The Forestry Forum

General Forestry => Chainsaws => Topic started by: Rprescot3 on February 21, 2019, 12:11:44 PM

Title: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Rprescot3 on February 21, 2019, 12:11:44 PM
Hi everyone! I'm new to this forum and am looking for guidance from folks more experienced than I am. I am going to start a wood business and I need advice on saws. I have a job right now so I want to begin by renting the saws out ( I have a biz plan and will be able to get the rentals taken care of by a business partner ).

I'm looking at Still specifically- I work around a lot of tree guys, and about 90% of them use Stihl- they say they're built like tanks. I'm open to other brands though.

I'm looking for sizes from 14" to 26" or 28". Can you please offer me advice? Thanks so much! Rich
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: TACOMATODD on February 21, 2019, 12:20:10 PM
I've learned either ms441 or 372xp. At least with the size bar you speak of. Use the proper mix, GOOD oil, and keep the chain sharp. All will contribute to good, long life from your equipment. BTW, all of these are in about the 70cc class.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Allar on February 21, 2019, 12:24:03 PM
Husqvarna, stihl and echo are the most reputable brands imo.
I would choose the brand based on what dealers you have near you.

For 14'' i would go with a 50cc chainsaw.

Husqvarna 545,550xp
Stihl MS 261
Echo CS-501P

For 26-28'' bar
Husqvarna 572xp
Stihl MS 461
Echo CS-800p
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: wild262 on February 21, 2019, 01:22:57 PM
You will want longevity and dependability in this application.  Only go with "pro" saws or semi pro.  And I would supply the renters with pre-mixed fuel, to help eliminate straight gassed saws.  The 261's would be my choice in the 50cc 16" Stihl line.  And as said the Stihl 441, Husky 372, 572.  Echo makes a pretty dependable saw as well and cheaper cost.  Make sure you have a dealer near buy for any brand.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: sawguy21 on February 21, 2019, 01:29:39 PM
The yards in this area won't rent saws, the risk of liability is too high. Check with your insurer first. Keep in mind some want to cut anything except clean wood and don't want to wreck their own equipment.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: realzed on February 21, 2019, 06:43:04 PM
Exactly as was stated - If I needed to dig out a big stump and I had a brand new saw and chain already, I know I much would prefer to use someone else's equipment to do it, rather than screwing up my own!
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: starmac on February 21, 2019, 08:38:02 PM
Lowes rents out makitas, here. I would have a hard time turning everybody with a high priced saw myself.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: John Mc on February 24, 2019, 12:57:33 PM
Home Depot rents Makitas here (which are basically Dolmar saws in a different color). Home Depot, Lowes, or similar places might be a good place to check prices to see what the going rate for chainsaw rentals is in your area.

Dolmar/Makita is another brand I'd add to Allar's list of Husqvarna, Stihl, and Echo as reliable brands. Unless you plan on doing all of your own repair work, I'd be inclined to go with whichever has the best dealer support in your area.

While you do want to get durable equipment, I'd be hesitant to put expensive, top-of the-line pro chainsaws out as rentals. Given the pricing, I'd be more likely to go for Echo or Dolmar/Makita. Some of their products are top-notch, and not as expensive as similar Husky or Stihl products.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: MNBobcat on February 24, 2019, 02:21:57 PM
Buy used Makita (dolmar) rental saws from home depot.  Half price of new and will last you a long time.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: firefighter ontheside on February 25, 2019, 08:19:38 AM
What kind of wood business are you going to start?  To get into business you have to make investments.  Luckily chainsaws are not a huge investment.  I'd say buy a good saw and don't waste money on renting.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Cam460 on February 26, 2019, 01:32:58 AM
I have had many saws from 024's to 460's in my opinion though if I could only have one it would be the 372xp I keep a 20" bar on it and it does everything from liming to bucking. I have a firewood business and sell 30 cords a year so I like having 2 saws in case I get one stuck or for bigger stuff. For this I have a stihl ms460 with a 32" bar. 
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: starmac on February 26, 2019, 01:16:43 PM
Maybe I have it wrong, but I took it, that he is planning to rent saws to the public. If that is the case, I don't think I would want to turn the average Joe loose with a 372 or ms460.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Old Greenhorn on February 26, 2019, 01:45:53 PM
It's worth noting that the OP has apparently not been back since the day he first registered and posted this.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Inaotherlife on February 26, 2019, 03:37:53 PM
Sounds like a lot of headache for the potential return.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: wild262 on February 26, 2019, 06:33:47 PM
Well, a guy could go either way.   He could use semi pro or pro class saws and require a stiff deposit, or buy cheaper home owner ranch saws at a reduced deposit.  Either way I would require one.  The advantage of pro class would be, they have potential to hold up better with rough treatment, and can be rebuilt.  The cheaper clamshell homeowner saws, cannot withstand rough handling well, and being mostly plastic construction, more parts breakage. On the other hand, you don't have the cash outlay upfront with the cheaper units.  Maybe semi-pro is the best way to go.  Either way I would require the renter to take a jug of mixed fuel to use with that saw, which should eliminate the chance of a lean seisure.   If it were me I wouldn't mess with any of it at all!  I have a problem with idiots in todays society.   >:(
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: John Mc on February 26, 2019, 11:46:16 PM
Quote from: wild262 on February 26, 2019, 06:33:47 PMEither way I would require the renter to take a jug of mixed fuel to use with that saw, which should eliminate the chance of a lean seisure.

