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450C dual arch grapple,

Started by BargeMonkey, February 19, 2014, 07:54:53 PM

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BargeMonkey

 Headed up to northern NH this weekend to check out a 450C dual arch grapple, seems like a decent skidder. All chained up, 24.5x32. Has anyone run one of these enough, ive never owned a grapple and I think im ready to jump. Any idea on fuel use ? Between the Timbco and slasher Im wondering if this will pick up the pace compared to my 440D  lol....

kiko

With a properly functioning 450c production should go way up. IMHO it is the best skidder ever made,  however transmission repair can get costly.

loggah

Pretty sure it will out perform your 440 !!!!!   ;D ;D is it a private sale?  i may know the owner!! If its at Oliver stores they are good guys, if its at Eddie Nash and son you  will realllly want to look it over well. They have a lot of machines and a lot of them are from down south ,look good but convertor could be bad ,and buying a skidder with a torque convertor issue is hard to tell in the winter. If i was to buy a used skidder with a torque convertor it would be on one of the hottest days of the summer. I believe the 450 c has a Clark transmission ,there generally pretty good. I know a lot of guys that used to run them and the machines are only as good as their maintenance progrem. I know of one outfit from up north that bought them brand new and 3 years later they were a roving junkpile !!!!. Don
Interests: Lombard Log Haulers,Tucker Sno-Cats, Circular Sawmills, Shingle Mills, Maple Syrup Making, Early Construction Equipment, Logging Memorabilia, and Antique Firearms

Bobus2003

Ran one for a couple years on and off (When i wasnt Running Boom) It was a good pulling machine(Believe it was a '94 model), as long as the grapple held the wood it would pull it, sometimes riding a wheelie for a few moments, but it would pull it. As for production you'll be gaining alot. Ours was pulling 10-15 loads a day feeding a Boom Delimber, and we never pushed it too hard.

This was the Girl:




nhlogga

Quote from: BargeMonkey on February 19, 2014, 07:54:53 PM
Headed up to northern NH this weekend to check out a 450C dual arch grapple, seems like a decent skidder. All chained up, 24.5x32. Has anyone run one of these enough, ive never owned a grapple and I think im ready to jump. Any idea on fuel use ? Between the Timbco and slasher Im wondering if this will pick up the pace compared to my 440D  lol....

If it's the one on Craigslist it looks like a good machine. Cummins engine, Clark transmission, possibly a Deere winch. Friend of mine had one and had no trouble with it. It will definately increase your production.
Jonsered 2260
Husky 562xp

BargeMonkey

Yeah I was looking for a powerplant the other night and found it, looks pretty clean with new rubber and chain on back, and 70% front. Has just over 8k hours, motor was done 300 hours ago. Im hoping it will pick up my production, if I get 1-2 load a day cutting behind my 440D im doing good. Any tips to check that torque converter in the cold ?

Southside

HP and weight wise it is almost identical to my Franklin with a single arch.  Sounds like it has nicer features, but strictly from a pulling standpoint there will be no comparison to your 440.  I went from a 540A to my 170 - can't compare the production at all, fill the grapple with everything it will hold and drive away like its not even there.  As for fuel consumption - they do drink more than the old JD, but you are doing a lot more work at pretty much 3X the HP.  Yes my fuel bill went up, but my production increased in greater proportion. 
Franklin buncher and skidder
JD Processor
Woodmizer LT Super 70 and LT35 sawmill, KD250 kiln, BMS 250 sharpener and setter
Riehl Edger
Woodmaster 725 and 4000 planner and moulder
Enough cows to ensure there is no spare time.
White Oak Meadows

240b

I went to look at that machine. be prepared....

loggah

It looks good in the pictures, decent tires tight chains has blade extensions. all i can say is run it and try to get the convertor to heat.once its warmed run it in third or fourth gear. If i knew who has the machine i could ask a few guys in the jefferson, lancaster area ,the other jobbers usually know whats going on with the other loggers machines!! ;D
Interests: Lombard Log Haulers,Tucker Sno-Cats, Circular Sawmills, Shingle Mills, Maple Syrup Making, Early Construction Equipment, Logging Memorabilia, and Antique Firearms

BargeMonkey

The guys name is Anthony, in jefferson. Its a 6 hour drive from here, I hope to not be disappointed to bad.

240b

thats the one it was a foster bros machine from littleton.

loggah

If it was one of Foster brothers machines look it over real well !!!!  they been out of business for a while so the machine probably has been totally rebuilt by now!!!!! I was in the timberland machines shop years ago the timberjack dealer talking to their service manager Jim Kennison and he says check this out, Foster brothers machine a little over a year old ,front cradle pins worn thru so bad the cradle had hammered a hole in the oil pan!!! not to mention the frame cracked by the winch. Those guys were highball and they were the ones that ruin a new machine in less then 3 years . Like i said i probably has been completely rebuilt if it was one of theirs.
Interests: Lombard Log Haulers,Tucker Sno-Cats, Circular Sawmills, Shingle Mills, Maple Syrup Making, Early Construction Equipment, Logging Memorabilia, and Antique Firearms

240b

it hasnt been rebuilt.  run hard and put away wet,  comes to mind..  jim did alot of work on my skidders when they were open. seems like i was in lancaster alot getting parts in those days...  loggah, i bought a 380b that came from you area  was a great skidder, cant remember the guys name. he had two of them was getting a new grapple  this was in '02-03..

loggah

Hmm, i cant think of anyone right close by that had 2 380's  ,  maybe it will come to me!!! ;D  timberland had quite a crew at one time,to bad they closed their doors, they moved a bunch of skidders all over New England.
Interests: Lombard Log Haulers,Tucker Sno-Cats, Circular Sawmills, Shingle Mills, Maple Syrup Making, Early Construction Equipment, Logging Memorabilia, and Antique Firearms

nhlogga

Quote from: loggah on February 22, 2014, 01:16:23 PM
Hmm, i cant think of anyone right close by that had 2 380's  ,  maybe it will come to me!!! ;D  timberland had quite a crew at one time,to bad they closed their doors, they moved a bunch of skidders all over New England.

