B20 Issues

[TGS]

Hello!  My name is Martin and I've been lurking here for quite some time.  The wealth of knowledge found on this website is second to none.  I can't believe that I found so many of my interests in one spot! I've read countless posts on these forums and feel like i know some of you first hand. It is my pleasure to finally step up and introduce myself!

After spending 2.5 years pushing a manual mill I gratefully upgraded to a hydraulic.  The bargain I found was for a B20 with only 37 hours on it.  It still had that new mill smell! Actually to be a few years old it was in excellent condition.  Everytime I use it I am really amazed at the power this mill has and the sheer volume that I can turn out in a day with it.  However, there are a few issues that still need to be adressed and hopefully you folks can help me out. 

The first job I took on with the new mill was for 2000 bf of well seasoned white oak (read 'concrete').  The mill came with 17 new timberking blades.  Now I'm used to the woodmizer .045 with a 10 degree pitch.  Yes 10 degrees is a little steep for seasoned oak but this stuff isn't a regular commodity for me. The timberking blades were .041 and limp as wet spaghetti.  Correct me if i'm wrong but i think the standard for timberking is also a 12 degree pitch.  At any rate that oak made for a lot of wavy cuts, despite feed speeds ranging from too much to painfully slow.  My next few jobs are for poplar so i'm hoping for a vast improvement.  I've used blades from mizer, cooks, and half a dozen other manufacturers and have found the woodmizer blades to suit me the best.  Maybe some of you guys and gals can tell me your preference of blade/b20 combo.

On another note, my setworks doesn't come on.  After the 3rd squaring cut on the first log I flipped the switch for the setworks and the display never came on.  Yeah, I missed this little nugget when I viewed the mill for the first time.  When I took the front panel off the electrical box I was met with a lot of water in the bottom.  I don't know if it was condensate or maybe from the rain we had a few nights before I picked the mill up.  On first inspection I found that the 4 pins on the setworks cord (that comes in through the bottom of the electrical box) were corroded.  The 50A buss fuse had also been bypassed.  I later learned that the setworks had been bypassed entirely.  When I put the meter on the fuse I found that it was dead.  Hence the bypass.  Take the front cover off of the setworks and all is dry and tight.  Meter shows less than 1V to the connectors.  Actually the volage was more like .1v.  Now i'm no electrical engineer but I don't think .1 volt is enough to get the job done. I didn't have a good schematic for the electrical box so I called Timberking.  QC guy Jimmy takes the call and works with me for nearly an hour going through redundant checks of switches and cord reels, and jumps, and bypasses.  He was very pleasant and friendly, honestly the first one on the timberking staff I can say that for.  At the end of the hour he talks to guru Matt who I had talked to earlier.  Matt was short and blunt and basically wrote me off with an email showing the schematics and the bypass for the setworks. Thats how I figured out they were already bypassed. So Matt tells Jimmy to have me remove the three components for the setworks and mail them in for a free test. Before I started dismantling a relatively new mill I removed the cover from the T-Junction box that accepts  wires from the electrical box, the sensor, and the setworks.  Immediately I see burned shrink wrap.  It was a little circuit board that had 3 wires stemming from it.  One back to the box, one to the sensor, one to the works.  Now here is my chicken or the egg question. 
Which came first, the corroded pin created a short and fried the board, or the bypassed fuse allowed it to fry. I'm banking on the corrosion.  I talked to Guru Matt again and he bluntly told me that the electrical components were very sensitive and had to be put together perfectly.  Well no kidding.  I think that goes for everything electrical, whether its a nuclear bomb or a 120v outlet in your kitchen. Long story short, I ordered a new board for 30 bucks plus shipping. To this point I have thoroughly cleaned the 4 pin contacts in the cord and replaced the bad buss fuse. I'm curious if any other B20 owners have had this same problem.  I would rather not reinstall the circuit board and watch if fry because I overlooked something simple.     

