board and batten siding

[tat]

Which would last longer when used as b&b siding, water oak or pine. Plan on leaving a natural color and spraying with a sealant. These 2 are really my only choices because this is the type of trees that I have. Finally building enough confidence at sawing to start with something other than my trash trees.

[DanG]

I'd say go with the pine. My barn is over 60 years old, sided with pine lap siding, and never had a drop of paint or sealer on it. I have a pile of slabs and strips that has been laying out for about 2 years, some of is pine and some water oak. The oak is rotten and the pine that isn't touching the ground is still solid.

[slowzuki]

If it is in a dry ie sunny and breezy area, both should last a long time.  If it is long pieces, the pine would be lighter to install!

[shopteacher]

I'm in the process of covering my barn with B&B.  It's mostly soft maple and I plan to paint it.  I was going to us a sealer, but haven't seen any that really hold up. The sitka seems to be the best on the market, but if you use the 3 coat product it'll cost you an arm and a leg. I'd have to buy it by the barrel to cover all the siding I have. Anyway what I started to say is I put a piece of galvanized angle(heavy sheet metal) from steel building at the bottom and raised the siding about 1/4" off it.  I'm going to run a bead of 100% silicon between the angle and the bottom of the siding.  I have also been treating the first few inches with cupinol or lumber last and trying to coat the end real good.

[Ron Wenrich]

My house is over 150 yrs old, and they used white pine board and batten.  As long as you keep them off of the ground, they should last.  

What type of pine are you using?  The design on my place used boards 10"+.  The battens are 2 1/2" wide and 3/4" thick.  Gives a nice look.

[tat]

The pine is southern yellow pine and is probably an average of 20" to 30" dbh. The oak is smaller on average but there is a lot of it. Plan on using a lot of that for flooring.

[mitch]

I use rough sawn board and batten (depot style) on all of my buildings. Usually 10"-12" boards and 2 3/4 inch batten from Southern short leaf pine.
http://shagbarkfarms.com/Photos/Shagbark-Pan.JPG

Mitch

[RMay]

I cut all my bat & board siding out of southern pine , the boards is 10 and 12 in. by 1 in. the bats is 3 in. by 5/8 in.  :   I got the sizes from a old Church that is over 125 years old and the b&b siding is like new but the nails is rusting into  8)

[isawlogs]

I'd go with the pine . barn at dads is over 150 years old and the gable ends are pine and we only changed a few no sealer or paint was ever on them .

[slowzuki]

GOOD GOD MAN DON'T PAINT IT! :D

1. The wood doesn't need it
2. Can cause rot problems if the wood can get wet from behind or the bottom
3. Most important, ya gotta scrape and repaint the DanG thing every so often which is terrible work!

[Bro. Noble]

There is an old house on our place with B&B SYP siding.  It's never been painted or coated with anything.  The places in the boards that have a lot of pitch and that are protected by the overhang still have some yellow color.  It looks good to me.  

[Ron Wenrich]

Here's a shot of my farmhouse.  It was when I was working on that part a couple of years ago.  I used 10" and wider boards.  They are random widths.  

As you can see, my house is a 2 story house.  I have replaced the original pine with newer pine.  The old stuff was starting to crack pretty much.  Not bad for 150 year old wood.  The house was built probably in the 1850s.  It is the Gothic style, which was prevalent around that time.

There is additional trim around the windows.  It used a 3 1/2" piece of trim and a gingerbread style under the windows.  It helps set it off.  May not be correct style for the southern states.   :D

The house is post and beam.  The only place there are posts are on the corners and where there are windows and doors.  Heavy wind braces on all the corners.  The posts are only 4 x 4.

I made a bevel cut for the boards that were shorter than the run, so water wouldn't hang in.  I also caulked with a 50 yr caulk behind the battens.  Helps cut out the wind.

[tat]

Thanks for all the replies. I guess ya'll made my mind up for me. Pine it will be. Thanks again for the input,pictures and links.

[UNCLEBUCK]

nice house Ron, here is my first attempt at b&b siding last spring trying to cover up the saw shack with some free spruce logs I sawed. They went through the sawblade and right onto the wall dripping green and I used sheetrock screws and screwed each side then screwed the battens on and in about 3 months every board has a few long cracks up and down , after finishing it all then I read the book on how to do it ,  :D  especially 16 or 18 inch wide boards, but at the time I didnt care because I was having fun and just wanted to close off the strong northwest winds  :D  maybe someone can share their experience putting on green stuff .good luck tat !                                                                                            

[UNCLEBUCK]

 hey Mitch , what kind of stain did you put on your b&b and did you let the boards dry for awhile before you fastened them on . also did you just fasten one side of each board and then fasten the batten through the middle, and and and did you fasten the b&b directly to the stud framework . I like looking at that picture and just recently in my Gurneys seed catalog I seen shagbark hickory trees, I never knew how you got the name shagbark, now I do. a shagbark tree ! what kind of trees are in that picture?  sorry for all the questions but its a great picture of your house and it all came from your sawmill, very cool !

[IndyIan]

What's the narrowest boards people would recommend for the boards?  I'm going to be building a garage this summer 28'x32' and I'd like to use our white cedar.  Problem is that most of the cedar is around 9", some 12" on the small end of a 10' log.  
Would random widths 5 to 9" look silly?  I've looked around here and most peope use equal width, 8 to 12" boards.  Bigger buildings using wider boards.

Is my sawyer going to go insane flipping logs and edging all these little boards?  He's got an WM L17 I believe, manual.

