Forwarder

[Matt601]

why do y'all used a forwarder? Why not just a skidder? Looks like to me a skidder would be faster. 

[mike_belben]

If you have a processor then the logs are bucked in the woods, CTL kinda dictates forwarding.  Id think a forwarder will move more sticks per gallon than a skidder on long pulls, it can replace the knuckleboom too.  And it passes the same ground far fewer times.  Some jobs will dictate no skidding.  Tree length produces more rubs on residual stand, etc etc.  

[Matt601]

Oh ok I have never seen one in MS. It looks neat. 

[Riwaka]

Some places use forwarders to move logs from the skid to a road truck loading area if the track is too muddy, steep etc to get a road truck to the skid.

Forwarders are also used for gathering biomass, after a harvest crew has been through etc.
Forwarder Tigercat 1055 Biomass - YouTube

Forwarders used to carry pipe on projects etc.

[Riwaka]

Some places use forwarders to move logs from the skid to a road truck loading area if the track is too muddy, steep etc to get a road truck to the skid.

For a mechanised crew - less operators for a feller processor working with a forwarder (2) (logs picked up by crane trucks) compared to a feller buncher with a grapple skidder hauling to a processor then a log loader putting logs on trucks (at least 4) etc.

Forwarders are also used for gathering biomass, after a harvest crew has been through etc.
Forwarder Tigercat 1055 Biomass - YouTube

Forwarders used to carry pipe on projects etc.

[teakwood]

what a neat system, the tigercat with the chipper mounted.

Where is that?

[thecfarm]

I had my land logged,with a forwarder. No skid trails. Just the wheel marks from the forwarder. I have a hobby of looking at loging jobs. I just like the looks of a job that is done with a forwarder. The skidder trails will grow up with something no matter what.  

[Skeans1]

If you have a processor then the logs are bucked in the woods, CTL kinda dictates forwarding.  Id think a forwarder will move more sticks per gallon than a skidder on long pulls, it can replace the knuckleboom too.  And it passes the same ground far fewer times.  Some jobs will dictate no skidding.  Tree length produces more rubs on residual stand, etc etc. 

You can do CTL with with a skidder it's still a lot of guys do it this way out here vs a forwarder for longer length wood. Some companies out dictate no skidders period for ground tear up even in clear cuts unless it's a bogie drive or clam bunk forwarder.

[mike_belben]

Im gonna assume lengths out your way are a lot longer than here.  10/12/16 and small diameter compared to PNW stuff is our normal sawlog so skidding those would be kinda silly.   Most loggers here are tree length skidding to a knuckleboom and bunksaw.  If its wet boy watch out, Its hard on the skid trail.  Some spots never recover from it, theyll have a 5 ft deep gully of a road forever due to runoff turning them into creeks.  Like my yard and all the ones around it.

[nativewolf]

Im gonna assume lengths out your way are a lot longer than here.  10/12/16 and small diameter compared to PNW stuff is our normal sawlog so skidding those would be kinda silly.   Most loggers here are tree length skidding to a knuckleboom and bunksaw.  If its wet boy watch out, Its hard on the skid trail.  Some spots never recover from it, theyll have a 5 ft deep gully of a road forever due to runoff turning them into creeks.  Like my yard and all the ones around it.

Yep, for this reason we've been looking very hard at forwarders and will likely buy one by June.  Even if we are hand felling we can marry that to a forwarder pretty well, we might mess up a cut or two I guess but we'll see.
I have had great advice and help from many on the forum regarding forwarders and processors (the bigger iffeee question to me).
Forwarders are more expensive than skidders though, we might pick up a stripped down old franklin and a newer 8 wheel one and use the little franklin for pre harvest harvest, thinnings, small lot clearing jobs, etc.

[TKehl]

I'm not a pro, just a part timer, but I use trailers to move logs instead of just dragging with the tractor to keep the logs cleaner and reduce impact in our own woods.  I also only move logs when I can avoid leaving ruts.

