firewood processing

[tw3006]

i have a wood processor and was maybe looking into processing log length firewood for other people, figured i'd post to see if there was any one who might be interested in hiring a processor and what the going rate for processing was.

[cheyenne]

Seems to me your puting the cart before the horse. That's an exspensive piece of equipment to maintain without a market for it....Cheyenne

[Corley5]

I get 45 bucks a pulp cord if they have a method to load the processor and 50 if I take my Bobcat along.  I do very little custom work for the main reason that I don't want to enable any competition  8) 

[tw3006]

cheyenne... i sell firewood on the side, im 23 and i like to work, so when im not logging and doing tree service, i do firewood, i figured i'd post to see how the custom processing market was, i bought a cord king 60 with 700 hours on it, 2 years ago and now its paid for, so i guess i have my cart hooked to my horse and the carts loaded with wood and ready to go. thanks for any ideas about the market for this -tw

[cheyenne]

Yes you do but your post didn't reflect that. You have my ultimate respect for being 23 and doing your own thing and being successful. As far as the processing market goes I don't have a clue but I don't think there would be much of one. But I've been wrong before and 1 or 2 jobs is better than no jobs and I know your smarter than to work for free. Where in Vermont.....Cheyenne

[tw3006]

Cheyenne, no disrespect intended, its just i work hard for what i have, with no deep pockets to back me, actually no pockets to back me.  But anyways thanks for the good words of advice...... had i not had a market already. Im in Wilmington Vermont right near the massachusetts border. thanks for understanding -tw

[cheyenne]

If there's ever anything I can do to help you let me know....Cheyenne

[tw3006]

Cheyenne thanks, same goes for you

[woodsteach]

Down here most everything is done by the hour.  Custom milling and custom firewood processing.  I just found an ad for $90.00/hour from my site back to my site.  I know of at least one of his customers that repeats yearly.

woodsteach

[SwampDonkey]

tw3006, were you planning on going off site with your equipment, or buying or cutting your own logs to process at your own lot? Around here I don't know of anyone going off their premises with a processor unless it's for wood they possess a crown lands firewood permit. The wood becomes theirs after a fee is paid for a set volume to the DNR, then they sell it as their own firewood. Sometimes what happens on sugar bush leases on crown land, the leasee has a management plan to thin the sugar bush. The wood is either used or sold as firewood or pulp. Some of those sugar leases are several hundred acres.

[tw3006]

swampdonkey, there are people who do mobile firewood processing, they go to people who have a inventory of firewood logs, charge a certain price per cord, to cut and split it, then move on to the next customer. This is the type of thing I am inquiring about as i already do my own wood processing, just looking into something extra

[cheyenne]

Seems like your customers would be mostly your competators. Thats a funny thought.   :D :D :D...Cheyenne

[tw3006]

it seems i may not be interested in processing for others anymore.  :D  I'd hate to help my competition...not that they have much of a chance anyways........ 8)

[stonebroke]

Just make sure you make as much money processing as selling and you will do all right. If all you do is processing then they can mess with delievery and collections and actually selling. It would simiplifly your life.

Stonebroke

[cheyenne]

It would effect your insurance rates also....Cheyenne

[gunman63]

If u did processing for the homeowner, a truck load here and there, I dont think your helping your competition at all. If i could get $50 a cord processing, (from the competition)I would  do all i could, then i wouldnt have to sit on money  that u spend on wood and  then delivery too.

[Engineer]

Hey TW,

You might have yourself an interesting niche market.  I see (as do you) people's yards where there's 8-10 cords of wood sitting there, dropped off a log truck for firewood.  You might be able to convince some of those folks that for $xx a cord, or per hours, you'll cut and split their firewood, thus saving them the TIME of doing it themselves.  As long as you're not trying to do that for a living, just on the side, I don't see why you couldn't make a few bucks at it. 

How far are you willing to go with your rig?  I could imagine that you'd have plenty of customers if  you were willing to go up to an hour in any direction - Bennington, Brattleboro/Keene, Springfield, or even south to Greenfield, MA. 

Nice to see other FF members from my area - I'm just over the mountain in the Bennington area, but I spent the past three days in your town, just up the road from the White House Inn doing some soils work and surveying.

[tw3006]

mr Engineer. who are you working for around here if you dont mind me asking. I usually get all the orders i need within 10-15 mins of my house so i suppose if I traveled jsut outside that range it wouldn't hurt me much. Plus it would be nice to not think about delivery and log length wood. So maybe it would be alright.

