What's Your Guideline for Not Cutting Saw Timber or Tree's when it's Windy ?

[H60 Hawk Pilot]

I was out cutting some small tree;s the other day and had a little wind, maybe 5 to 10 knots (I guess) , just enough to notice the wind in the tree's.

I was pointing things out to my Son as  Do and Don't Do !  I remember going out to cut saw timber (40 years ago) and came back in because it was too windy. I don't remember the guide line's to follow as what's too windy.  Is it about 10 to 15 knots or something like... the tops moving about.  If the wind was (not high wind)  steady (not gusty) and blowing in the right direction. Maybe it's a Ok deal too cut with some wind that's going the tree's way... to fall the tree.. with the wind as a pusher.

I do remember the Don's about cuting bigger stuff in  windy and gusty  conditions. The danger of limbs coming down on you by just being under the tree is one thing. The wind moving the tree back on you when it changes direction or a big gust comes up is dangerous as well.

I asked the Wind Guidline Question because I forgot and this is the place to ask.

Avery   

[Jeff]

Let me remind you what the well published guideline is.

USE COMMON SENSE IF AVAILABLE  :-\

[DanG]

10 to 15 knots is way too high for me if I care at all where the tree goes.  Just get in your car and stick your hand out the window at a mere 15mph.  If the tree absolutely has to come down, I put a rope in it.  There are too many factors to have a universal cutoff point.  A tree with leaves is affected much more than a nekkid one.  Like Jeff said, you just have to use common sense.

[Gary_C]

I don't know if there is a specific guideline to follow other than the common sense one like Jeff said. The problem is that many days there can be little wind where you are standing on the ground and yet the tops of the trees are being whipped around by strong and gusty winds.

It can even be a problem when cutting with a machine when you cannot hear the sound of the wind and don't know anything is wrong till the trees start fighting back and don't want to come down or pinch the bar.

[Bobus2003]

What's Your Guideline for Not Cutting Saw Timber or Tree's when it's  Windy?

It depends on the Trees i'm cutting, I will cut the small (0-6" DBH in almost any wind) Larger trees not so much.. But as said before i use common sense

I have had the wind gust up while cutting with a machine and it will throw around a Machine pretty good.. I have heard of it toppling over Timbco's

And just as a General rule.. if i have 3 trees get hung up,  or malfunction while felling i call it a day for cutting and start skidding

[H60 Hawk Pilot]

Well I learned about the current day falling of tree's with a machine cutter's and wind comes into play with them (new info. for me).

Common Sense is always the Prime Number for anything we do. Sometime's, I try to  fix values  to what I do and numbers & knowledge usually apply but not always clear cut in the cut & dry form. I've cut paper wood & saw logs from 15 to 20.  I had one close call... where I was pushed against our dozer (pinned) by a staright as a die oak that split back on the stump. I was pinned for about an hour (not hurt). I never figured that tree as problem child and my common sense or little voice of experience did not help either. So, I pay very close attention to detail and lot's of acquired knowledge is my life saver.  It's important to have your Game Plan at 100% power before you go out in the woods. Also, if you can't perfrom the tasks (correctly) in your mind, then, guessing or just doing something by trial or error can be your last day on earth. I've seen the result's of dead and injured folks (dumb accidents) in my home area over the years. Most of these accident's were caused by stupidy, lack of knowledge, miss using equipment, etc. . Common sense never got on the score board ... they were lost to begin with.   

Thank's for the Information.

Avery   

[loggit]

Years ago we were selling logs to a small mill and the owner's cousin had a tree fall on him on a windy day. I asked what happened and why was he working on such a windy day. He said his cousin was one of those people who didn't want the weather to dictate whether he worked or not.

I was working on a little bit windy day and went out with a hitch and by the time I got back for the next, two trees had just blown over where I had been standing cutting. Packed it in for the day needless to say.

Too many variables with the wind, yeah common sense prevails.

[plasticweld]

a good question that I wish I could give a technically correct answer. I can say that in the last six months working 6 to 7 days a week we have only stopped working once due to high winds and they were gusting 30 to 40 mph. Wind here is pretty common I have not worked on a hillside where it was not a every day factor and until this post gave the wind little thought as to what was too windy. I know that we try for two trailer loads of tree length a day and make it a point to not let sleet snow or freezing rain stop us. It maybe because I am debt motovated rather than common sense motovated

[CX3]

this is a tough question to answer.  I usually look to the tops of the tree and if it is "swirling" in a circle theres no  way I will cut that tree.  A light breeze that just pushes the trees slightly may not be as big a factor.  It also may not be as windy in a holler and we may move down to cut for the rest of the day.  All in all if there is one thing I have ever learned while logging is this.....If for any reason you feel unsafe, whether cutting, skidding, etc, then stop and re work the problem or it will kill you.

