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Spruce, Pine, Doug Fir, ER Cedar & Hardwoods

Started by Sedgehammer, February 26, 2019, 10:42:44 PM

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Sedgehammer

Just found out from the mill that they have beetle kill spruce and pine along with the doug fir, but the doug fir is green. They said the spruce and pine are very stable. Spruce as big as 14" x 24" x 35'.

Interior;

As some of you know we have 24' & 20' spans 2' oc with exposed ceiling joists and 2x8 syp t&g for the ceiling. Going with 4x12's. No, don't need it, but it's a look thing.

20'  span 2' oc exposed floor joists. 4x12's here also, as the 2x8 syp t&g ceiling.

Also going with 8x12 ridge beam in-between the cathedral ceiling joists.

I can get the doug fir dried for $0.35 a board ft.

I know the df is stronger, but the pine and spruce more than do the spans.

Exterior;

We are also doing an exposed ceiling joist wrap around porch and a big timbered porch all with 2x8 syp t&g cieling. We are going to put ready seal on all the rough cut joists & timbers regardless of species interior and exterior.

Plus we are going with 12x12 porch posts. Posts will be tucked in 3' from drip line.

Exposed rafter tails were either going to be cedar or doug fir

Fascia was going to be either cedar or doug fir

For you guys that work with big timbers, what would you use where and why?

Also just found a place where I can get green 12x12 hardwood posts or 12x12 eastern red cedar ones. Price points are all roughly the same.

Would you prefer these over the pine/fir/spruce posts and why?

Thanks
Necessity is the engine of drive

Don P

If you are trying to build a floor out of clearspan 24' long 4x12's the plan needs more thought.

Sedgehammer

Quote from: Don P on February 27, 2019, 07:39:16 AM
If you are trying to build a floor out of clearspan 24' long 4x12's the plan needs more thought.
the 24' is the ceiling joists. we've already discussed that part. it passes at 30lbs psf. Can even go out to 32" oc.
Necessity is the engine of drive

Brad_bb

While any of the 3 can be used, I'd go for the DF if you can get the grade(s) you need.  It's the highest strength to weight ratio, and has a nice look.   For tie beams, you need the best material, as they span the longest distances.  Are you able to specify grade from this mill?  Although most designs are done assuming grade 2 common, you really don't want any of your timber to actually be grade 2. Tie beams need to be #1 or preferably select.  Posts can be your lowest grade, but you also need to keep in mind that you need good wood there the joinery will occur.  It's hard chopping through knots, so avoid if at all possible. Rafters need to be #1 or better as do most horizontal beams.  Have you read the NELMA rules to understand the grading?  In Steve Chappell's book "A Timber Framers Workshop" I believes he talks a bit about visual grading of timbers, which you should become familiar with so you visually grade your timbers.
Anything someone can design, I can sure figure out how to fix!
If I say it\\\\\\\'s going to take so long, multiply that by at least 3!

Sedgehammer

I agree the DF looks better (especially now that I have stained the different samples) and is the better wood, it's just I'll need to dry it vs the other

Yes can specify the grade

Have not read anything yet on grading the wood. I'll check that book out. Good idea

Do you have any issues with using DF for exposed rafter tails like these in the picture? It's from my pump house that we are building. The house will have similar. I would probably use the cedar for the fascia though





Thanks again!
Necessity is the engine of drive

Dave Shepard

Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Sedgehammer

Doesn't necessarily have to be, but we are using dried for the rest of the framing and if I dry it, I don't need to guesstimate shrink.
Necessity is the engine of drive

Sedgehammer

Does anyone have issues with using DF for the exposed rafter tails like I show in the above picture? 

It's either DF, ERC or WC. 

All the porches will be using exposed ceiling/roof/rafter tails, so besides just the tail being exposed, the entire rafter will be also.

Thanks
Necessity is the engine of drive

Mike W

I don't see any issues as long as it is treated to protect against he elements.  DF is typically used in conventional framing and the outlookers supporting the barge is usually DF as well.  I would just get something a bit more resistant to weathering for the fascia and barge.

Sedgehammer

Thanks Mike

What is anyone's thoughts on running the 4x12 DF timbers with the SYP t&g in the bathroom area? 

Ceiling is 10'. 

Shower will be self contained, so no exposure in it. Will have jet tub, but only expect to use it a few times a month at best.

SYP will be poly'd and the timbers will have ready seal on them, but don't want to have to re-coat them, but if needed, would do so.
Necessity is the engine of drive

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