Thanks,
Ian

  

[Ron Wenrich]

The biggest problem is going to be the reveal left after you put up your batten.  If you are using 2 1'2" battens, a 5" board is only going to have a 2 1/2" reveal.  It doesn't look good to my eye.

The same goes with too small of a batten.  I've seen some 2" battens, and they just don't look good.  

Boards all the same width look too manufactured, something like T-111.  Its also a lot easier to cover up flaws with random widths.

I've used some that are narrower than 10".  The smallest is about 8".  I wouldn't go any smaller than that.  

To get the widest board, just skim one side of the log, turn 180 and skim the other side.  Then lay on the side and live saw.  The boards in the middle will be the widest.  The stuff on the outside with little width can be made into battens.  More edging, but wider boards.

[Tom]

I mostly cut 3" bats to go on 8" or larger boards for my customers.  I also cut the bats thinner than the boards.  If I know the boards are going for a wall then cut it 7/8".  I cut the bats 5/8" so they don't stick out from the wall so far.  The only reason for cutting the wall boards a shy 1 inch is to take weight off of the wall but leave enough thickness for weathering and strength against penetration.

I love board and batten construction mostly because it can be repaired with any width of board or boards that will fill the hole. If you use only one size for uniformity, you lose that ability without changing the look.  I agree with Ron. Use any size that happens to get in your hand.  Patterns are neat but not necessary.

Horizontal siding  must all be the same width.  At least each run must be the same width.  When you need to replace a board, you have to put one back just like the one you took down.  That's ok if you can buy the board but not if you can't.  There's been a lot of folks around here that were stymied when they couldn't get the right width of novelty siding(clapboard) for their house.

If you're a mind, you can put up board on board.  I don't like so much because it's more difficult and I don't think as sturdy.   It's when you separate the bottom boards by a distance of about 2 inches less than the width of the board that will cover the gap.  Then you nail a board across the gap which could be called a batten.  It can't be as weather proof since the bottom boards aren't butted up against one another but it saves you from having to cut battens.

Oh!  All our walls are usually Southern Yellow Pine or Cypress.  That's probably because that is the most that we have.   I don't know of anybody who builds with hardwood down here except chicken farmers. They'll use anything. :D

Our hardwoods go for interior paneling and cabinets.

[shopteacher]

Hey Tom,
   I hope you ain't insinuating that old Butch and I are chicken farmers.  >:( Why we don't even have a chicken on the place.  Now we do have a few fine, pedigree yard pimps strutting around but they ain't no chicken. :D
    I find that I get about as much soft maple as I do pine.  Those little silver leaf maple that grow so easy are left by home owners till there about 36" in dia. and close to the house and the wind and rain start to drop 10" dia limbs or splits onto their roofs then it's get that tree out of here.  Have one right now to pickup 36" X 22'.  Hope to get it home over the weekend, if the weather will co-operate 8)

[IndyIan]

Thanks for the info guys, I'll have to look into Tom's board on board suggestion as well.  That might be the practical option.

Ian

[logman]

If you haven't seen it Jim Rogers has a good thread on
b&b siding on the Timber Framing forum under "Siding
a timber frame shed".

[etat]

this is what I'm doing.  there are treated horizontal strips on each stud between the osb and house wrap and the siding  to allow moisture to dissapate.  I think they call it a rain screen when done this way..Weep holes will be left at the bottom of the siding to allow any water out.  Has been treated with homemade borax solution, front and back.  Predrilled holes with 3 and 1/2 inch coated siding screws.  Extra flashing behind all windows, doors, and corners.  Will be treating with homemade waterproofing solution and allow to weather naturally. Poplar originally cut on bandsaw mill.  Notches on each side cut with table saw.  Uper notch on each board planed down some with hand planer to better allow water to run out from the cracks. As you can see the scrap board is cupped.  It's been laying on the ground awhile.  Storing extra siding boards in the attic if future replacement ever needed.  Hope not in my lifetime. Sorry for the quality of the pictures.  Extremely cheap digital camera.  Hope to upgrade someday.

2/8 yellow poplar



corner

[tat]

Hey shopteacher, I think Tom was taking a friendly poke at me because I am a chicken farmer, and I have been known to use whatever was at hand, right or wrong but I am trying to change my ways and do things right the first time because I don't have the time to do it again anymore. :D

[Tom]

Not taking shots, fellows.  I've got a rich background of sawing for chicken farmers.  This is Broiler and Fryer country. Tyson just left but there'll be another come along to take advantage of all the empty chicken houses, I'm sure.

These chicken farmers were the reason I shopped for a longer-than-twenty-foot-mill.  Beats anything I ever saw.  They would take a 500 foot long 1x4 if I could give it to them.  

Most folks will cut 2x8s with the idea of splitting them into 2x4's if they have to.  Chicken farmers want 1x4's with the idea that they can nail them together and make anything they want. :D

When I'm sawing for a chicken house that is going up fast and right off of the saw, they prefer pine but will bring anything the sons put on the ground.  I've sawed side boards and had pine, maple, black gum, sycamore, sweet gum and stuff I couldn't recognize all on the ramp at the same time. If they needed some more roof lathe while I was sawing side boards, then I just cut them out of whatever was on themill at the time.   Beats anything I ever saw.

I don't have any customers that do that but chicken farmers.  I figure it's a chicken farmer thing. :D :D

[DanG]

They ain't the only ones, Tom. I'm sawing some pine for a couple of pig farmers. They want all 2x4 and 1x4 stuff. When I asked them what length, all they would say was "The longer the better."