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10 degree blade for drier logs or? - softwoods

Started by OlJarhead, February 25, 2016, 04:03:02 PM

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OlJarhead

Here's something I was thinking about today: would you use a different blade for milling drier logs (say one year since felled and bucked) on softwoods or the same one you use when fresh/wet?
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

terrifictimbersllc

If they're on the ground they're not dried out.  Up on a pile maybe drier but not necessarily a different blade.  What styles are you starting out with?  I guess if I were using 10s and having trouble with waves and I knew the blades were sharp, I'd go to 4, 9 or 7 in that order if I had the choice.  Sharp 7s are downright awesome and work for me in just about everything except very wide white oak, or spruce.  For the white oak 4s are my choice, and for spruce, 7s set at 30 thousandths.
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

OlJarhead

Standard 10 degree 045 bands.

Good point on the ground vs stacked.  Also have some fire 'kiln dried' (lol) trees to try to mill which I expect may be dried out...with luck not cracked up but we'll find out.
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

justallan1

I use the 10 degree on both green trees and the fire killed and don't feel a bunch of difference.
Didn't you mention the fire killed trees were from a fire last year? Our fire was in 2012 and this year the trees 2' and under aren't gong to make lumber, possibly the bigger ones will yield a little.

ncsawyer

I ordered two boxes of 7 degree 0.045, 1.25 inch blades with my new mill (just like yours except has the small diesel).  I mostly cut pine and some of it has plenty of knots. 

I was not overly impressed with the performance.  Brand new out of the box blades did fine, but did not take long to start waving over the knots.  Maybe two or three logs. 

I changed to a 4 degree, 0.055, 1.25 inch blade and it is like night and day.  That blade can saw "all day" with out a change.  I am exaggerating a bit, but not much.  If you're cutting 2x stuff it will do 2,000 feet if the logs are clean and still won't make waves on the knots. 
2015 Wood-Mizer LT40DD35
Woodmaster 718 planer
Ford 445 Skip Loader

OlJarhead

Quote from: justallan1 on February 25, 2016, 04:56:27 PM
I use the 10 degree on both green trees and the fire killed and don't feel a bunch of difference.
Didn't you mention the fire killed trees were from a fire last year? Our fire was in 2012 and this year the trees 2' and under aren't gong to make lumber, possibly the bigger ones will yield a little.

So 4 years and not much good wood in them?  I think you're saying that with less than a year they might have some good wood but I'll suggest they stick with the biggest trees if that seems to be the better approach.

Either way, I'm milling by the hour so if the smaller ones might yield some useful lumber I'll test some out and see if they want.
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

OlJarhead

Quote from: ncsawyer on February 25, 2016, 05:00:38 PM
I ordered two boxes of 7 degree 0.045, 1.25 inch blades with my new mill (just like yours except has the small diesel).  I mostly cut pine and some of it has plenty of knots. 

I was not overly impressed with the performance.  Brand new out of the box blades did fine, but did not take long to start waving over the knots.  Maybe two or three logs. 

I changed to a 4 degree, 0.055, 1.25 inch blade and it is like night and day.  That blade can saw "all day" with out a change.  I am exaggerating a bit, but not much.  If you're cutting 2x stuff it will do 2,000 feet if the logs are clean and still won't make waves on the knots.

Interesting.  I used only 10 degree blades with the LT10 and had great results on pretty much everything.  Only time it ever got wavy was when I was lazy and let it get dull
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

drobertson

some folks switch up, others do not, I am a do not once I resharpen, I am at about a 5° maybe six,  knots are the issue for the most part, so I am thinking you will have a curve to figure out with your area and timber you are sawing, they are all real close to the same, so it's not rocket science, just what fells and works best for you,, it most likely will be a time trial basis for you and any others that are wondering,,conditions vary so it's a go with the flow that works,
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

OlJarhead

Tahnks :)  I'll start playing with it Sunday if all goes well.  Then later in the week and so on...can't wait to get an actual weekend or week up there to do some serious work!
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

justallan1

Quote from: OlJarhead on February 25, 2016, 05:13:01 PM
Quote from: justallan1 on February 25, 2016, 04:56:27 PM
I use the 10 degree on both green trees and the fire killed and don't feel a bunch of difference.
Didn't you mention the fire killed trees were from a fire last year? Our fire was in 2012 and this year the trees 2' and under aren't gong to make lumber, possibly the bigger ones will yield a little.

So 4 years and not much good wood in them?  I think you're saying that with less than a year they might have some good wood but I'll suggest they stick with the biggest trees if that seems to be the better approach.

Either way, I'm milling by the hour so if the smaller ones might yield some useful lumber I'll test some out and see if they want.

I've heard people say they'll go punky in a year and others say 3-4 years. It could be different where you're at.

