Useful sawmill mods

[jpgreen]

THose are nice Chet.

I've designed some adjustable leg extensions for my LT 40 with feet to use on various terrain. 

I wish you could come by and help me get my woodmizer sharpener and setter set up, and show me how to use it. Jeff said you would probably come by for some extra gas money..  :D

[chet]

 With da price of gas it would be a pretty sizeable investment ta get me dat far.  :D  Dat's not ta say I'd turn down da offer.  ;D

[Bibbyman]

We just installed a BIG mod to LT40 Super.   We made it into an LT40 Super-Duper! 
 


We bypassed the two factory hydraulic pumps and connected up a new 6 gpm @ 2000 psi pump.   It's powered by a 7.5hp 3ph motor and has a 20 gallon tank.



As the new pump assembly sets in a little 8x8 shed behind the sawshed,  we ran the hoses under ground and cased them inside a section of 2" pvc.

The connections inside the Wood-Mizer box was pretty uneventful.  I just undid the little wire that goes from the micro switch to the solenoids and pulled the hoses from the pump and return side and hooked up the hoses from the new pump.

Zip, zip, zip!  The hydraulic functions go without the "winnnng" sound of the 12v motors in the box.  It's kind of fun!

[jpgreen]

Bibby... and the Bionic Wood-Monster..  :D

[woodbowl]

Oooooooohh  Bibby, you have truly out done yer self now. How much faster is it than the double pump system? Did you have to bump up to a bigger size Hyd line? How much have you operated it now? Are you using the same banks as with the 12v units? And a bunch of other questions. 

Well .............. I wuz doing a pretty good job of keeping this quite untill I saw your "Super Duper".  I've been working on a little upgrading myself. Here's a pic of the extra pump I put on my LT40 "manual" ready to be hosed up.
I think I'll call it the "super duper manual monster".  ;D  If you keep on doing stuff like this, I may have to put on three pumps.  :

[Bibbyman]

We've not really done much with it yet.  I just got it up and going just afternoon.  At 6gpm and 2000 psi it was meant to equal - not necessarily be faster or more powerful than the factory pumps.  (I don't want to be breaking things and Mary doesn't want it throwing logs over the mill.)

The major difference is..  the factory 12v pumps may pump near 6 gpm when not under load but will "pull down" under load so the gpm drops off to something like 2.5 gpm.   That's both pumps performance added together.

This pump will pump 6gpm until it hits the setting on the bypass valve.  The pump was set by the builder at 2000 psi but can be adjusted up to 2500 psi.   There is a pressure valve on the valve body that's set at something like 2200 psi.

I'm not sure if it's going to be a good thing or bad thing.  Sometimes when you have something under load – like turning, you'd maybe be better off with it going slower as it was lifting more weight.  The peak psi should remain the same so the job will get done either way.

I made no modifications to the mill.  I just ran the in/out hoses form the new pump up through the bottom of the existing box and bypassed the 12v pumps.  I did run 1/2" lines from the pump and back but the builder said 3/8" would carry 6 gpm just fine.  I just happened to have one 1/2" line that already had one 1/2" connection on one end and a 3/8" on the other.  The return line didn't need fittings as it was just a slip on connection.



If you notice on the left end just behind the drain valve handle,  I had the builder to add an extra bung plug.  It's for a heater element.  We didn't have the heater put as it would have taken couple of weeks to get it.  We won't need it until winter for sure and maybe not then.  But we got the hole incase.  I added a gate valve in the drain plug hole so I could attach a hose and open the valve to drain it.

I think a 20 gallon tank is way overkill but the builder insisted it was needed for cooling.  I don't think so in this application as the hydraulics are really not used that much – only a few seconds then with a good time to rest between.  But we may someday add a log deck and who knows what else.  The bigger tank didn't add much to the cost but getting an extra 10 gallons of hydraulic oil was a bit.

[iain]

So you've deffinetly decided that you want a stationary mill then?


nice going there with the pump



iain

[Bibbyman]

So you've deffinetly decided that you want a stationary mill then?

We decided on that some 10 years back.  This 2002 mill is 3ph and set up stationary from day one. 

We're just trying to make it into an LT200 one part at a time. 

[iain]

I'll try that again

So you've deffinetly decided that you want a stationary mill then ;)?


iain ( what you doing out of bed at this hour)

[MULE_MAN]

LT200  Gary you crack me up  :D :D :D


But if anybody can do it,  You can  smiley_sidelightbulb

                        Good Job    smiley_clapping

[wiam]

Who is Gary? ??? ??? ???

Will

[MULE_MAN]

BIBBYMAN  is Gary Warden    as in Warden saw mill


Actually it's probably Mary's Saw Mill, But we won't go there  :D   :D  ;D

[iain]

Gary   Mary  its only one letter  ;)



iain

[Bibbyman]

For sure, we're not the first to give a Wood-Mizer mill a heart transplant.  ElectricAL has run his on a power unit for some time.  I bet he wasn't the first either.

I think he's mentioned something about his setup before but maybe he'll give us an overview of his hydaulic system mod.