Did Timberleand Machinery become Chadwick BaRoss?
Jonsered 2260
Husky 562xp

240b


nhlogga

Quote from: 240b on February 22, 2014, 03:57:48 PM
yes

My grandfather bought a couple new 'Jacks from them in the late '70s and early '80s and a Clark Ranger too in the mid '80s. I think they all came from Concord branch.
Jonsered 2260
Husky 562xp

BargeMonkey

 The machine needs to have little stuff done to it, I couldnt find anything really wrong enough to say no. Steering pins have some slop, centers are pretty tight. The machine has set around for a while, mice had done a number in the cab. I looked it over but im not an expert. Hopefully it doesnt bite me in the ass to bad. Thank god for a fidelity account, and a local guy up there should do the trucking fairly cheap.

BargeMonkey

 Its gotten a new engine about 300 hours ago. Plunger pump leaks a little. Needs a kill cable and switch. Ive seen worse for more money. Arch pins wherent to bad, winch worked. Axle plugs where froze, only thing that scared me. I think a few days in the shop it will clean up.

loggah

Did you pick the front up with the blade and see how much slop was in the cradle pins? usually you can tell right off after the wheels leave the ground.
Interests: Lombard Log Haulers,Tucker Sno-Cats, Circular Sawmills, Shingle Mills, Maple Syrup Making, Early Construction Equipment, Logging Memorabilia, and Antique Firearms

240b

the day i ran it the disc brake dragged and heated up really well..  also the tranny psi was low but didnt spike when shifting gears, the other concern i had was the engine oil psi never got over 40 which seemed low for a 300 hr motor..its got nice tires and chains.. good luck with the new machine.   did the guy fix the starter key switch or was it still a screw driver? that cracked me up..

IMOWOOD

it also says its a 96 in the add they quit making 450's in 95

CCC4

Quote from: BargeMonkey on February 19, 2014, 07:54:53 PM
Headed up to northern NH this weekend to check out a 450C dual arch grapple, seems like a decent skidder. All chained up, 24.5x32. Has anyone run one of these enough, ive never owned a grapple and I think im ready to jump. Any idea on fuel use ? Between the Timbco and slasher Im wondering if this will pick up the pace compared to my 440D  lol....

BargeMonkey, my boss just got a dual arched 450c here recently. he is putting a new long block in it and I will be able to try it out in the woods pretty soon! The dual arch is a pretty neat setup from what I can tell, we have a lot of ledges in steep rough ground and the dual arch is supposed to be able to reach down under the bluffs and grab logs. Also it will reach and grab hitches further behind you than a regular grapple.

As far as the production rate difference between a 440 and a 450C grapple skidder....people might get pissy about my answer due to the large volume of people on here that run little skidders...but I'm a glutten for punishment. I will say this...if I had to choose between a 440 and a good draft horse....I'd take the horse ALL DAY! The 440 are excellent in small tight timber such as Eastern Red Cedar or pine poles or something, but for production rates..they are just too small for my liking and almost "toy" like compared to a 450C. I know, I know....that is harsh, but in my opinion it's the truth.

I should have the dual arch on my set this week maybe and I will kick the OP off of it and run out through the woods and try it out maybe even shoot a video while I'm steeling the OP's rig! LMAO!

I would take into consideration what was mentioned about checking out the machine very well! Man you should have contacted my boss about a skidder, nothing leaves here not in good running fashion. I am going to link a video of a 450C wearing 30.5s, I have posted the vid before but I believe this skidder is for sale. *DanG good skidder, daily runner, new motor, entirely new cradle etc. The cradle was just put in last week. The motor is less than a month old, built from the ground up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_MzfYkAg5k&list=UU_NjqCPS3PCA_PGz4NCZuLA&feature=c4-overview


1270d

looks like you have the slick clay mud.   yuck.  not that any mud is nice.   you walk across the landing and get 3 inches taller with mud on the boots?

BargeMonkey

I couldnt see alot of slop in the front cradle. Some wear in steering and arch pins. Drive line seemed tight.  I think the caliper is dragging on the driveline brake. The problem I was up against was I WILL NOT have a skidder with 30.5 tires, 24.5 is almost to big. I cut alot of small woodlots and the homeowners stare now at how wide stuff is. Im going to get her home and send my mechanic thru it. I saw about 1k worth of repairs it needed, counting a complete service. Ive hunted high and low for a dual arch not all beat to hell with 24.5 tires and I hope this one works. Getting off the tugboats for a while to get wood cut ahead, my stuff sits minimum 2 weeks a month, time to get it done.

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