Gearmatic from a timberjack 450? Or can car 20?

[Satamax]

Hi everybody.

I might have found an interesting winch for my little latil machine.

A gearmatic, from a 450 timberjack.




The cover on the right seems cracked. The guy wants 800€ for the moment, plus shipping. A bit dear for me!

Whatcha'r opinion?

Thanks.

Max.

[pdxh20]

That cover is just for the hydraulic tube (swivel) and holds it in place. A Gearmatic that's been sitting out in the weather without use will almost certainly be stuck. Everything is available but pulling it all apart and rebuilding it is a big job ! Here's some pix from my IH S-8 skidder project post of what's inside. 

[Satamax]

Thanks a lot, pdxh20. 

Whatcha think about the price? 

[longtime lurker]

I have a love/hate relationship with Gearmatic 19's

First thing is there are two of them. The Gearmatic fitted to most skidders was the 119. The one you want is a Gearmatic 19, which was mostly fitted to dozers.

The difference is a couple seals and you can upgrade a 119 to a 19 pretty easy.

When people complain about a gearmatic mostly they have the 119, not the 19. Those seals are designed to keep moisture out, and without them then they get sticky right quick. With them... well I can park my old clark out in the weeds and 6 months and 60 inches of rain later she'll fire up and the winch will work. Might need a good log to shift a bit of crud off the bands but I've never had the kind of issues with sticky bands after a wet weekend that people talk about.

Most people who think they have a gearmatic 19 don't, but what do I know. ???

They're a reasonably quick winch - way better then a hercules. And quite reliable IMHO. But finicky... you got to fix them right the first time or they'll drive you mad: they are not a winch for half hearted repairs and shoddy fixes. But do it right and... i dont have too much drama with them really. 

You need the master control for the winch to come with the winch or its worthless. A new master control is worth more then what you're paying for the winch, the last master control unit that we had to replace was about $1250 USD + shipping from memory so if the supplier does not include that part forget it. That price is a couple years old so could have changed considerably.

[Satamax]

OK longtime lurker. Thanks a lot. 

The front end of the skidder burned down. So the part you're talking about is most certainly dead or gone! 

Dang! Well. I'll negociate the price. I'm sure there is a way to modify it. If i can get it for 200€ or so. 

Thanks again. 

[longtime lurker]

I would ask them to throw the burnt out wreck of the master control in as well. They have a cast aluminium housing that will not have burnt, the pushrods inside should be okay, the control handle is aluminium and should be okay too. That leaves seals, springs, buckets and gaskets all of which are available relatively cheaply.

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That should give you an idea of what it would cost to refurbish one assuming the above was correct. (I've dealt with these guys before BTW and wouldnt hesitate to recommend them as good to deal with... and if they'll ship to me they'll ship to anywhere.

[Satamax]

The whole front end has been Scrapped already. 

I will send an email to the guy, asking what he thinks. 

Thanks again. 

Max. 

[coxy]

the 119 is newer than the 19 

[Satamax]

Well, he doesn't have the command system. And there's an unsuspecting buyer down south from me. Who wants it.  I told him to deal with that guy.  Nearly 300 miles, for a non working, uncomplete winch. Too much hassle. 

[teakwood]

You're made the right decision.

an right know mysteriously there is another buyer ??? 

Just wait and the seller will call you back eventually 

[Satamax]

Guys, big question! 

Is this a gearmatic? 350€. No controls again. 






Thanks guys. 

[nativewolf]

No insight but wanted to say that I enjoy your post, spent a week in your neck of the woods when I was a teenager, fun time, great scenery, good food (course when you are a hungry 17 year old most food is good).  

[Ed_K]

Looks like a gearamatic to me one size bigger than my 19.

[Satamax]

It's writen on the plate CC-20b

I think it could be a can car. 

[bushmechanic]

Yes looks like a Gearmatic and was a Tree Farmer winch by the paint. Would also suspect that the machine burnt by the remnants of the control hydraulic hose. 

[Satamax]

Thanks bushmechanic. 

Si, this the sought after model? By the look of the seals suround. 



Would big car master cylinders work, to replace the original control? 

Thanks guys.

[Satamax]

Or, would the slave cylinders work with air? Already thinking of the remote. As i have a 2 channel 4 ways kit i did for another project. Which Nevers got mounted.

[coxy]

that's a can car 

[Satamax]

Thanks a lot Coxy.

That's what i thought. The logo didn't look anything like a gearmatic one. The cc-20b was making me think about can car. And the logo looks like CCF

Is it worth buying? 

[mike_belben]

How much psi do these winches need to actuate their internals?  I know zero about forestry winch control, but what can be done today with air for very cheap using various piloted valves, dc solenoids and mufflers is unreal.  Searching ebay for "SMC" should bring up lots of salvage industrial air components.  You can definitely make a cylinder do anything you need it to.  With an oiler to keep internal parts lubed, id imaging you can stroke servos and apply pistons directly by air pretty well if they dont require more than say 120 psi.  

[Satamax]

Dang! It's gone! :(   

[teakwood]

that's sad. what are the odds that in that exact moment another person is looking for the same item. it's not that a logging winch is wanted like warm bread 

[Satamax]

Well, the ad is still online. I will call with another number, one of those days, to see if what he said was true. :D