Additionally, I have several neighbors that let me cut on their place specifically because I'm low impact.  A lot of that is "primo" as they don't want "loggers" on their land.  

I realize this is a niche, but is serving me well.   ;)

[mike_belben]

A 60 inch wide 8x8 that could actually get a 40 inch butt up on it and out of the woods without leaving ruts could really keep a one man show busy.  There are so many of those monsters in the richies back 40 where wife says no logging.  Its a shame. 
  

[lopet]

what a neat system, the tigercat with the chipper mounted.

Where is that?

Pine needle chips don't even make good quality fuel unless they' re used for other purposes.
Wonder how there can be money being made by using a half of a million dollar outfit to gather some brush, chip it and dump into containers.

[Dave Shepard]

Half -million, which end of the machine is that? :D

[thecfarm]

I can make more money digging rocks. :D
Might of been an experment to see if it was worth it. There is one on here somewheres,I think it was a JD,they made bales out of slash. It was done with one machine. Yes,another one had to pick up the bales.

[mike_belben]

as far as im concerned thats one of those fake money gigs.  Something for insiders with no bid contracts.  
.

[chep]

Forwarders can and do make ruts. Just for the record. Yes they have less ground pressure then a skidder but can still weigh over 60 k loaded.
Running brush roads behind a processor yes you float. But without brush down they sink just as well.
  We spend a lot of time moving brush info wet spots, we use ground mats and corduroy all the time.
Most of the time we move 2 machines. Processor + forwarder. I laugh when I see buncher, grapples, delimber, slasher, Chipper all packed in to a landing. Seems like a lot of iron to move around and keep fed.
And a forwarder can load trucks.
It's a different system but so simple once you learn it

[woodmills1]

once you start using anything with a log loader on it you wont be moving marketable logs or firewood any other way

[Matt601]

I was thinking that a forwarder would be good to use on Government land. They have tons of small bug spots that they just cut down and let rot to stop the bugs. No one wants to cut it anymore because they so strict on getting in and out. Looks like with a forwarder you would not need a bunching yard. It might be too much sugar for a dime. I do know Government land can break you too. You buy it standing up front from what I understand and they tell you when you can cut it so if its bug timber if they let it get too far you can't sell it.   

[Skeans1]

Another option if they'd allow it would be shovel logging

[Matt601]

Another option if they'd allow it would be shovel logging

What is that? 

[Matt601]

Forwarders are more expensive than skidders though, we might pick up a stripped down old franklin and a newer 8 wheel one and use the little franklin for pre harvest harvest, thinnings, small lot clearing jobs, etc.

I was thinking about small Bug government land lots. I could move it and my truck and load with it. I hand cut everything anyway. Have a winch on it looks like you could winch a few trees together and cut them up. The only thing I was thinking was loading the saw log and pulpwood how what would work. Just make a pile of each.  

[starmac]

There is some shovel logging goes on around here, but I bet it would be a pain doing those short logs with a shovel.

[Matt601]

I just read what shovel logging is. I think I would starve to death doing that. 

[Ianab]

I just read what shovel logging is. I think I would starve to death doing that.

It only really works for small plots / short distance / larger trees. 
It's used a bit locally as there are a lot of small pine plantations on regular farmland, a few hundred pine trees planted on a steep hillside or gully. These would be larger trees, maybe 3ft dbh, but not enough to be worth hauling in all sorts of machinery.   But with just a large excavator (with a grapple) they can fix (or create) the track, move and sort the logs, load the trucks (we don't use self loaders here), and tow the truck out when it gets stuck. Logs might only need to be moved 50 yards to the landing. 
But if the logs have to be moved any serious distance, then it's not going to work. They would still bring in the excavator for all the other reasons, just the logs get moved with a skidder as that's so much more efficient over a longer distance. Excavator then stays on the landing and basically works as a mobile crane sorting / stacking and loading the logs.