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Looking for the right equipment

Started by zak1983, June 25, 2012, 05:38:02 PM

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zak1983

Hello all
I just bought 55 acres in breckenridge colorado & i have dense forests full of lodgepine pole. I'd say about 30% of it is dead, so I'd like to start making some progress clearing out the dead trees- standing and fallen. I'm thinking that for now I'd just find an area to start stacking logs, and I'm looking for the right equipment to move & stack. I think I'd rather put my budget toward that than cutting- I can stick to a chainsaw for that.

I'd like to keep to $30k or so if possible. I have going through the property a driveway that switches back and forth, so while it is dense, I can start clearing along the driveway pretty easily.

Not sure if these would be relevant, but I've got gator on tracks & a rubicon.

This is my first piece of land, so any recommendations would be awesome! Thanks!

treefarmer87

Welcome to the forum what are you going to do with the timber. a tractor or bobcat might work out good. or maybe a small skidder or forwarder.
1994 Ford L9000
2004 Tigercat 718
1998 Barko 225
1999 John Deere 748G
FEC 1550 slasher
CTR 314 Delimber
Sthil 461
Sthil 250

Woodhauler

If its just a clean up job and you got 30grand i would pick up a nice 4x4 tractor and farmi winch! You could get many years of use put of it around your land. Get a 40 hp or so.
2013 westernstar tri-axle with 2015 rotobec elite 80 loader!Sold 2000 westernstar tractor with stairs air ride trailer and a 1985 huskybrute 175 T/L loader!

zak1983

Thanks for the quick advice. Frankly I don't know what to do with the timber yet. I'd like to look at getting a mill, so I can use the wood for projects & firewood. It seems like the area has a ton of extra wood, so I dont think its worth trying to sell?

I'm leaning toward a tractor- seems to be pretty universal all around. For a property with slopes, what kind of tractor would you recommend?

zak1983

Also, there are large stacks of wood now from when they cleared the road. I assume something with a grapple would be better for things like that?

If i went the forwarder route, any advice on size?

Weekend_Sawyer


yup, I'd vote a tractor with Front end loader and grapple attachment and logging winch behind. You will find a lot more uses for a tractor.

Jon
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

Woodhauler


Usally the stacks of wood that comes from road clearing is a tangled up mess! Did they cut it first or just bulldoze it up in piles? If you plan on living on the property i myself would get a tractor. If its really hilly you might later on pick up a cheap skidder to work the steep ground and when its done resell it!
If i went the forwarder route, any advice on size?
[/quote]
2013 westernstar tri-axle with 2015 rotobec elite 80 loader!Sold 2000 westernstar tractor with stairs air ride trailer and a 1985 huskybrute 175 T/L loader!

Woodhauler

Quote from: Weekend_Sawyer on June 25, 2012, 06:31:19 PM

yup, I'd vote a tractor with Front end loader and grapple attachment and logging winch behind. You will find a lot more uses for a tractor.

Jon
Another year older, happy bday!!!
2013 westernstar tri-axle with 2015 rotobec elite 80 loader!Sold 2000 westernstar tractor with stairs air ride trailer and a 1985 huskybrute 175 T/L loader!

thecfarm

zak1983,welcome to the forum.I myself would get a 40hp 4 WD with a 3 pth winch,as mentioned. A forwarder would be even better,but 30K won't buy much of one,unless you can work on them yourself. I suppose you have chaps,hard hats,steel toe boots,eye protection. Watch out for those dead trees,they don't behave the same way as a live tree.
rubicon,is that a jeep?
Slopes can be worked on with a tractor,just have to work straight up and down. The winch will help alot on those. Just won't set no records on getting the wood out on the hills.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

barbender

Weekend Sawyer gets cherry cheesecake! Happy Birthday! Zak, I think these guys are pointing you in the right direction.
Too many irons in the fire

zak1983

Since everyone keeps mentioning 40hp, I assume that's for safety?

Thanks again for the advice.

Okrafarmer

Quote from: zak1983 on June 26, 2012, 12:20:27 AM
Since everyone keeps mentioning 40hp, I assume that's for safety?

Any smaller, and it won't do enough. Much bigger, and it starts to be awkward. I would suggest a tractor in the 40-60 hp range, 4wd, with grapple loader and winch. And ROPS with canopy, preferably 4-post in stead of 2. The canopy is to give you some measure of protection from falling limbs as you work. Now getting one used for under $30,000 that meets all those criteria may be challenging, but should be doable. Try looking on Tractorhouse.com
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

beenthere

Just as a ballpark, with the 40+ hp in mind, a Deere 3720 compact utility is $20-25k and 44 hp, inclucing FEL. Add a winch for $3k and you will be under the $30k.

But there are other brands of used tractors that will fit your bill nicely.

I too would suggest over 40 hp if you are thinking winch and grapple.

Finding a dealer that you like close by for a good relationship will be of top importance IMO. They need to be handy for those times something gets broken (and it happens no matter how careful we are).

I've a 32 hp, Deere 4300 and find it will do near everything I need for power. I don't have a winch but think it might handle one. Just can get along without. With FEL, would/should be in the $15-18k used with 700 hours.

Use forks for carrying and stacking wh oak logs.
   

Use tongs for dragging wh oak logs at times.