OlJarhead

Pretty dry here so more likely dried and cracked but we'll see.
2016 LT40HD26 and Mahindra 5010 W/FEL WM Hundred Thousand BF Club Member

barbender

     Ponderosa doesn't seem to stay solid for very long. I was out west this fall, Black Hills and Wyoming and a lot of the beetle kill Ponderosa didn't look like it had been dead that long, but it looked punky. Similar to Red pine here, whereas our Jack pine can stay solid dead standing for a long time (similar to lodgepole for you westerners  ;) ). I have Red pine logs that have been sitting for 3 years (WAY too long). Due to the fact that they are 2' in diameter they still have some usable lumber inside. They are as wet as the day I cut them, except for the ends maybe. I use 7s for most everything now, but I have had some struggles in wide cuts in pine. I may have to try a 4 again. Jarhead, congrats on that beautiful orange machine, BTW!
Too many irons in the fire

kensfarm

I cut some dry pine that was dead standing.. it was as hard as hickory.. waving up at every knot.. it really surprised me at first.  Put on a new sharp blade and it was fine.  I was using 8 degree Cook's Super Sharp DuraTooth.. really like this blade.. on my 3rd box of 20.  Cut mostly white oak and pine w/ them. 

jaysaint

hi oldjarhead,  i was talking to our friends at wood-mizer  portland and suggested i try some 9 degree blades on my lt10  that i am taking delivery on saturday i will try them on some dry storm damaged fir i have and will let you know how they work, congrats on the new  mill.  jay
grandburg mill,  stihl 066 husky 562 xp,  felling axe    oh also lt 10

Ox

When I milled the toughest, driest wood of my life I ended up using 4° bands.  It was black locust that had been seasoning for roughly 10 years.  This stuff made my chainsaw whimper a bit.  It was the hardened tool steel of the wood world.  10s cut it but went all over the place and bogged the engine.  4s cut a bit slower but nice and smooth and flat without bogging the engine.  I'm going to try 4s exclusively this year.  Others swear by them.  Hopefully I will too.  Got a lot of nice and knotty red pine to mill this year and I'm thinking the 4s are just the ticket.
K.I.S.S. - Keep It Simple Stupid
Use it up, wear it out, make it do or do without
1989 GMC 3500 4x4 diesel dump and plow truck, 1964 Oliver 1600 Industrial with Parsons loader and backhoe, 1986 Zetor 5211, Cat's Claw sharpener, single tooth setter, homemade Linn Lumber 1900 style mill, old tools

Brucer

I use 10° blades for green WRC, Douglas-Fir, Larch, Ponderosa Pine, White Spruce and Birch. Even if the log has been sitting around for a year they work fine.

I resaw dry Douglas-Fir logs cants with the 10° blades as well -- no problem.

The one thing I could not saw straight with 10° blades was dry Spruce. I tried every trick in the book to avoid waves and it made no difference. So at Wood-Mizer's suggestion, I tried out the new (at that time) 7° blades and they worked like a charm.

As for longevity, Douglas-Fir and Larch don't decay too quickly even after a couple of years on the ground. You might get some sapwood loss on the lower side.

Other species, especially the Pines here in the Pacific Northwest decay pretty quickly.

Douglas-Fir, Larch, and Ponderosa Pine are all fire resistant species. The bark swells up in a fires and acts like an insulator.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

JustinW_NZ

Just out of interest why are people arnt people using 1 1/2" bands (.45s)?

I find the band with the more meat in it does the best over most other things.

I run the smaller roller guides and get about 15 sharpens out of the 1 1/2" bands - basicly when they start to wave or are just to thin..

Cheers
Justin
Gear I run;
Woodmizer LT40 Super, Treefarmer C4D, 10ton wheel loader.

dgdrls

Quote from: jaysaint on February 25, 2016, 10:46:09 PM
hi oldjarhead,  i was talking to our friends at wood-mizer  portland and suggested i try some 9 degree blades on my lt10  that i am taking delivery on saturday i will try them on some dry storm damaged fir i have and will let you know how they work, congrats on the new  mill.  jay

Jaysaint,

did you ask on availability of 7 deg bands for the LT10,   From my limited experience, the 9 deg bands cut a little better in
most logs but still suffer in the hard stuff and create head-shake in the little 10.

Dan

jaysaint

did you ask on availability of 7 deg bands for the LT10,   From my limited experience, the 9 deg bands cut a little better in
most logs but still suffer in the hard stuff and create head-shake in the little 10.                         Dan ,  i asked about 4 degree blades and was told they weren't available from wood-mizer,  the salesman assured me i would be more than happy with the 9's.  I  am hoping  that the wood-mizer people would be experts in the area of blade choice for our area.   Can't wait to start sawing...  jay
grandburg mill,  stihl 066 husky 562 xp,  felling axe    oh also lt 10

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