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

Tw3006 Im a 4th gen firewood cutting/Logging & Sawmillng family  ;) 8) Your on the right track  with wanting to get more equipment utilisation outa your gear Mate  ;) With the copetition dont worry about them just keep your rate to them alittle higher than what you can do it yourself for  ;) ;D Ive done a power of firewood over the years but the works a little harder than i want to do these days  ;) :D I use to do alot of larger trees to give you an idea the biggest one an old ringbarked Red gum i got about 15 cords out of it  ;)  ;D 8) a full semi load  i use to just do motor manual and load the trucks by hand  thats probley why im a little over it ;) :D ;D

ive looked into proccesors afew times as i have mates in the game up on the murry river about an 1 to 2 hour drive away as thats where 90% of melbourns firewood comes from thease days Every year they ring and ask ifin im intrested in going up for the season  as they are allways looking for Larger more automated contractors (and Id shown intrst in the past  ;) ) as they have alot of blokes just using chainsaws & loaders  ;) Bulk contract rates here run at the $100 (unsplit)to $130 (split)per cord in the stockpile  basicly how it works is they pay the roialty and give you an area to work out of You skid the heads about 1 to 4 cords worth per tree to the fire wood processor buck the head process it into a stockpile that they then load onto trucks from  ;) You get paid weekly ;) they have blokes contract cutting anywhere from 1000 to 20 thousand cords per year  ;) to give you an idea Each of them sends around 100000 cords pa to melb  ;)

If you ever want to contract cut firewood  downunder  ;) one phonecall and ill Lump with All the work you could Want  ;) :D :D  ;D ;D ;) I only cut and del around 75 cords a year now just to keep my intrest in it going as i like doing it   ;) ;D ;D 8)

Keep up the Good Work Mate  ;) ;D 8)

Reguards Chris

[gunman63]

WOW only have to run 10-15 minutes to deliver wood thats great, must be a city, how many cords to u sell a year, my runs are about  a hour total, up to 4 hours, but they pay good for the long of a run. so if u process firewood for a guy thats a hour away, it isnt goin to hurt your business at all, id say do all u can,.

[bull]

how many cord can you run threw the processor a day..... Im cleaning up 100 acres of ice storm damage averaging 6 cord per acre the pile is growing....
Its going to be a slow project but I will be yarding up 10 -20 cord per landing due to skid roads and wetland issues, may be interested in having a processor come in, just need to figure the $$ fessability !!  right now we're using chain saws and an old splitter...

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

Bull My old boss has 2 Hakki x2 firewood Pto powerd procesors 16 max dia  ;) running they cost him about $20 k au in 2002 each of them in Realy Rough Hardwood will do around the 10+ cord per day mark Ea with on bloke on each one We set them up with a simple dead deck infeed and would put around 2 cord through at a time then slipp the bucket on the forks of the loader and shift the split wood from under the conveyer  ;) ;D They where quicker on strater stuff in the 8 to 12 ' length range

You can also get a hyd log loader and infeed that will load the logs from ground hight also  ;) Hudson sells them in the Usa ;D

Reguards Chris

[tw3006]

gunman, i live in a tiny town but a big vacation area, near a few big ski areas, lots of second homes. I do this as side work, but i usually do about 70-150 cords a year depending on how much cheap wood i can get and how much energy i have. I guess i might go a little farther than 15 minutes but definately no more than 15 miles.

[tw3006]

bull ..i dont know how many cords a day i can do because i usually work alone and deal with delivery. My guess would be if i just processed into a pile depending on the wood i could probably do 10-15. I think that sounds about right with someone loading the deck.  -tw

[gunman63]

TW- U sure got your niche market there, good for u. branching out for custom work wont hurt u then, if u go beyond that range say 50 miles or so. sounds like u have a good customer base, treat them fair they wont buy from anyone else once u have them, so no worries there either.  I think the 10-15 cord a day is about right, sure some days mite be more some less, if yoru working by your self that should be about right.

[Ed_K]

 In the Northern Logger there's an ad for custom processing. The guys in Conn. he will travel anywhere in NewEngland When I talked to him, he was getting $70. per cord with a minimum of 100 cords. That was 2 yrs ago when I called.
There's two companies renting out small processors here in the Greenfield area for $150. - $250. per day, they say you can average 10 cords a day.
I think you have a good chance at a niche market.
I used to do 60 - 100 cords per yr an wore myself out.Now I just sell log length on the landing. Much easier  ;D .

[evergreenforestmgmt]

I saw this and had to reply.  You're 23 years old, you bought a cord king 60, it's paid for, and you process 75-150 cords a year???  You got to teach me your skills.  I'm 28, Have a Hakki 1x37 for 3 years, I sell just over 200 cords a year, and mine is only half paid for.  Now my machine new was 12,000.  Yours used was at least $50,000.  Now how do you do it after buying your wood, processing it, selling it for let's say at best $100 profit a cord, did you manage to do that?  Sorry, I've been doing firewood for only 5 years, and working my a$$ off almost everyday doing it, and I'm only half paid on my $12,000 machine.  You just sound incredible.