Moving boulders today to make a stone wall. (should have switched to the forks for this big one)
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Woodhauler

Zak,the way the state is burning up you may not need to clean up anything! Hope they get some rain soon and end all them fires. :'(
2013 westernstar tri-axle with 2015 rotobec elite 80 loader!Sold 2000 westernstar tractor with stairs air ride trailer and a 1985 huskybrute 175 T/L loader!

snowstorm

i was out your way 3 yrs ago. could not belive how much dead wood there is. in grand lake there were more dead trees than alive. since you tend to have some very steep ground.....a dozer with winch.  newer jd or cat with hystat would work the best. from what i saw the wood is very tall out there may have to cut the tree in too. if its not real steep ground tractor or skidder

thecfarm

By the way if you do buy a new tractor don't let them sell you turf tires or the R ones. Get the AG type.These have narrow deep treads. I would want the rear tires filled up with fluid or weights for better traction too. Buying used you don't have a choice,but new it can be set up however you want it. Have the rears tires widened out too. Better stability this way.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

thecfarm

 

 
These are the AG tires. They will do you much better in the woods. Look to see where some of the filters are too. There are some brands that have them too low for my liking. They are just waiting for a stump or a rock to break them off.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

zak1983

It's pretty steep ground. Would that lean your alls recommendation to a dozer?

beenthere

Now you are talking like you maybe don't have a good plan for removal of this woody material. ;)

I'd suggest then that you go with the tractor and work the sides of the drive, and then make a decision if you want to start traversing the steep ground with either the tractor or a dozer crawler.

Look around at your neighboring land to see what others are doing to remove their dead wood. If nothing, then there may be a valid reason or two behind their decision.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Okrafarmer

There's something to be said for getting a crawler, for sure, but there's a lot you have to look at in one, and they can be a bear to work on if they go down. Undercarriage is the number one thing, drive train is the number two. Engine and main clutch are usually easy enough to replace or repair in most models. But not all.

Caterpillar is the brand that will give you the least grief, IMO.

But sounds like most of what you want to do can be done with good 4X4 tractor with winch.
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

MHineman

  You are most likely going to need a tractor to maintain your ground even after harvesting timber, so I'd start with the 40 to 60 hp 4WD tractor and then decide if you need something different to work the steep slopes. 

  You do want a loader on the tractor.  It's better to have a FEL that has a quick change bucket and forks.  I don't have that but instead have forks that hook on the front of the bucket.  I'd be able pick up heavier logs with the load closer to the tractor and not have the extra weight of the bucket.

  I do have a skidding winch and you should too.  You can move logs with the winch in places that might be near impossible without it.

  As you open up spaces and have grass you will need a bushhog, then a grader blade for the driveway, a posthole digger for the fence you are going to put in, etc.....

 
1999 WM LT40, 40 hp 4WD tractor, homemade forks, grapple, Walenstein FX90 skidding winch, Stihl 460 039 saws,  homebuilt kiln, ......

grassfed

Since this your first time owning land you should speak with a state or county forester before  you decided to try removing the standing dead wood (aka snags). There might not be much value in removing them other than fire suppression and anything that is laying on the ground is better left were it fell. Often when people first start managing land they do not see the long term picture and are tempted to "tidy up" things but this is usually not beneficial for the land. Colorado hill land tends to have thin topsoil so any biomass that decomposes will help to improve the fertility of the site. Whenever anyone harvests wood some unintentional damage is done to the residual stand. You will be learning the ropes so you will tend to cause more damage than average. I don't want to discourage you from working  on your own I just want to suggest that you review your plan spend your time and capital doing things that you will be proud to show off a decade from now.     
Mike

snowstorm

maybe we could get some pictures of the ground you want to work on. i was out there 3 yrs ago. stayed in steam boat springs and traveled from there. some parts of the state is fine. not real steep trees are alive. other parts there are millions of cds of dead standing wood. it isnt small wood either 24" or more over a 100' tall. a lot of it so steep only a mountian goat can get there. went over rabbit ears pass when they were flying crashed snowmobiles out with a helo, late june. as far as leaving it. that can be a lot of fuel waiting to burn. can be the laws say take care of it. was in lake tathoe there they have signs beside the road saying you must mantain defenceable space around your house if you dont and there is a forest fire the fire dep will drive past your house to the next one that followed the rules.

Ironwood

Well, my .02 cent is to spend some time online researching regardless of what you buy. Tractor, Skidloader, whatever. I recently was trying to decide on a bigger tractor or TLB (tractor loader backhoe) or skidloader. If you spend some serious time online on different forums you can learn ALOT. Every brand /model has some issue/ design flaw. It is best to let someone ELSE help educate you. Cross reference your needs (building, digging, clearing, logging) and then go find your machine.  I personally dont own one, but a Kubota L35 (or 40) TLB would be a hard unit to beat from what you have described. A good used should fall within your $$ specs. I could tell story after story about those units on construction sites, and then it can be used on the "farm" as well.......Try to get the three point arms if the seller has them, they are $1500 new if they are missing (frequently the case if only used with the hoe on). If I could only have ONE machine that would be it........ We have REALLY steep ground where I am, no altitude  ;) though, and a TLB could work, like the one guy said, look around the area, what are others using? 


Ironwood   
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Migal

Im looking for a JD 4x4 around 50-60 hp with fel for second tractor  Just a ole farm boy with idea's and plan's But if you don't have a tractor and own 50 acre's you will need one not even thinking of the log's.
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