even close.now to find some deere stickers for the new skidder..... :D
artest formely known as tiny

Hoop

$10000 - $15000 for a 440B with a gutted engine is an outrageous price.  About the only way its worth this much is if the remainder of the skidder is so clean you can eat off it.  And you know for a fact that the skidder was used exclusively by a little ol grandma that used it to haul a few drags of firewood  every fall.

Of course, with it sitting out in a field for the last 7 years, we all know that it will require significant work before you can even think about hooking up that first drag of wood.   Hoses are probably all shot.  It may have water seepage into the hydraulic system.  The transmission is a big question mark.  Tires probably gutted/dry rotted as well.

$5000 for a machine of this caliber IMHO is too much.  Too many unknowns.  The person that left the machine sit for 7 years had a major case of stupidity.  If you believe stupidity needs to be rewarded, go ahead & buy the machine.

You can purchase a 440B, maybe even a 440C or 440D in running condition ready to work for $15000. 

WAGZ

there's an old lumberjack about 20 miles south of me that has an old JD 440 , its in running condition and he's got it for sale , asking price is $6000.00
I'd do the same for somebody I liked !!

Kodiakmac

Hi Buck5611.  Good choice if the buggy is in decent shape.  I just bought an old 440 JD this morning after spending months looking at JDs, TJs, TFs.  Had my eye on an old TF in good shape but owner never got winch problems sorted out.  I don't get hung up on the make.  Whether its a JD440, a TJ225 or a TFC4, if you get a good one and treat it well, they'll serve you well.   On the downside, JD axle/planetery and hydraulic components can take a real bite out of your wallet when compared to the TJ and TF stuff, but, on the other hand, the engines and trannie components are the same as in farm tractors, so those used parts aren't too pricey.

Checklist for buying a used bushbuggy is the same regardles of make:

Check engine oil, hydraulic oil for water.antifreeze contamination when the machine has been parked for a few days.  just crack open the oil-pan drain plug a wee bit and let out a 1/2 cup of fluid...if it doesn't look like waste oil, it's probably water or antifreeze.(Water in hydraulic fluid not usually a big problem, but water in engine oil can be)

check pins at the tickle points (have the owner raise front end with blade, put skidder in gear and let the clutch in an out a few times, if the pins/bushings at the articulation points are shot, you'll see the machine buckling up/down at this point)

Check brakes and clutch by holding brakes, putting trannie in a lower-mid gear, and letting out clutch while reving engine.  If engine doesn't stall, the clutch is shot...if you go ahead, brakes need work.

Check skidder and winch by using it. 

As far as price goes, I paid $13,500 Cdn. ( think we're at .84 US) and other than a leak in one of the steering rams, this machine is in great shape (engine totally rebuilt last year and all axles/planetaries changed wihin last 2 years, tires at 70% and 1 set ring chains included)  Hope this helps.

I know that there are lots of other folks on this site who can add to this checklist.  happy Skidding!

God luck with it.



Robin Hood had it just about right:  as long as a man has family, friends, deer and beer...he needs very little government!
Kioti rx7320, Wallenstein fx110 winch, Echo CS510, Stihl MS362cm, Stihl 051AV, Wallenstein wx980  Mark 8:36

zackman1801

the JD 440 is a good machine, they will pull good and do what you need them to do. but after running one i know they like to be tippy and can turn over easily so watch yourself on side hills and uneven ground.
"Improvise, Adapt, OVERCOME!"
Husky 365sp 20" bar

Arich

I have a Tree Farmer C6D. The machine is rock solid and the only complaint I have so far is that amount of attention I have had to pay to the winch. I may be wrong but I think that the John Deeres didnt have planetarys.

Stephen Alford

A lot of the older skidders only had one cylinder in the middle for steering.  I would consider a  skidder with dual cylinders worth just a tad more. Stephen   ;D
logon

zackman1801

a little off topic but how do you steer skidders like that, ive seen some with controls like a dozer, and then i saw a Clark ranger the other day that had nothing, just a flat dash and 2 pedals one on each side. On the sides of the seat  it had 4 levers, one prob for blade, one for winch, one for brake mabey whats the other for?  and how does it steer? really strange. ive see tree farmers with the sticks you move but nothing like that.
"Improvise, Adapt, OVERCOME!"
Husky 365sp 20" bar

Maineloggerkid

Clarks steer with a lever down by your side. It would take some getting used to. Timberjacks steer with a lever right in front of you- usually the one on the far left of the dash panel, and you move it up for left, down for right (I think).
JD 540D cable skidder, and 2 huskies- just right.   

Loggers- Saving the world from the wrath of trees!

J_T

T J 225 that I got  is far right  winch center stear far left blade .Stear lever is a tad longer than the others . Thank they make a conversion to install a half wheel  ???
Jim Holloway

Maineloggerkid

I ran my buddies 240A, and I thought that the steer was far left, maybe not.
JD 540D cable skidder, and 2 huskies- just right.   

Loggers- Saving the world from the wrath of trees!

J_T

Some may be or someone may of changed it cause they liked it that way ??? :D :D
Jim Holloway

Maineloggerkid

ya. I don't know- I just ran it for a little while- I stick with john deere for my own skidders.
JD 540D cable skidder, and 2 huskies- just right.   

Loggers- Saving the world from the wrath of trees!

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