That's a great idea.

QuoteIf it were me I wouldn't mess with any of it at all! I have a problem with idiots in todays society.


Douglas Adams wrote: "A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." 

Words to live by.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: wild262 on February 27, 2019, 12:17:28 AM
Quote from: John Mc on February 26, 2019, 11:46:16 PM
Quote from: wild262 on February 26, 2019, 06:33:47 PMEither way I would require the renter to take a jug of mixed fuel to use with that saw, which should eliminate the chance of a lean seisure.

That's a great idea.

QuoteIf it were me I wouldn't mess with any of it at all! I have a problem with idiots in todays society.


Douglas Adams wrote: "A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools."  

Words to live by.

Amen to that John ! :D
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Loggerpro. on February 28, 2019, 02:31:55 PM
I would not touch anything else but Stihl, cause someone has to clean them after each day and with the internal clutch, its easier . 1.bolts and cover , 2 paint brush, 3 clean bar , 4 put back ,5 sharpen chain ...10min done.! Ive done it thousands of times without gloves, no cuts yet. Had huskies and poulans way back when and it was a nightmare putting the chain back behind that big ol clutch when you are so tired you can barely stand from killing trees all day long.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: wild262 on February 28, 2019, 03:28:38 PM
Quote from: Loggerpro. on February 28, 2019, 02:31:55 PM
I would not touch anything else but Stihl, cause someone has to clean them after each day and with the internal clutch, its easier . 1.bolts and cover , 2 paint brush, 3 clean bar , 4 put back ,5 sharpen chain ...10min done.! Ive done it thousands of times without gloves, no cuts yet. Had huskies and poulans way back when and it was a nightmare putting the chain back behind that big ol clutch when you are so tired you can barely stand from killing trees all day long.

Husky 372, is one exception. 
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Rebarb on February 28, 2019, 03:42:35 PM
My brother has a part time logging business, I help and work on the saws.
Lot of work, expensive equipment.....more money in tree trimming.

I agree 372XP would be my first purchase. 
On the cheap....Echo.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Rprescot3 on March 03, 2019, 10:09:32 AM
Quote from: Old Greenhorn on February 26, 2019, 01:45:53 PM
It's worth noting that the OP has apparently not been back since the day he first registered and posted this.
I'd been back... Just had no idea there were any responses. I don't get notifications and there isn't a dashboard I can figure out. Also, I work for a utility contractor here in Northern California. Between the Camp Fire and the snow event in Redding, we've been working 7 days a week, 12 hours a day
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Rprescot3 on March 03, 2019, 10:40:57 AM
Hi folks- sorry for the lack of recent response ( see aforementioned reason). So here's where I'm at:

*Type of business: I'm starting by renting out chainsaws, wood splitters and landscaping trailers. I'll expand the business incrementally and eventually get to the point of doing everything from dropping the trees to producing finished products ( dimensional, custom, siding, flooring, shingles, etc). I'm starting with the saw, splitter and trainer rental business because it's a much smaller initial investment and can provide me with passive income that I can use to keep growing the biz. I live close to Paradise, and have worked a lot within the burn scar of the Camp Fire. Trees deemed hazardous are being removed, but you can bet your last dollar that more wood than that is coming down in the name if defensible space. As for wood in the ground already- thousands of cords, or millions of board feet depending on how you look at it.

* Saws I'm planning to buy: all Stihl- the local dealer is an Elite dealer and every mechanic they have is certified at the factory. The actual models I'm looking at are:

-ms193 top handle for limb work
-ms261 c-m for general use
-ms362 c-m for larger needs

If anyone asks if I have anything bigger I'll be pointing them to professional fellers.

*Points related to doing business:
   -I will be making renters sign a contract which will include a liability waiver and language related to responsibility for damage resulting from negligence
   -I will keep the price of the rental itself on the low side of the local market but require my customers to use my mixed gas
   -I will be factoring in issues related to cutting on burnt wood (not sure what to do yet as I'm sure someone could smoke a chain quickly going right through charred bark).