[cheyenne]

The only thing wrong with jumping into the pool is not knowing how to swim......Cheyene

[gunman63]

Lets see here, U do 200 cords a year, used a $100 a cord profit, thats 20 grand a year, for 5 years, $100,000, and only half paid for a $12000  processor, (I used your  figures in this). But if u are working your a$$ off like u say,  I know what a 1X37 will do, but use only say 6 cords a day, they will do more, and say 200 working days a year, theres more of them to, thats 1200 cords a year, and using your $100 profit thats $120,000 a year, talk about economic stimulis. 8)

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

I do 75 odd cords a year with a 359 husky chainsaw and hand splitting about 3 + cords hand loading I can cut n load 8to9 ton on the truck in one good day:o :
i woudnt mind a hakki 2x as Rob my old boss has two off em both runninng for only 6 to 8 months a year and he sells about 2000 cords pa and i would only buy one if i had a larger volume of wood to do myself but if i ever get the odd job where ill need to do say 20 to30 cords in one hit Ill just borrow one of Robs off him as he has allready offerd afew times but hes 120 miles away  ;) ;D 8) 8)

Reguards Chris

[lonewolf]

 I would get in touch with someone local who is selling 8' wood by the semi load they could probably get you plenty of work. I have 1 feller in this area that works with a trucker. He has a fw processor and skidsteer and seems to work real steady. I don't know what he charges . Around here I get 65/cord for mixed hrdwd and 75/cord for red oak 8' wood plus trucking.

[Cord-n-8R]

lonewolf, you sell truckloads of 8' logs for firewood? How many cords to a load and how far will you deliver? I might be interested in a load. I'm in S.C. WI. Please PM me with/for more info.

Thanks

[tw3006]

evergreen, maybe you should come by my house and see ALL the other equipment i have, haha, then you would really be surprised. I work almost every day either logging or tree work with my father. I meet him at 6 or 6:30 to go to work. Usually i can process a full cord before he meets me, then deliver it when i get home. Plus I work weekends. I cut all my own log length firewood on clearing jobs near my house or get it on our tree jobs, so trucking is low cost, and besides my time firewood is free, and most times i even get PAID to do clearing jobs, my delivery is always close, so turn around time is fast. You spend money on things that actually help your bottom line, not Mc D's everyday. If anyone wants to hear more i'll be gladly go on, and feel free to stop by sometime.

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

TW Keep on going mate this story sounds like ive herd it before but i like it more  every time I hear it from someone else  Mate  ;) :D ;D ;D ;D 8) 8)

Reguards Chris

[FYRWOOD GUY]

had any problem with metal in the wood yet?
i'd be on the look out for it.
i tried what you want to do,but found it did not work well.i stay home and do it for them,they bring it tree-length i saw & split it and load back on their truck. $45.00 per cord

[evergreenforestmgmt]

First off, I want to apologize to anyone who I may have offended with my previous comment.  I was honestly not trying to cut down (pun intended) TW3006 for his hard work, I was trying to drive home a point that yes, he's worked hard for what he has, but he did not pay off his processor by firewood alone.  He said, that he got most of his firewood for free or really cheap.  His tree service business helps to sustain his firewood business.  
    Gunman. let's take a minute to talk about firewood and money.  You think I've made $120 K in five years?  That would be nice.  Now, first you go out and buy a $12,000 processor, then you want a 1 ton dump truck to deliver, $28,000.  Then, you have a farm and want to have a decent tractor to use for logging and firewood and have capability to move logs around and load the processor and also have for farm work.  $35,000.  Now you are missing something......oh yeah, wood!  This past summer in New England, it rained and rained and rained.  The few remaining pulp mills were buying wood to beat the band.  This high demand/rain made firewood go way up.  Guess where this is going....$150 per cord log length.  Now before you've sold a single stick of wood to a customer, let's say you purchase 200 cords of this log length wood=bammo!!! $30,000 worth of product ready to be processed.  Now fuel let's say is an average of $3.50 per gallon.  It has gone down from the $4.64 we paid last summer, but now is $2.65.  So we'll use $3.50 for a good average to process 200 cords.  It takes about 8 gallons between the processor tractor and loader tractor to pump out 8 cords of wood.  $700 of fuel for processing 200 cords.  Now let's add at least .15% to that figure to account for loading the truck, shuttling wood around the yard, sorting etc.  $805 on diesel fuel.  Now for the fun parts.  Insurance for the truck, equipment, say around $1500 a year for commercial insurance.  Now gas for the truck, same situation as the tractor.  We are "blessed" here for $1.99 gas prices.  Also down from $4+ this past year.  Let's make a average of $2.50 per gallon for gas.  are local, so mileage   You can easily figure an average of $50 per week for the year for wood deliveries alone.  This area isn't densely populated as some are, so you have to travel more than you'd like.  That's a conservative figure of $2,600 a year.  So, let's put it all together.  First I add up all the expenditures.  
                                            $109,905 total investment..........now I try to sell my green wood for $225 per cord, sometimes it is less, around $200.  Depends on time of year and competition.  I sell a little bit of seasoned or dry for more, but not really enough to mention.  So we'll use $225 per cord, green, including a local delivery x 200 annual cords.  Oh no! That's $45,000.  Now remember, you have to keep buying wood as you process it, so you don't run out, or at least have enough to make it from year to year.  Now of course, there are payments to be made on the equipment and wood to buy to be able to make those payments.  So say $45,000 - your annual payments of all the above.  For me, it's somewhere in the neighborhood of $19,521.    So we're left with $25,479.  Now take that figure and divide in two.  I work a full time job and work on the side doing firewood with my firewood partner.  $12,739.50.   Oh yeah, guess what, it's time to buy wood again!! And anyone who is doing firewood, knows that there is tons of time involved, that you wouldn't even want to figure.  Nobody would put the hours in a year to make a lousy $12 grand, but we do it because we love it!!

