help IDing plants?

blame · April 15, 2009, 02:44:30 AM

is this Russian olive or autumn olive

and this one i've never seen this type of growth on a tree can anyone id it by the bud or bark in the pic(like we can see it ??? ??? ???)

Thanks Blame

WDH · April 15, 2009, 10:51:37 PM

It looks like Elaeagnus umbellata , autumn olive, but I am no expert on the exotics.

Dodgy Loner · April 16, 2009, 08:35:42 AM

I would go with autumn olive for the top one, too. No clue on the bottom one. Maybe you can take another picture when it gets some leaves on it ???

blame · April 16, 2009, 10:39:07 PM

well i cut a bunch of the olive today it was all Russian >:( was hoping it was the Autumn Olive alot better color in it

the other one i have no clue where to even start looking for what it is

but thanks for the replies guys

Dodgy Loner · April 17, 2009, 08:46:55 AM

Cutting it for what? I've never seen an autumn-olive that was big enough to make anything other than pen blanks.

blame · April 17, 2009, 11:13:41 PM

couple years ago i had some that was 4" in dia. i cut on a small band saw every thing was cut 3/4" x 3" wide 36"L, also cut out pen and bottle stopper blanks(of what was kept rest went into the stove) i traded it to a guy for a 6" mastercraft jointer. i still think he got the better end of the deal. some warped really bad while air drying

i took the cuttings from some plants that my dad had planted in the mid 80's i think he planted them when i was 5 or 6 years old

some of this russian olive on my sisters place is 5" to 6" in dia but only for very short lengths 10" to 15" long or so. i was just hoping i'd like to find some more

SwampDonkey · April 19, 2009, 05:52:01 AM

Seems like a lot of dead twigs on the other plant. Is it native? Does it flower?

blame · April 19, 2009, 12:23:57 PM

Quote from: SwampDonkey on April 19, 2009, 05:52:01 AM
Seems like a lot of dead twigs on the other plant. Is it native? Does it flower?

we didnt plant it its out on the back end of the property. as far as flowing goes all i seen where a few leaf buds on it it reminds me of a small hickory not all of the shoot are dead but even the live ones dont have buds or leaves on them

SwampDonkey · April 19, 2009, 02:23:49 PM

Is it a Paulownia? Got any pictures of live branch tips? Your showing part of a tree or shrub that could fit umteen species by bark alone. ;)

WDH · April 19, 2009, 06:52:46 PM

I thought from the start that it was a hickory by the bark striations and the large leaf scars. All those weird branches put me off. Almost looks like dead pieces of a vine, but I cannot tell from the pic.

blame · April 19, 2009, 07:12:53 PM

i'm not sure next time i'm up there i'll go take some more pictures of it and post them

thanks for the replies guys

SwampDonkey · April 19, 2009, 08:37:22 PM

What it looks to me is something out of place and not frost hardy enough for your area.

blame · April 28, 2009, 02:20:51 AM

ok i finally got back up there. i think it is a shagbark hickory all those weird looking branches that threw all of us off i think are old stems from last years leaves. i compared the buds from the deformed one to a few others that are on the place but with out those stems and they matched to a T. i just find it strange that the leaves where growing from the main trunk like that any thoughts on what could cause that?

blame

SwampDonkey · April 28, 2009, 05:30:49 AM

I've never seen the petiole and rachis be retained like that before. Is it a habit of shagbark saplings? Any bud pictures of the plant to compare? Almost behaving like retained stipules, but not really a stipule.

WDH · April 28, 2009, 08:33:03 AM

Most hardwoods have buds in the bark that sprout when there is disturbance that lets sunlight hit the bole. Is this little tree growing out in the open?

blame · April 28, 2009, 09:13:45 AM

Quote from: SwampDonkey on April 28, 2009, 05:30:49 AM
I've never seen the petiole and rachis be retained like that before. Is it a habit of shagbark saplings? Any bud pictures of the plant to compare? Almost behaving like retained stipules, but not really a stipule.

nope this is the only one i've ever seen like this. i'll try to post some pics tonight when i get back

Quote from: WDH on April 28, 2009, 08:33:03 AM
Most hardwoods have buds in the bark that sprout when there is disturbance that lets sunlight hit the bole. Is this little tree growing out in the open?

its growing right on the edge. south face is completely open

woodtroll · April 28, 2009, 10:12:19 AM

Definitely hickory. I have seen a lot of little ones do that. Drop the leaves off but keep the stem of the leaf. I can't remember if it is a dry thing.
As far as olive it shouldn't matter... tordon kills both.

SwampDonkey · April 28, 2009, 11:09:58 AM

Ah, so might be it for sure. Odd. ;)

blame · April 28, 2009, 10:49:27 PM

heres another pic just so people can find it later

heres another one i found today while looking for buds to compare to it also has the leaf stems still attached

and heres another unknown tree i found today - not sure what it is tear drop shaped leaves with thorns almost reminds me of an apple leaf

any ideas on this one?

thanks woodtroll for the confirmation i've seen alot of hickory's but never have seen them carry there leaf stems over the winter like that

SwampDonkey · April 29, 2009, 05:14:23 AM

Hawthorn, by the shape of the leaf. Is it saw toothed on the margin of the leaf? If there are buds on the thorns it could be crab apple or plum. But the leaf says hawthorn.

blame · April 29, 2009, 08:39:51 AM

Quote from: SwampDonkey on April 29, 2009, 05:14:23 AM
Hawthorn, by the shape of the leaf. Is it saw toothed on the margin of the leaf? If there are buds on the thorns it could be crab apple or plum. But the leaf says hawthorn.

yup the the margin is saw toothed. thanks for your help SwampDonkey

WDH · April 29, 2009, 10:16:42 PM

Looks crab applish to me

.

SwampDonkey · April 30, 2009, 04:02:37 AM

Some native crab apple can have similar leaves to hawthorn, but I have not seen crab apple with that leave form pictured. Usually crab have a pair of lobes on the leaf base and scaly bark that curls on older trees. Hawthorn has bark with thin narrow shreds on older shrubs. Hawthorn leaves are more variable between the species. I couldn't begin to separate all the different hawthorn species. ;D