Advise for a noob

[GrantCalloway]

Hi, GC here. Thank you for accepting me FF. I'm planning on building a 22x30 cabin out of logs (Hardwoods mostly). Not to big maybe between 8"/10 diameter. We are a family of five, wife, adult son and two teens. We are all down to work on the cabin this summer through the winter if needed. My question is since we are in need of some wood (besides de logs), should I get a chainsaw mill or a band saw mill. I have two chainsaws 16/18 in chainsaws  STIHL but I'm planing to get a MS 661 R C-M  and a panthermill if that option is necessary.  I don't have much money since most of it will go to the cabin, but I have around $2800 I was thinking of a entry level bandsaw mill from Woodlands, if that is the option chosen by yall. As you see we have 6 months deadline, which option would benefit our project. One more thing we want to get into making all kinds of goodies with our wood and maybe sell some slabs or wood to others in need. Thank you in advance.

[Chuck White]

Welcome to the Forestry Forum, Grant!

If you're thinking of an entry level sawmill just for the cabin project, I think it would be just fine, but if you plan on sawmilling for others after the cabin, you might want to go a little bigger!

[TKehl]

1.  Is this going to be a log cabin or stick (lumber) built?
2.  What other wood do you need.  Standard dimensional stuff?  
3.  Are the logs "free" or do you have to pay for them?

[GrantCalloway]

1.  Is this going to be a log cabin or stick (lumber) built?
2.  What other wood do you need.  Standard dimensional stuff?  
3.  Are the logs "free" or do you have to pay for them?

TKehi,
1. Log cabin
2.Yes, I will need standard dimensional for, the roof build, door frames. window frames and such
3.Logs are free

Timber forest I will be getting my wood from for the build.

Thanks in advance.

[TKehl]

1st, PLEASE tell me you know how to identify Black Walnut!  Hard to tell for sure, but looks like some in there.

2nd, have you considered hiring a portable sawyer?  With a tight schedule, it may be prudent.  You can save some $ buying a small bandmill, milling, then reselling the mill over buying lumber, but not much.  It only really saves you if your labor is free and time is abundant.  (Which it sounds like time is not.)  Chainsaw mills are cheaper, but much more labor per board.  Best for only unique and oversize.

Also, many sawyers will reluctantly admit to buying 2x4s for building projects as it can be cheaper than blades, gas, and labor...

3rd, plan to allow extra chinking between the logs as it sounds like they will be cut green and will shrink as they dry.  Dimensional is nice to have dry, but doesn't really shrink lengthwise, so not as big of a deal there.

4th, you may want to check out the Granberg beam machine or minimill.  Chainsaws aren't too bad at making beams as there are fewer cuts per board foot of product.

My $.02

[GrantCalloway]

I'm trying to learn how to identify them. I have no idea how they look since I always lived in the city. Our goal is to finish the cabin by Dec. but if if we cannot we will be working hard to get it done by spring. Hopefully we will get it done. Thanks for the great advise.

[thecfarm]

GrantCalloway,welcome to the forum.
How are you getting the wood to the sawmill?
You will need a Logrite canthook or peavey. Sponsor on the left.

[GrantCalloway]

How are you getting the wood to the sawmill?
You will need a Logrite canthook or peavey. Sponsor on the left.

Thanks!  I will be buying a couple for my family. 

[SawyerTed]

Welcome to the forum!

That's an ambitious goal!  Cutting and skidding 200 plus logs to a construction site (that's 100 plus trees to cut).  Then building a cabin out of those logs.  Preparing the notches then lifting all those logs into place.  Add on the milling of the dimensional lumber, and you've got a lot to do before spring!  This is especially true if you are building a full foundation, adding electrical and plumbing etc.

+1 on hiring a sawyer.  $2,800 will buy a lot of sawmill time.  If the logs are properly prepared and staged, you can have all the lumber you will need in a couple of days given that the logs are large enough.

You've got plenty to do without learning to operate a saw mill in the time frame you've described.

[GrantCalloway]

Welcome to the forum!

That's an ambitious goal!  Cutting and skidding 200 plus logs to a construction site (that's 100 plus trees to cut).  Then building a cabin out of those logs.  Preparing the notches then lifting all those logs into place.  Add on the milling of the dimensional lumber, and you've got a lot to do before spring!  This is especially true if you are building a full foundation, adding electrical and plumbing etc.

+1 on hiring a sawyer.  $2,800 will buy a lot of sawmill time.  If the logs are properly prepared and staged, you can have all the lumber you will need in a couple of days given that the logs are large enough.

You've got plenty to do without learning to operate a saw mill in the time frame you've described.

SawyerTed,
Thanks for the excellent point. $2800 buys a lot of milling! The cabin most likely will be build with butt and pass method, there is no notches just rebar holding the logs in place. The foundation will be slab on grade and it will take place by the end of June 2018. It will be power by solar, mostly 12v and a 5500 generator for back up. Plumbing with be the simplest. The hardest part is the logs and logging them. I do like the $2800 to hire a sawmill man. Thanks a million.