[logwalker]

I think your hydraulics person was correct to size the 20 gallon tank to handle the constant use of the pump versus intermittant use as before. The pumping action will generate considerable heat over time. I am assuming that you will leave the pump running while sawing. Is that correct? LW

[jpgreen]

Now for the ultimate "Cat's Meow" in systems oil filtering...

http://www.bypassfilter.com/photos.htm

-wipe your rear and filter your oil at at the same time..  :D

[Bibbyman]

Son and I just came in from sawing a dozen 8x8s x 10'.  Mary came out to inspect our work and check out the new hydraulics system.   I got a big  and  from the boss.

The hydraulics are plenty fast - maybe a little too fast on some operations like the log turner.  You have to 'feather' the valves to ease things along so it'll take a little getting use to.  We could put a flow reducer in the line I guess.

Probably 4-5 gpm would be more equal to the performance of the LT40 Super.

[red]

sounds great !

glad to hear the woodmizer R&D shop is still going strong.

[ElectricAl]

Bibbyman,

6 GPM is a lot of oil

Now you can lift a log, move the clamp out and swing up the Bibbyman Backstops all at the same time ;D




This is from an earlier post............

We use to use two Interstate Battery Deep Cycle batteries and a charger. We ruined those new batteries in less than 6 months. I called the tech line in Texas and they said to try the Workaholic. So, we ordered 2.  They lasted 8-9 months before the lead plates rotted out. The charger was on a timer to keep from boiling the water. Once a month we had to add distilled water and check with a hydrometer.

We saw a lot of big Oak logs and really work the pump and batteries hard.
After 5 sets of batteries we decided to switch to an AC powerpack.

We removed the factory pump and tank. Then added a 3 HP 220v pump and tank. Hoses go from the pump to the WM manifold and valves. The WM valves trigger a bypass solenoid on the pump to pressurize the the manifold. We let the pump run on bypass while we saw so we don't have to wait for the pump to get going every time a lever is pulled.

The pump is from Monark, the same supplier for the factory WM 12v DC pumps. Our AC pump flows more oil at higher pressures than the 12v DC pump.  The motor, pump, and tank assembly cost $1000 delivered, and another $100 for hoses. 12v DC power is supplied to the valve bank from a 120vAC to 12vDC converter from Radio Shack. The converter turns on when the pump is started.

The conversion took one big full day

More info :

Our power pack is at least 4 years old and we are on our 3rd electric motor :
The first two had the capitors go up in smoke and burn the windings.
The by pass is set at @ 2000psi and we hit it every day.
Our sawmill is a 93' and that era 12volt pump produced 1.2 gpm @ 2000psi
The power pack makes 2.04 gpm @ 2000psi.
We could have handled a little more gpm because the factory valves are rated @ 2.8 free flow.

4-5gpm would be nice for three handle operations.

When the motor or pump fails we'll order a bigger pump and motor, but not a 6 gallon unit. Way too much for our antique.

[Tom]

having all that oil is a good thing.  It keeps the oil cool, which is important for the longivity of the oil and the hoses as well.  Hot oil will deteriorate the hoses.

The volume and the shape of the container is important to protect the pump.  If your bulk container is too small or too short, a whirlpool can develop that will cause the pump to draw air.  Air bubbles cause cavitation and will ruin the pump by eroding the metal.   It is a good thing to have a lot of oil in a narrow and tall tank.

[Bibbyman]

The builder explained that this tank has the intake on one side and the return on the other side.  Down the middle is a baffle so the oil will circulate.

It's also got a combination oil level and temperature gauge.  I noted today we ran it about 4 hours and it got up to about 120 degrees F.  It was 80 when we were running it.

[VA-Sawyer]

Bibby,
Do you have some kind of electrical connection between the pump and the mill to operate an unloader valve ?  You don't want the pump making pressure except when you are moving a hydraulic lever. Electric Al has one on his setup, but I didn't see where you said anything about one on yours.
VA-Sawyer

[Bibbyman]

Bibby,
Do you have some kind of electrical connection between the pump and the mill to operate an unloader valve ?  You don't want the pump making pressure except when you are moving a hydraulic lever. Electric Al has one on his setup, but I didn't see where you said anything about one on yours.
VA-Sawyer

I don't have.  Is there some reason to think I need one?

[ElectricAl]

Bibbyman,

Just checking.....you do not have a zero pressure dump circuit,
and your WM valve manifold is pressurized all the time.

That may explain why the oil is heating up.

If you are constantly on a pressure by-pass, several negative effects happen. High amp draw is one and extra wear on the pump is the other.

VA-Sawyer is pretty sharp, he picked up on information given and not given ;)


We have a 5 gallon tank and the temp gauge is room temp at the end of the day.

The way we are set up is the oil exits the pump and goes to a 12v dump valve. The oil goes back into the tank with no pressure through the dump valve. When we pull the WM hydraulic lever 12v power goes through the contact and to the dump valve on the power pack. Once the dump valve gets the 12v it closes and pressurizes the line to the WM valve manifold. It takes less than a full second to get something to move. Our 93' requires around 500psi to get things moving. Once the WM hydraulic lever is released, the dump valve opens and the oil goes right to the tank.

[VA-Sawyer]

Great explaination there, Al. Couldn't have said it any better myself.  Bibby, you need to get some form of unloader because the WM valves are not open-center type as far as I know.
VA-Sawyer