Another problem I'm having is with the dog. The wedge on the top of the ram bottoms out before the ram itself does.  This effectively removes the wedge every single time.  Is there a way to adust the stroke or maybe move the whole jack just a little to stop this. I know the operator could do a lot if he would just pay more attention but I would like to take the human element out of it, if i can.   

Overall I am very happy with my purchase and wouldn't trade it for anything (except maybe a 2400!)  Thanks for taking the time to read through all this post.

Martin.

[Meadows Miller]

Gday

And welcome to the Forum Martin  ;) ;D ;D ;D 8) 8) I sounds like you have abit of experiance to share so pull up a Pack and have a chat there are alot of Top People around here Mate  ;) ;D ;D ;D 8) 8) 8)

With your sizeing issue the way i see it these things happen from time to time and somtmes its because the gears been sitting awhile Mate  ;) Most of my exp is with air,hyd and 240v elec  sizing on larger mills  ;) all the smaller mils like Lucas's & Wm's i have used have just been of the scale type sizeing which on that style of mill i think is Simple and Deadly effective if you have your eye in which i like  ;) :D ;D ;D ;D 8) 8)

Regards Chris

[Bibbyman]

Welcome to the Fourm! 

Sorry,  but I can't help you with any of your B20 problems as I don't know nothing about them.  Sounds like you're going to be in a first name basis with TimberKing Support before you get these issues worked out.

[ladylake]

 No need to needle TK or there support, they make a nice simple easy to work on mill and the parts aren't too bad compared to some other brands.   Steve

[ljmathias]

Welcome, and thanks for the story- great to hear you working through the trials and tribulations of a new-to-you mill.  There's always something, as Roseannadanna used to say, and what makes it fun is when you work through all the fixes and actually cut something that turns out pretty good- I've done it a couple of times and that makes it all worthwhile.  Hang in there and keep us posted!

Lj

[sawwood]

Martin i had a frend that had a B20 with the set works and he put a industrial grade cord reel on.
Some of the b20  owners here on the FF have i think bought theres off ebay. I don't know much
about a B20 but Timberking is a good company and will help you with any trouble you have. Hang
in there and by fixing this proublem you will under stand you mill inside out.

Lester

[Magicman]

Martin,  I can't help you with your TK, but I can say Welcome to The Forestry Forum.  You are in very good hands here.

[Mark Webb]

Martin,
I just sent my setworks, sensor, and wiring harness to Mike at TK and got it back last week. They replaced the control box {setwork} and reworked the wiring harness. $541.00. I still need to make some more adjustments because there are several things that effect the correct operation of it. Mike is the best one to talk with that I've found. Ladylake here on the forum has been of great help also.

[Sue]

I just got a Timber King B-20 and have on and off problems with the electrical up and down.
It has only 200 hours on the maching and works great with the smaller red pine but with a larger log It dives and bends the blade no matter how slow I go.  Does another B-20 need help for a day so I get a better feel for the machine in northern Mn.  Sue

[ladylake]

  For the setworks you need to get a industrial cord reel, if that wide pine is dry try blades with more set. I live 50 miles south of Brainard, your wecome to come watch (offbear) all you want.  Steve

[flip]

The current setworks stinks, I have rewired my mill 3 times now, new relay boxes, switches, reel, new terminal ends etc.  I would rewire everything up to the set works box and see what you get.  Usually problem is in the wiring on the carriage.......somewere.  If there is anything I can do to help let me know.  FWIW I made a dual ground for my cord reel, it worked for about 3 months now it doesn't work again. We made some magnetic strips to hang on the left rear post and just us it now, almost as fast as setworks without the malfunctions.