[Ljohnsaw]

 :P
Ambitious plan!  Are you thinking of having the logs cut on three sides?  That would give you a consistent height and a smooth(er) interior wall.  Would also make it easier to make the walls plumb with a flat surface to measure/level.  In your initial post you mention "(besides de logs)" so I wasn't sure if you meant D shaped logs or THE logs.

Not to burst your bubble, but I've been working on my timber frame cabin going on 4 years now.  I only have 5 or 6 months where it is possible to build each year and most of this time was spent on the massive foundation/basement and cutting wood, mostly working by myself.  My dream is to get the frame up this year. :-\

[GrantCalloway]

ljohnsaw,

My bubble never gets burst. Yut Yut..  No, flat surfaces but logs all around. We we will have five bodies to work on the cabin, not one. I'm the oldest, everyone else is on their prime. Our plan is to spend 168 hours erecting the four walls and framing the roof. Basic materials needed for the walls? Logs and rebar. While the walls are been raised to only 8.5' with a pulley system and come alongs, the other person would be milling pieces for the roof frame work. We have figured the four walls can be done between 48 to 64 hours. Our main concern is to build the main structure first, cabin walls and framing roof then move on to the rest .I will be documenting everything on video, from foundation to finish. It will be a fun project to accomplish on that time frame and I'm down to get it done. I appreciate your input. Maybe when I'm dome with mine I can help with yours ;)

[rjwoelk]

I thought butt and pass cut their logs flat and always the same hight  so that it stays level. You  may have a lot of gap if the logs are not uniform in size.

[GrantCalloway]

rjwoelk,

Here is a pic to explain the process of butt and pass and NO we dont cut the logs nothing like the picture there. The pic is an example of the set up.

[mike_belben]

Look into a cordwood cabin, you can build one with a chainsaw and a wheel barrow.  Hoisting hardwood timbers 7ft up is serious business.  


A cheap bandmill will smoke a chainsaw mill in every way except portability and cutting big logs.  Id bet 5x the output or more in the bandmills favor.  If you can get the logs to it.  


But no really, consider a cordwood cabin especially if you have pine or cedar.  If not just call a few landscapers / tree surgeons and say youll buy sound pine logs or bucked rounds for $25 a dump load delivered.

 I would use the cash to buy lumber at the cheapest mill now and get framing with the older boy.  Set the other two to cutting/splitting/stacking the infill as it turns up.  Im not talking out my butt either, i have plenty of trees and equipment to build any way i want.. Cordwood in a timber frame is the type of house im buildng.  Round posts and all. 

[GrantCalloway]

mike_belben

Excellent input, I did look into cordwood and I even bought a book, is funny how it just popped up. I was considering it but I had no pines or cedar, but your idea of buying the wood from sawmills, landscapers and three surgeons is excellent. I'm gonna start looking at that option too. Thanks a million for your input. GC

[mike_belben]

Glad to be of service mr grant. 

[TKehl]

Cordwood in a timber frame is the type of house im buildng.

Straw bale in a timberframe is another good option.  That would probably be my path if we weren't buying and renovating the house my grandpa built.

Glass bottle walls look pretty cool to, but I'm not sure how practical it would be other than for a shower wall.

One more thought, considering your climate (assuming KS), any opportunity to go a little below grade will help a ton with summer heat.  Not meaning a cave, but consider an "earth contact" home.  My parents house is earth contact and it heats and cools easy.  Remember, winter heating off grid is easy, just burn more wood.  But cooling off grid is HARD*.

*Caveat, you can cool your house with a wood fire.  Uses a chemical thermal cycle the same as or similar to propane powered RV refrigerators.  (Crosley Iceball)  This is occasionally used in large commercial applications, but has never come into vogue on a small scale outside off grid fridges and freezers.  It's on my project list with a priority of, "would like to do this before I die,"  so pretty low.   :

[mike_belben]

bigtime.   Shade trees, window placement, orientation of the foundation and roof pitch, and mostly... Physical mass.  The heavier a place is the smoother its thermal flywheel becomes.  

Redneck tip of the day.  Dorito bags are made of mylar on the inside, probably among the most solar reflecting materials on earth.  Now im not saying that you should staple it to cardboard and stick that in the crazy sunny window thats cooking you out of your singlewide or anything but.. Ya know.. Country boy can survive and all that. 

;)

[TKehl]

I do like me some Doritos.    ;D

And we are back to food...   ;)   :D

[GrantCalloway]

Whoa whoa!! Now I have to buy a ton of Doritos on sale?

[GrantCalloway]

The project will be in Missouri.

[mike_belben]

Whoa whoa!! Now I have to buy a ton of Doritos on sale?

Does a man need an excuse?

[TKehl]

The project will be in Missouri.

8)
I thought those woods looked familiar.  Mixed Oaks (Looks like White, Post, and Willow Oak from the picture), potentially some walnut, with a spattering of Elm, Hackberry, Mulberry, Hedge, Honey Locust, and a few others.

[GrantCalloway]

I wish I knew all of them you mentioned. Any advise in learning the trees? I have been looking at ways but I might have to hire a forester to tell me exactly what I got. Anyone know of any? And how much they charge?