cercular sawmill

[jdeere540a]

  hi i'm new to the forum and to sawing lumber.  i rebuilt an old belsaw mill last year.  i don't no the exact model i think it is an a16 it had Babbitt bearings and a flat belt feed.  any way my question is i have 2 48 inch saws 1 has 52 teeth 1 has 36. which would be better for sawing hardwood like oak.  the 52 tooth saw has 2 1/2 style teeth the 36 tooth i'm not sure haven't looked at it yet. 

[dgdrls]

Hi johndeere540a,

How much power do you have to work with,
That will be a factor in your choice.

Best
DGDrls

[beenthere]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum.

I'd suggest on the belsaw, that the 36 tooth saw is your best bet.

[jdeere540a]

i'm running the mill with 48 hp Oliver diesel tractor direct pto
   

[Chuck White]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, jdeere540a.

[bandmiller2]

Welcome 540, with your power your better off using the 36 tooth saw if its a good saw and tensioned right. Be aware a 48" saw is a little large for a Belsaw arbor, I know many have used that big a saw but be carefull not to crowd it. We have many Bellsawyers here. Frank C.

[Ron Wenrich]

The 2½ style is used more for softwoods.  Like the others said, use the 36 tooth blade.  To find the tooth style, you will find it stamped on the shank. 

[Magicman]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, jdeere540a.   8)

[jdeere540a]

thanks for the info. i was also wondering if any one knew where in new hampshire you can get saws harmed.  i tryed the 36 tooth saw sawing pine and no matter  what i did it would walk in the cut.  the 52 tooth saw saws very nice in pine but chatters if your not very careful in hardwood like oak.  i manly saw pine and hemlock but would like to saw some oak trailer planks and some timbers for a scoot.

[reubenT]

Almost same situation here. Although been a band sawmiller for years but never had anything to do with circle mills.     Now I sold the band mill and just went and dug a friends old belsaw out of the bushes beside a creek.  Wood beams all rotten,  I'm going to put it on steel. it has roller block bearings on main shaft, a bit newer than babbit.    And I got a few questions as well.  Like what are the circle diameters for the different teeth sizes?   3 blades with it, 2 are insert tooth.   One is a 44" with 26 teeth,  2.125" dia holes for the inserts.  the other is 52"   60 teeth and 1.75" holes.  no bits or shanks for either one.  I have no idea what size bits to order.   Guess I better start with the 26 tooth blade,  it's probably the better size for it.     Supposedly it was having cupping problem when it was run last. (somewhere around 26-28 years ago)   I suppose I should get new bits n shanks and try it for myself.  Then have it worked on if needed.  Likely will need it hammered/tensioned and looking for that service too.  Need to saw everything from super hard black locust to soft poplar. 

[Ron Wenrich]

If there are no bits or shanks in the saw, putting in new ones won't mean that it will cut.  Whenever you change shanks, the saw should be hammered.  The new shanks can change saw tension. 

[bandmiller2]

Rube, your right the 44" saw with 26 bits would be correct for your Belsaw. The 52 is just too large for your arbor which is probably 1 3/4" diameter. Clean off the shanks on your 44" they are probably Simonds "B" series it should be stamped on the shank. Would be good to put it on steel if its heavy enough. There are sites on the net that show the dimentions for setting up a Belsaw. What are you planning to power it with, its hard to beat a large diesel tractor as all tractors have built in governors that are important in maintaining correct hammered speed. Frank C.

[reubenT]

there are no shanks to get any info from.  And it's not a Simonds 2 circle, just one circle.    I have a ford 3000 diesel tractor to power it,   40 hp.    I also have enough beams to do 2 mills. 30 ft long 12" tall steel I beams.    It has about 38 ft of carriage track so I'll cut one beam to lengthen 2 others and make about  a 40 ft twin beam frame.   I have lathe and milling machine to make and repair stuff as well, with the usual shop stuff, cuttin torch, arc welder,   chop saw,   etc.    I remotely remember the owner mentioning many years ago that he gave the bits and shanks to someone who needed them.    So I suppose it'd be good to just find a good blade hammerer and get it serviced and he can put the right bits in as well.     And I suppose I could ship it to Jeff in PA if I can't find good service around here. http://www.sawdoc.com/sawpounding.htm     (you could do that too JD540  if u can't find a local pounder )  But there are enough mills around shurly someone still does it.   Just can't find any listed on the internet for our area.  I will ask around.
   And another little quirk,   there's an extra shaft I can use that's much larger,  babbit bearings,  very heavy flatbelt pully on it.  Maybe 10 ft long.    Has the carriage drive pullys on it as well. Missing the nut and outer blade hub,  (I could make those on the lathe)   But of course way too big for the little belsaw.
I might get parts for a bigger mill later on.  with mandril and the 52" blade all I'd need is the carriage, track, and sawdust disposel stuff.     I would enjoy finishing the 40 hp steam engine I started building several years ago to power it, and other things like the sorghum mill.   but for now the tractor will do the job. 
   

[Ron Wenrich]

Call a local mill and find out where they get their blades hammered.  Many times saw docs also carry mill supplies.

[reubenT]

Will do.   The mill owner told me the teeth were B type.  (He's in southern MS, mill was on his son's place a few miles from me where he used to live, and he's glad I want to restore it to function.)   I looked at a picture of B teeth and knew he was mistaken.  Then  went digging in the box that was with the old mill,  down in all the mouse nest debris  found a few old rusty shanks and bits that fit both blades.  Comparing them to pictures I see they are size 2 1/2 for the large blade and 3 for the smaller one.   I have a few things to do before I can start on it,  but won't be long.

[bandmiller2]

Rube, almost without exception the guys that hammer saws sell bits and shanks. Use the original Belsaw arbor as the HD arbor would be awkward to fit. The advantage and curse of the Belsaw is the axle under the carriage. It gives you a compact unit that can be driven with a tractor PTO from the rear out of the way. But it limits the heft of the carriage and the size of the wheels as with large wheels you would loose too much of the saw cut. Alas you have a log on a creeper. Rube theirs nothing on that mill you can't make or improve upon. What usally happens is you get one mill setup then run across a couple more you can't pass up. In our neighborhood its Lane and Chase. If your planning to cut large heavy logs or cut for hire you may want to setup a heavy duty mill, for yourself the old Belsaw should handle it. Frank C.