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What's wrong with my boards

Started by mjeselskis, July 02, 2017, 08:37:34 PM

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Solomon

Quote from: btulloh on July 02, 2017, 08:48:07 PM
Mold. You need air circulation. You'd be better off outside but probably still need fans. Down here pine will mold overnight in summer.
I have had mold problems with SYP and Silver Maple  and I'm also in Virginia.
I have found White Pine to be a lot less prone to getting moldy or turning black
and I've had good results with WP but I may have gotten lucky.
Thinking back, I can't tell you what the humidity level or the weather was the few times I've sawn WP.
SYP seem to turn green if I don't take the board right off the mill straight into
the drying box with the fans running and I bleach it on the way in.
I have about 1k  BF  of silver maple that's stained up pretty bad/good but I will
build some paint grade adirondack chairs or a country pantry that I can paint.
  A gallon of Kilz and a good quality satin  extierior latex will make a sawyer what he ain't !!!!
Time and Money,  If you have the one, you rarely have the other.

The Path to Salvation is narrow, and the path to damnnation is wide.

clintnelms

Quote from: flatrock58 on July 04, 2017, 10:36:18 PM
I had the same problem over the last two weeks with some 1x12 board and batten I cut.  I have them stacked in the new shed but there is no power so no fans.  I unstacked them and sprayed bleach, but like yellowhammer said that does not stop the moisture problem. 

I was wondering if I stood the boards up after cutting the if they would dry better than stacking and stickering them?  They would definitely get more air flow.  it has been raining every day in Georgia and humidity is sky high.

I'm in South Georgia myself and having the same exact problem. Gotta be this heat and humidity we're having. Luckily the boards I've sawn so far have been furring strips and other boards that will be covered. I sprayed them good with bleach and got a fan blowing on them good and it helped. Definitely gotta figure something out for the board and batten siding I'm fixing to start on.

OffGrid973

You know what they say about stopping a jelly fish sting...maybe worth a shot :)

On a serious note this thread will save others from the issue, so you are paying it forward with the 40 hrs in.  Not sure that helps but hopefully eases the pain a little.
Your Fellow Woodworker,
- Off Grid

Darrel

I read this thread and it makes me glad that I live where I do. I feel for you. Had that problem when I lived in Roseburg. But on the east side of the Cascades it's much dryer. Today the temp was 90° F and the humidity 12%.
1992 LT40HD

If I don't pick myself up by my own bootstraps, nobody else will.

fishfighter

12% humidity? :D Down here in Louisiana at this time of the year it is around 75% all day and night. One's tee shirt sticks to you once you walk outside. :(

Ianab

75%, that's luxury...

I think we hit 80% today, as the low. Currently it's 92%. At least it's a cool, 46F.

Don't try and air dry pine around here at this time of year. Cold and humid enough that it wont dry, but not so cold the fungus and bugs wont get in there.

Summer you can dry pine, given a bit of air flow. Still  80% humidity of course.
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

clintnelms

8:15 AM right now and it's 81 degrees and  87% humidity. Supposed to be a high of 95 degrees today with a heat index of 100 to 105. I need to move up north!

fishfighter

That 75% is about avg year round. Of course the heat index the last week has been well above 100F. :(

redprospector

At 6:30 PM it has cooled down to 95 F at my mill. Humidity is about 15%.
Meanwhile, here at the house, it's a sultry 69 F with 30% humidity.
Lumber will dry pretty good either place.  ;D
1996 Timber King B-20 with 14' extension, Morgan Mini Scragg Mill, Fastline Band Scragg Mill (project), 1973 JD 440-b skidder, 2008 Bobcat T-320 with buckets, grapple, auger, Tushogg mulching head, etc., 2006 Fecon FTX-90L with Bull Hog 74SS head, 1994 Vermeer 1250 BC Chipper. A bunch of chainsaws.

Dewey

It all comes down to airflow....  Years ago I sawed 10'000 BF of Pine and stickered it all with just enough space to walk between piles in a fairly small area... the lumber on the outside piles dried fine, but the inner piles  stained allot..... I later started leaving at least 4' between piles on bunks 6"+ high and use dry stickers also sticker the lumber the day it was sawed ... one other thing that I think helps is when taking lumber off the mill thump the boards once on edge to knock any loose sawdust off that traps in moisture  .    I now saw Northern White Cedar the great thing there is no STAIN !!!

clintnelms

Quote from: Dewey on July 07, 2017, 09:42:02 PM
It all comes down to airflow....  Years ago I sawed 10'000 BF of Pine and stickered it all with just enough space to walk between piles in a fairly small area... the lumber on the outside piles dried fine, but the inner piles  stained allot..... I later started leaving at least 4' between piles on bunks 6"+ high and use dry stickers also sticker the lumber the day it was sawed ... one other thing that I think helps is when taking lumber off the mill thump the boards once on edge to knock any loose sawdust off that traps in moisture  .    I now saw Northern White Cedar the great thing there is no STAIN !!!