            Now I know people are going to say, well gee, you don't need all that equipment to sell firewood.  You could just use a dump trailer instead of a one ton, you could use a much cheaper tractor to run the wood yard.  These are all true.  And guess what, you could also split wood with a maul and wedge too!!  But seriously, like I said we do it more for the love of being outdoors and working.  Certainly not for money!

[Rick Alger]

Hi Evergreen,

Can you move white birch and soft maple? After break-up I will be on a lot with maybe 40 cords of it in Wentworth Location.

Rick

[gunman63]

well evergreen in your earlier post u said u work your a$$  off almost every day doing firewood and only do 200 cords a year, thats where i came up with your firgures, yes theres more cost to it than meets the eye, I know i do firewood also. but i know i dont need a $28000  dump truck, a nice used  dump trailer works for me, hauls 2 cords, cost a lot less than your truck, dont need a $35000 tractor either, nice simple skidsteer works the best for me, had that before i started the firewood so i didnt need to buy that either, wood costs me $60 to $75 a cord but i also receive less for my finished  product but try to get $100 a cord over my cost of the wood. dont need a partner to help me out with the work or spending the money, to me firewood is part time, still sold 500 cords this winter. to me 200 cords, if i hit it hard and cut and spilt only is 20 days work, and say 25-30 days to deliver, say 2 cords per load. so i got 50  days in to a $20000 gross after the wood cost, works for me. But if i  had to jump in and buy a $25000 splitter, 28000 truck and 35000 tractor to do it, no way cant pencil it out, thats  one reason this country is in the hole people cant firgure out how to pencil stuff out before  jumping in. No matter how much u love to do something, when your spending this amount of money the average guy has to make money doing it.

[tw3006]

guys dont you know its called green gold for a reason.... HA. but in all reality im sure glad im not trying to pay off my equipment just selling firewood, the first year i got my processor i did probably 250 cords during the summer, and bought all my wood, when i finished my taxes for the year and saw what i made...... I started working full time again with my father. To go along with what Cheyene said theres such a thing as jumping in and not being able to swim but theres also jumping in with the thought you can stay above water but not going anywhere. Diversify... speaking of that i just bought a stump grinder for my skidsteer, anyone have any stumps they need ground??? ;D

[beefriendly1]

If you have decided to do processing for others, please let me know.  We are looking for a contact in N VT near Burlington. 

[timberlinetree]

Hope the sun keeps shining up north. We had a major storm here in October 2011 that put alot of wood on the ground. All of a sudden every lanscaper and his brother were in the firewood business! A lot of homeowners had their own stock piles too. Wood went from $225, pushing $250 a cord down to $175 a cord. Not into big government, but I need a license to cut logs, a license to trim trees, maybe there should be a license/permit to sell firewood commercially... Let's let the bakers do the baking and hopefully some day firewood producers can make just a little of the profits that the oil companies make 

[SwampDonkey]

I've never really seen those kinds of swings because of a storm. I guess it's because we have pulp markets. There are only a handful of processor guys and anyone with a woodlot cuts their own anyway. Around here we just get micro bursts, so the amount of wood torn up in a storm is small potatoes. If it's softwood blow downs, there is no firewood market for that to amount to much. Camp grounds seem to have fir or spruce kindling in dry shelters, something for lots of smoke, sparks and crackling.