Refinish Oak Flooring questions

[Larry]

I have to refinish about 500 foot of oak flooring.  Not for sure what I want to do.  My only experience running a conventional floor sander was 40 years ago...and I was not good.  I can remember the gouges and divots I created.  Lowes rents a floor sander that operates on a different principal.  They say it's easy to use...Varathane sander if I remember right.  Figured I could use the PC ROS to edge.

Another option is to pick up the phone...we have an excellent floor guy.  Quite expensive but does an excellent job...don't know if I could equal his work.

Any recommendations on finish?  I've been thinking about Waterlox Original Gym Floor (different name nowadays).

If it makes any difference I'm re-finishing to sell our farm.  The "Wow" factor is important as the hardwood floor is in the main part of the house.

[beenthere]

I'm with you on the floor sanding experience......and it was about 40 years ago too.

If me, I'd go with the professional and avoid the frustration. They can sure make floors look fantastic.

In my office at work, the internal staff decided the painter could use a large rotating disk arrangement (like a floor buffer but with sandpaper on it), and it was a real joke. It was slow, and they wanted fast. So they stopped way short of getting the old finish off and down to wood. Besides, it sanded across the grain, and left poorly sanded wood.
10 years later they hired the professional with the drum sanders and trim edgers to do it right.

Just my thoughts. 

[Sprucegum]

Finishing your own floors is a "labor of love"

If you're selling anyway you don't need the love  ;)

Get the pro and tell him why you are doing it. He may show you how to save a few bucks.

[Engineer]

I'm doing my own.  The local place rents an orbital floor sander.  Much less aggressive than the heavy drum, but much easier to use, and I have a 6" Bosch orbital to do the edges.  I have 2000 square feet of floor to do, pine upstairs and maple downstairs,and no way I'm paying some guy four bucks (yes, four bucks) a square foot to sand and finish them.

I'm using dewaxed shellac sealer and Minwax water-based polyurethane for floors, but this is new construction.  On a refinish, I'd skip the shellac.  Your Waterlox idea is a good one.

[Jason_WI]

A friend of ours used water based poly on his new maple floor. What a mistake. It started to bubble up and peel off in spots. He had to sand it down again and used a real poly finish made for hardwood floors. This was 5 plus years ago so the water stuff might be better maybe not - why chance it.

Jason

[Norm]

Doing a new floor with the vibrator sanders from the lowes of the world works OK but is slow. I tried to refinish one with it and quickly learned that was the last time I'd ever do it.

Hire out the sanding and do the finish part yourself Larry, you'll be glad you did.

[srt]

Larry,

I'm going to have to side with the folks that want you to pay for someone doing it.  I've done it, and still do it, but if I were selling, I'd let someone else do it. 

However, if it's not real bad (finish gone), you may be able to scuff sand with a RO, and just apply a couple more coats.  I've seen a few floors redone totally, when a scuff and recoat would have been fine.

I think I'd apply the shellac no matter what finish was below or above what I was putting on.  It provides a little bit of a barrier to minimize grain raising caused by waterborne finishes.  Old "antiquers" use it all the time over questionable finishes to minimize fish eye etc in thetop coat.  If you want a little warmth, dewaxed orange underneath will "sweeten" up the look of the top coat. Best of all, it goes on really fast and is pretty cheap.

[Larry]

srt, you struck a nerve.  I took another look at my floor and still has 99% of its finish.  Called the guy that installed and finished it 15 years ago.  We talked for a long time about all options and decided that I'm going to do exactly what you suggested...scuff ROS and re-coat.  The floor is flat sawn red oak, with a lot of color variation which should help cover any imperfections.  Sherwin Williams polyurethane for the re-coat. 

I'm also taking the advice of others that have posted....if the floor doesn't look right when I get done my flooring guy is coming out to do the sanding/refinish.

[ohsoloco]

I just sanded and refinished my red oak floors about a year ago.  The finish was pretty much gone on the high traffic areas in the living room, but hardly touched some places in the bedroom.  Those high traffic areas also had lots of dirt ground into the wood. 

I rented one of those orbital sanders with the rectangular head.  In the living room I started with the 22-1/2 grit and worked through all four, but only did three grits in the other rooms.  Sounds like you may be able to rent a sander and use the finest, or two finest grits.  It took me maybe 5 hours to go through all those grits in the living room, hallway, and two bedrooms.  Pulled the shoe moulding off and didn't have to edge anything...that sander gets really close to the edges    Shoe moulding still hasn't been put back, however  :  :D

Just don't let it sit in one place.  In the first room I sanded I would let it sit idle up against the wall to make sure I got everything, and I ended up with little swirl marks in the floor. 

I tacked the whole house with mineral spirits, and used a floor finish from the janitorial supply place used on gym floors (sounds like what you were planning on using).  I used lamb's wool to apply it, but I can see lap marks if the light hits it right.  Those squeegees are the way to go to apply floor finish, but can take some time to get the hang of. 

[Larry]

The results.



Sanded with a Bosch 3825 DVS random orbit sander.  Went through 80, 100, and 120 grits.  Took 3 hours.  I have a PC 7334 ROS which would have been faster...but an old model with no dust collection.  I hooked the Bosch to a shop vac and had zero dust problems.  Wiped with mineral spirits and laid down two coats of Minwax semi-gloss fast dry poly floor finish.  Used a lambs wool applicator.

Quite pleased with the results.  I was surprised at how fast the finish came off with the little ROS.  In some places I sanded quite deep to remove scratches.  I was able to feather the sanding so I didn't have visible variations.  One small spot where I didn't sand deep enough to remove stain...its hard to discern.  The Minwax finish levels out excellent.  I made several mistakes and re-did the finish in two small spots.  I think I could do much better the next time around...might try a brush as you have to be close to the floor to watch the sheen.  The floor has so much natural color variation that it probably helped to mask my mistakes.

And iffen ya attempt this GET KNEE PADS ;)

[srt]

GOOD JOB LARRY!!!!!!!

Had to shout for that one.  You just saved yourself a bunch of money and time, as well as saved the floor.  There are only so many times you can totally redo a floor using drum sanders before the tounges start sticking out.  So, you saved the floor also!!  I wish more folks would consider this low-tech high results type of flooring re-do.

[jrdwyer]

My observation is that belt sanders are best used by those with floor sanding experience. I have seen lots of refinished floors done by home owners with belt sanders that show obvious sanding lines after refinishing.

For new wood, the random orbital sanders work well for beginners. We ripped out the carpet in our upstairs a year and a half ago and installed new oak floors. Unfortunately, the subfloor was far from flat and had to be corrected before intalling the wood. This was definitely the worst part of the whole job! It involved the use of a long level, chalk to mark the dips, and cutting roofing paper to size to fill the depressions. We then did the 40,60,80 grit sequence followed by 4 coats of Waterlox finish. This finish does take a week to cure and 2-3 weeks for the smells to fully go away, but in the end it was worth it:

http://dwyerforestry.com/Oakfloor.htm

Would I do it again? Yes, if I had a flat subfloor to start with.