[ladylake]

 Flip did you ever put a good  industrial cord reel on, since I've did mine about 4 years ago I haven't had to touch a thing on the setworks and they work all day every day, I do have to clean the contacts every 3 months or so which is a 10 minute job. There is no way you can saw as fast or as accurate with out them.  Before that good cord reel I went though the same thing as you over and over with no help.    Steve

[redbeard]

I just got a Timber King B-20 and have on and off problems with the electrical up and down.
It has only 200 hours on the maching and works great with the smaller red pine but with a larger log It dives and bends the blade no matter how slow I go.  Does another B-20 need help for a day so I get a better feel for the machine in northern Mn.  Sue

Check your plug connection to computer board it may be loose sometimes its a simple fix and the cord reel is usually the culprit ( I sure would like to find a brand name or after market one that is fool proof I'am on my third one from TK)   The guide rollers have to be trued and leveled ,check the idle side guide roller when its extended for wide cuts make sure it stays the same as when its all the way in.

[flip]

Flip did you ever put a good  industrial cord reel on, since I've did mine about 4 years ago I haven't had to touch a thing on the setworks and they work all day every day, I do have to clean the contacts every 3 months or so which is a 10 minute job. There is no way you can saw as fast or as accurate with out them.  Before that good cord reel I went though the same thing as you over and over with no help.    Steve

Can't justify dropping the coin for one of those reels, have been watching fleabay and have yet to come across one that is less than a couple hundo or look like it went through the war.  My dual ground set up worked great for a while. I canniblaized a set of fingers from an old reel and made another slip ring for the unused groove.  Guess it needs to be cleaned and relubed but the sticks we made work as well, just have to bring the carriage back to the operator station to see the marks.

[ladylake]

 I got my brand new 6 wire cord reel for $160 shipped, not to bad a price for no more aggrevation plus a remote throttle and power log dog. This morning there was a brand new one for $200 plus shipping.   Steve

[flip]

I got my brand new 6 wire cord reel for $160 shipped, not to bad a price for no more aggrevation plus a remote throttle and power log dog. This morning there was a brand new one for $200 plus shipping.   Steve

I thought you were using the heavy duty version ??? 

[ladylake]

 It is heavy duty, over 60#  Insul8 is the brand . That one they had for $200 this morning is gone. Right now $255 new for a decent one.    Steve

[Mark Webb]

This a picture of the industrial cord reel for my B20 Steve told me about. With shipping from ebay it was $257.00. I had to have a good bracket made to support it and it takes up some extra room on the carriage, but I can still saw 20' logs.

[ladylake]

 Mark  Nice pic, mine is even bigger and I had to mount it around 1' farther back but it's not in the way at all.   Steve

[ladylake]

Mark  I just looked at your pic again, where's that chip deflector on the left side guide wheel, I think my blade life doubled after I put a good on on. just a 1"  X 1/8" piece of metal bent at 90* mounted on the guide wheel bolt set about 1/8" above the blade covering the whole blade except for the teeth.    Steve

[EmannVB]

Martin,

I have a B20 that I bought used about a year ago.  Like yours, mine came with a stash of TK blades.  Now, to be fair, I had never even laid eyes on a mill until mine arrived- so I'm certain some of the short blade life was due to my own inexperience... that being said, I exhausted my TK blades and got 15 new WM .045's and they've been great!  I did have one that would dive on the entry cut from the first log it touched.  Just bad from the factory I guess...  I've been sawing a BUNCH of 1" Poplar, so I'm not working them too hard...
My setworks has been fine so far. The previous owner had replaced the cord reel with a not-too-industrial looking one, and it's been trouble free so far.  He even included an extra reel and a metal detector (that I didn't use, until I found my first treasure).

Welcome to the forum!  Everytime I come here I realize how little I know!

~Mark

[redbeard]

This a picture of the industrial cord reel for my B20 Steve told me about. With shipping from ebay it was $257.00. I had to have a good bracket made to support it and it takes up some extra room on the carriage, but I can still saw 20' logs.

That's a heavy duty reel, I like how high the cord is. I will be shopping now!

[redbeard]

Has any B-20 owners or other similar mills installed the factory 10' extension? I don't intend on ever being mobile and i think I'am ready to install it 5 yrs i have been wanting to put it on. I plan on fixing frame to concrete pad with fabricated stands would like to get advise if anyone else has done this, Pros and Cons thanks.