[H60 Hawk Pilot]

CX3, Plasticweld and Loggit.. I Read Ya

CX3 I lilked your Last Comment Most of All, " If for Any Reason You Feel Unsafe ... XXXXXX, then Stop and Rework the Problem or it Will Kill You ! "

This Wind Thing and the Top's Moving around is the thing I did not think of the other day and should have. I was just trying to give my Son some knowledge base to work from in the future. I see now that their is No Direct Answer to how much wind, is toomuch wind. It's about your own  work experience  and  training.  We all have bills to pay and complelled to work when the weather (winds) is bad and it would be better to lay up that day (safety wise). However, not at present but I remember the pressure on my Dad's back to go out in bad weather... because... we owe.. we owe and off to work we go.

I'm retired now and not as sharp at 62. My health ain't real great, so I really watch myself.  If I get hurt or worst, my 15 year old is on his own and my No# 1 concern. I want to teach my Son... all I can to keep him straight like my Father did with me.

Avery         

[DanG]

Av, not long ago you were jokingly chided for thinking like a helicopter pilot.  I can tell you, that training and habit will hold you in good stead.  Cutting trees is just like flying those God-awful flap-winged contraptions.  You gotta think about everything that could possibly happen and be ready for it.  Just use your air sense and you'll be fine. ;)

[ahlkey]

If the trees are waving at you it time to take notice and wave goodbye for the day.  The problem with most windy days is the unexpecting wind gusts.  If you follow the wind pattern on windy days it's something like a steady 20 mph wind but gusts of 30-35 mph.  It is those unexpecting wind gusts that can be real killers so use your common sense as has been already explained.  

[barbender]

The little job I just cut had a lot of obstacles- a power line, parking lot, outbuildings. There were a couple of days I didn't do any falling because the wind was gusting all over and I couldn't chance having one get away from me. There was one day that the wind was blowing fairly stiff, but steady and in the direction I needed the trees to go. I dropped trees all day, the wind was my friend that day

[northwoods1]

Av, not long ago you were jokingly chided for thinking like a helicopter pilot.  I can tell you, that training and habit will hold you in good stead.  Cutting trees is just like flying those God-awful flap-winged contraptions.  You gotta think about everything that could possibly happen and be ready for it.  Just use your air sense and you'll be fine. ;)

I think that is a good point and very true, anyone that can fly a helicopter definitely has what it takes to do any kind of dangerous activities which require careful consideration of all factors so as not to have a bad outcome
It is just like you said hawkpilot, you should be able to mentally perform all the tasks and determine the likely or possible outcomes and feel comfortable before proceeding with anything. Then it is just the the unlikely or freak things you haven't considered that will get you. What is it they say about old pilots? Theres old pilots & bold pilots but no old bold pilots, something like that? Same with logging... :D

[northwoods1]

the wind was my friend that day

another good point I think, sometimes the wind can be very helpful when hand falling. How many times have you had some wedges stuck in a tree and they were pounded pretty much all the way in and you had to stand there waiting for the wind to do the rest? Instead of walking back and getting more wedges :D

[H60 Hawk Pilot]

Barbender, Northwoods , Ahlkey, DanG and All

Good Word's of Advice and Wlll Work for Me.

I will share a Story about the  Wig Wum  I made from a Stand of Big Jack Pine.

We bought 40 acres of real nice (aver. tree 15 in. or so) Jack Pine for paperwood. I was cutting and got a couple trees hung up on each other, they grew fairly close together. I had cut enough pine (on the ground) to finish the truck load for that day. So.. I was cutting for the next day and No pressure to get these trees down. I started throwing another tree against another to put pressure on the hung up trees to push them down. However, I did not get enough pressure applied with each additional tree and this effort ended up with a big mess. I was tickled (smiling to myself),  I had formed part of a circle with the fallen Jack Pine.  I was well  on my way to having my own Wig Wum Frame to cover with hides for my Mountiain Lodge Retreat Tent (little joke  :D).  After I had about  20 to 30 trees hung up.... I had to go and finish my loading of the truck.  I could have hooked a winch cable onto a key tree  and they'd come crashing down. However, over night, Mr. Gravity and/ or Mr. Wind or both had all the trees down when I went back the next morning.

So the Moral of that Story is  " Patience "  and if it Ain't a Threat to Ya... Don't Worry About It.  It's a real mental game out there (Woods). We have so many factor's to consider and lot's of changing conditions and situations to consider. Sometimes we get some laugh's  :D (my Wig Wum) and fond memories to boot.

Have Great Day and Happy (memorable) Memories to Ya All.

Avery

[treefarmer87]

i dont cut @ all if its windy, it can spell disaster quick!!!!

[Autocar]

I'll have to agree with Jeff on this one  [ use your common sence ]

[Ron Scott]

Ditto!

[Ed_K]

we call them tee-pee's.I'm cutting hemlock for the next month or so.There will be a few on this job,oh-well thats what skidders are for ;D .