This is kind of where I'm at right now. My market is full of d.i.y. folks who are used to working with saws but have just lost everything they own to the fire. I know a fool is born every second, but there's so many good folks up the hill (what we call Paradise and Magalia) that I feel good about doing this. Any other input would be great.

Thanks all!
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: lxskllr on March 03, 2019, 10:51:45 AM
You might want to look into some kind of "quicky" chain sharpener for your rentals. Oregon has a system that includes a bar and chain, and you sharpen it by attaching a thing on the end of the bar, and pressing it as you throttle the saw. I'm skeptical of it giving a great edge, but it might be good enough. Even a [I have typed a profane word that is automatically changed by the forum censored words program I should know better and could be banned for doing it] sharpened chain is better than not sharp at all.


I don't necessarily endorse the Oregon system, and have never seen it in person. Just food for thought. You could also go the semi manual route with each saw coming with a jig and a proper new file(customer gets to keep the file), and a printed instruction sheet on use.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Rprescot3 on March 03, 2019, 11:41:14 AM
@lxskllr (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=39990) one of the shops here in town provides a free chain with every rental- that seems crazy to me. I'm definitely going to have to figure out something for chain maintenance, that's for sure. Luckily you only need to rent the saw 8 to 10 times to get your money back.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Rprescot3 on March 04, 2019, 11:31:48 AM
Quote from: wild262 on February 26, 2019, 06:33:47 PM
Well, a guy could go either way.   He could use semi pro or pro class saws and require a stiff deposit, or buy cheaper home owner ranch saws at a reduced deposit.  Either way I would require one.  The advantage of pro class would be, they have potential to hold up better with rough treatment, and can be rebuilt.  The cheaper clamshell homeowner saws, cannot withstand rough handling well, and being mostly plastic construction, more parts breakage. On the other hand, you don't have the cash outlay upfront with the cheaper units.  Maybe semi-pro is the best way to go.  Either way I would require the renter to take a jug of mixed fuel to use with that saw, which should eliminate the chance of a lean seisure.   If it were me I wouldn't mess with any of it at all!  I have a problem with idiots in todays society.   >:(
I'll definitely require a deposit, and providing the gas is a great idea. Not understanding the lien seizure though- I'm buying the saws outright, and creditors file liens against debtors. Also, by having renters sign a contract with language regarding negligent use, and having an indemnity clause for personal injury, the risk of financial exposure/harm is mitigated.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Rprescot3 on March 04, 2019, 11:35:46 AM
@wild262 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37945) jeezuz, I read that totally wrong! Engine seizure due to lean mix, right? Too many people suing other people here in California!
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: lxskllr on March 04, 2019, 11:40:59 AM
Quote from: Rprescot3 on March 04, 2019, 11:31:48 AM

 Not understanding the lien seizure though- I'm buying the saws outright, and creditors file liens against debtors.
I think you both may have the terminology wrong. Lean seizure is too much air to gas mixture, eg the high screw isn't set rich enough. Not sure what you'd call too little 2stroke oil. None at all would be straight gassed.

Brings up a good point though. Since you're going Stihl, it might be worth getting all Mtronic saws. That'll keep people that /think/ they know how to tune equipment from monkeying with the carb settings, and burning up a saw.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: wild262 on March 05, 2019, 12:45:08 PM
Quote from: Rprescot3 on March 04, 2019, 11:35:46 AM
@wild262 (http://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?action=profile;u=37945) jeezuz, I read that totally wrong! Engine seizure due to lean mix, right? Too many people suing other people here in California!


Well I meant to say it would prevent the saw from being straight gassed.  And yes, Monotune would even further help maybe as well if the cost of those saws are in your budget. Keep in mind they would need software up dates from time to time as well.  Are you going to do that, or take them to the dealer?    And I agree with the suing part.  Nobody wants to talk things out anymore and work to a solution.  Suing seems to be easier. ::)   
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: Rprescot3 on March 06, 2019, 11:58:13 AM
I'll be having the dealer handle all the updates and whatnot. Depending on the saw/product, they'll double your warranty if you buy bar oil or a case of engine oil. My plan is to sell my used saws within their 2 year warranty period and buy new. They'll always be under warranty and new/newer than what competitors are renting.
Title: Re: Recommended Brands/Models
Post by: realzed on March 06, 2019, 08:39:46 PM
I believe that if you use saws for commercial use - then the warranty is limited to 90 days or something like that, and I'm sure rental of saws would be considered as such.. 
You may wish to check it out for yourself prior to buying the saws let alone whatever other stuff like any extra oil that may believe will make any coverage longer.. Just Say'n..