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Portable milling support equipment

Started by mad murdock, January 11, 2018, 08:14:12 AM

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mad murdock

JCB makes a skid steer (tracked) like nine I have ever seen, quick attach features with many options. Have any of you ever seen one of these in action?https://youtu.be/HbPSCh-_EtU
 Very interesting little critter!!
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

Darrel

1992 LT40HD

If I don't pick myself up by my own bootstraps, nobody else will.

DMcCoy

Years ago(maybe 40) I read a practical book on "engineering economy".  A search today says that term has changed to engineering economics and the amount of higher level math applied makes my eyes glaze over, this is not what I remember reading.

What I do remember is there are two different aspects in manufacturing anything-material flow and accumulation points.  Bottlenecks can form in both areas hindering the overall process and the economics of what should be done to maximize profit sometimes hidden or not so obvious.  The 'time value of money' was one concept that was discussed in detail.  I wish I had a book to recommend.

With the rising cost and serious shortage of labor locally it isn't as easy or fun as it used to be.  Labor is in charge of wages!  I had a fellow business owner telling me they had someone with zero experience demand $17.00 an hour to start doing basic labor!  A good employee will make you money and it worth a higher price.  Deciding who that will be from a brief interview not so easy.  Labor is more flexible and equipment isn't.  Equipment doesn't get sick, show up late, or change it's price.

My 2 cents, fwiw.

mike_belben

With respect to loaders and time there is no bigger waste of time than dropping a stack of logs, boards or slab pile off the fork loader because it bounced off, and then chasing them all around to reload.  Ive done this with every medium many times.  Pickup sticks ruins your day.  

After that is when you cant tip far enough to dump the load on the forks.

Bounce is the enemy.  Forks that cant curl back against the back board are the enemy.  Forks that dont have a hydraulic finger for log clamping are the enemy.  

Skid steer positives. very tight manueavering, tons of attachments, great traction, forks dump vertical.  But they rut everywhere, bounce stuff off the forks, limited lift, hard to enter with a load, rain on your lap, and the cheap fork attachments dont curl back enough to capture a log on a downslope without a finger clamp.  

Indoor Forklifts enjoy extreme maneuverability but always stuck, great load capacity but can only lift and set down.  No dumping.  If you arent stacking high inside a building theyre less likely to be the perfect tool.  The backwards tractor style of offroad forklift is probably a much better sawmill machine, especially if you are running out of space to operate.  I have an articulated 4wd nasco but they made a lot of the 2wd for this.  Good simple machines from alabama i think. Still a forklift though.  Limited curl range and needing tons of room to operate is their problem.  

4x4 Tractor loaders are versatile.  Their problem is the steer knuckle weakness. Thus the loaders must be capacity limited to save the front axle housing and planetary parts.  So theyre almost perfect, except for load capacity and longevity when overloaded.  Only other gripe might be turning radius in tight yard.  Theyre half way between skid steer and articulated steer. 

Wheel loaders have an ideal mast setup for log yard work and a solid axle to handle the load.  Full range of curl and dump wins the fork articulation contest.  no other machine can lift as heavy and manage offroad too.  

If i needed one machine to support a portable sawing operation, i would find a waldon loader with R1 or R4 tires on it and rig up a quick change to swap from bucket to forks with a top clamp.  Thats a dead simple, do it all machine that will load heavier than you think and not tear up the customers yard like a bobcat.  With a truck winch it can also do some light skidding if you are going in the woods after your own lumber.

Praise The Lord

mad murdock

Mike, your advice is good, I am wondering if you saw the video of the JCB teleskid. What are your thoughts of it vs a wheel loader? I am drawn to it due to its compact size and its ability to handle good sized loads along with its increased versatility. I will be getting some proposed scenarios for it, as in lease cost vs purchase, etc. I am interested in you assessment of this machine. Thanks! mad murdock
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

Crusarius

I keep thinking for just where you are cutting lumber that a mini excavator with a thumb would be the best all around option.

Savannahdan

Saw various JCB equipment and a few others in action during Hurricane Matthew cleanup here in Savannah.  One looked much like a moon rover and it took whatever was on the ground, lifted it over the sides of dump trucks and "Kaboom" let it go.  Those thing didn't grunt or even like they were going to tip over.  Just wish I had the place that they could have just dumped them for me to saw them.
Husqvarna 3120XP, Makita DCS7901 Chainsaw, 30" & 56" Granberg Chain Saw Mill, Logosol M8 Farmers Mill

YellowHammer

If your dealer will allow, have them drop the piece of equipment off for a week at your place.  I've done it several times.  Try it before you buy it.  
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

mad murdock

That is definitely an option that is under consideration. One other key consideration is ease of moving the machine from place to place. If need arises to have it available to prep a job, for example I have a couple OG doug firs on my tree farm (7 1/2' dia dbh x about 200+ ft tall) I will need some sort of machine to prep a bed for the tree which will also serve as working area to cut it into finished product or cants on the spot, as a tree this size is too large to move by today's standards. My mill on the other hand can cut it to finished dimension or sawable  cants easily insitu. Though most of the time it is nice to try and limit milling to one general locale. 
Turbosawmill M6 (now M8) Warrior Ultra liteweight, Granberg Alaskan III, lots of saws-gas powered and human powered :D

mike_belben

I think highly of JCB, they are boundary pushers.  The CX1 really blew my doors off.  

That machine looks to be based off the "robot" side boom.  I sat in one of the them once and it was a heck of a lot better than the tin coffin of an old bobcat 7xx.  The engine was pretty easy to get at and visibility was good, side door was nice feature.  I mean i never worked on one and like anything there are gonna be lemons lurking in the batch, there are gonna be parts that are very hard to get at.  Equipment is a gamble in general.  If i were a betting man id be pretty confident in JCB.

Nice thing about that telescope is youll be able to self extract if ever manage to get stuck.  Id be careful about extending it when youre real heavy and running on the toes.   Be a good hard faceplant if you went over at full boom.  telescoping booms are a wonderful feature for grading and finishing over banks and berms.  You just sit stationary and let them rake in and out.
Praise The Lord

JonathanPace

Efficiency is the name of the game, right? I hear you loud and clear on the importance of maximizing material flow to really unlock that mill potential. Speaking of mills, I've got my trusty Turbosawmill M12 churning away for me. It's gem! A semi-stationary setup sounds like a plan, and being able to shuffle the mill around as needed? Perfect.  

Joe Hillmann

I have only been around a swing mill a couple times.

Things that appeared to help with production were:

To pile the logs nicely slightly up hill of the mill.  That way they could be rolled easily with cant hooks under the mill.  That way you don't have to start a machine to load a new log every time.  Having 3 or 4 logs staged ready to be rolled in place looked about right.  More than that and they had to be rolled further or double stacked and more dangerous. 

Good v bunks and log dogs to stop the log from shifting as it got smaller.  One site just dug a small trench in the dirt to cradle the logs which worked good for large logs cut where they fell.  The other had two 6x6's laid on the ground with a small v cut out of each to hold the log in place,  They also used an impact drive and straps of iron to drive lag bolts into both the log and bunks to hold the final slab in place.

One person sawing and one person at the tail end stacking appeared to work well.  Roller tables may be helpful especially if sorting different sized finished material.



Not specific to a swing mill, having stickers already cut and ready rather than cutting them as necessary speeds things up.  Having a spot already made up to stack and maybe band the wood very close to the mill and a machine large enough to move the stacks once they are full is also helpful.


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