None of that helped me this time. I use a broom and sweep off all the saw dust off both sides before stacking with 1 inch stickers out in the open and they still molded like that. We've had a lot of rain lately though. Guess that hasn't helped. The stack was covered with metal roofing panels too.

YellowHammer

Mold needs surface moisture to grow, so the solution is to dry the surface of the boards as soon as possible.  This mold and stain issue is a significant one, and there are several papers written in the subject of drying soft and white wood, which is much different than drying conventional hardwoods. 

The drying effect of air velocity on lumber is proportional to how moist the wood is, and how fast the air is flowing.  The effect of air velocity decreases drastically as the wood starts to dry out.  High air velocities and wet wood result in very rapid moisture loss, heigh velocity air and drier wood, not so much. 

The solution is to get high airflow over the stacks as soon as it is milled and use H style stickers.  Typically, I can dry a load of pine out of the danger zone, with the big fans, in about a week, two at the most, in Alabama summertime. 

You don't have to worry about sawdust, when the fans fire up, a cloud will cover anyone downwind.  Thats when you know you have enough airflow.

YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Peter Drouin

Quote from: YellowHammer on July 07, 2017, 10:32:01 PM

You don't have to worry about sawdust, when the fans fire up, a cloud will cover anyone downwind.  Thats when you know you have enough airflow.






:D :D :D :D :D smiley_thumbsup
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

4x4American

lol lol lol lol




Now what if theres sawdust under the sticker, more possibility of sticker stain eh?
Boy, back in my day..

YellowHammer

Yes, so the H stickers will trap almost very little sawdust under the contact area, especially is they were made on a molder and have a radius on the tips. 
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

WDH

Robert,

For a thousand H-stickers today, I will gladly pay you next Tuesday. 


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30knrJBeyr0

;D
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

woodweasel

 I wish I had a stack of oak that looked like that. I have a few customers who would pay nicely for that look. ;D

paul case

Come up to my place the end of next week when we finish haying and we will have some for you.

We often will stick our flitches  of 1com and better in the summer time so they keep long enough for us to get a load. It can take a while just getting a few off some tie logs along. We usually don't stick our pallet stringer flitches as we generally work them up each week, but with my hand injury and my help at the mill having to make most of my hay, we have 4 lifts of pallet flitches waiting to be edged that I think may look like some of them green sticked pine.

Kinda yuck to me.

PC
life is too short to be too serious. (some idiot)
2013 LT40SHE25 and Riehl edger,  WM 94 LT40 hd E15. Cut my sawing ''teeth'' on an EZ Boardwalk
sawing oak.hickory,ERC,walnut and almost anything else that shows up.
Don't get phylosophical with me. you will loose me for sure.
pc

Ga Mtn Man

Anyone have any experience with a product called Pallet-Nu from this company?

https://www.envirotechenterprises.com/
"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy." - Red Green


2012 LT40HDG29 with "Superized" hydraulics,  2 LogRite cant hooks, home-built log arch.

YellowHammer

Quote from: WDH on July 08, 2017, 07:32:17 PM
Robert,
For a thousand H-stickers today, I will gladly pay you next Tuesday. 
Heck, I'd have given you twice as many for half the price the day before last week... ;D
YellowHammerisms:

Take steps to save steps.

If it won't roll, its not a log; it's still a tree.  Sawmills cut logs, not trees.

Kiln drying wood: When the cookies are burned, they're burned, and you can't fix them.

Sawing is fun for the first couple million boards.

Be smarter than the sawdust

Alligator

Quite a few million feet air dried in south Alabama humidity like this.
Esterer Sash Gang is a  Money Machine

clintnelms

mjeselskis,
So how's your boards looking now? After I sprayed mine down with straight bleach they cleared right up. I've started spraying mine down with bleach on both sides before stacking and haven't seen anymore mold yet.

clintnelms

So here's a little proof that bleach will keep the mold from forming. This board I cut and sprayed all but the last part of the board with bleach right after cutting it. Left in on my mill to air dry to see if it would mold. Only the part I didn't spray molded.


btulloh

That's a significant demonstration.  Helpful.  Thanks.
HM126

mjeselskis

Quote from: clintnelms on July 16, 2017, 05:23:41 PM
mjeselskis,
So how's your boards looking now? After I sprayed mine down with straight bleach they cleared right up. I've started spraying mine down with bleach on both sides before stacking and haven't seen anymore mold yet.

They are looking good. The worst ones are still stained gray, but the other ones are looking good and air drying the stickers for a couple days looks like it helped too.
2006 WM LT28  1993 John Deere 5300
Husqvarna 562XP & 365 X-Torq

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