Building Codes and Home-Sawn Lumber?

SineWave · October 28, 2015, 05:03:50 PM

Quote from: Jeff on October 28, 2015, 12:37:42 PM...I may have to sell my land in the U.P. and give up my dream of building a cabin using my own mill and materials because of building codes, but I'm not making political posts here in this topic about it ON MY OWN FORUM.

Gosh, I'm sorry to hear that, Jeff. That stinks!

Thanks again, everyone, for all the helpful replies.

-Jeff

trapper · October 28, 2015, 11:22:47 PM

Jeff does Michigan have something like the wis local use lumber code where you can get certified to saw and grade lumber for your own use? It was free to take here.

Ox · October 29, 2015, 03:03:02 AM

Jeff - just a few words: That sucks with a capital S. This goes for all the men who want to do (build) something on their own and are prevented from doing so. It's just not right in the primal sense of well being. >:(

SineWave · October 29, 2015, 05:09:08 AM

Quote from: NNKFarm on October 27, 2015, 03:00:48 PMI work in Virginia in local government and converse with our building official daily. Being a Dillon Rule state, every county in Virginia must follow state law and codes, so they will all be similar. The building official said that the lumber milled on site shall be graded and stamped, by IBC. There are graders around who will do this for a fee and I have heard that it is not an insurmountable obstacle. Have your best lumber you will use dried and ready to inspect... He followed up the conversation by saying that "a home built with milled lumber and the proper trees will be far and away stronger and all around better than anything built with that &%$# that passes for lumber I have to look at all day!" Have fun!

We have a local wood truss manufacturer nearby ... I wonder whether I could hire an engineer from their plant to sign off on the lumber I cut and want to use for framing.

Certainly that engineer would know the math end of it for calculating live load and dead load for custom trusses, the size and quality of the chords and kingpins needed for trusses taking a particular load, etc., and I would think the engineer also would be qualified to say "GO" or "NO GO" on the materials I want to use for framing as well.

Anyone have any thoughts on that? Thanks again.

Jeff

Magicman · October 29, 2015, 07:44:20 AM

Graded/stamped framing lumber should not be a deal killer and it should always acceptable for unoccupied buildings.

I am content to know where it is acceptable and where not in my area. If framing lumber certification is required then saw paneling, flooring, ceilings, and other lumber for finish work. That way the customer still has the satisfaction of using his logs for his home.

beenthere · October 29, 2015, 10:02:43 AM

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QuoteWe have a local wood truss manufacturer nearby ... I wonder whether I could hire an engineer from their plant to sign off on the lumber I cut and want to use for framing.

Certainly that engineer would know the math end of it for calculating live load and dead load for custom trusses, the size and quality of the chords and kingpins needed for trusses taking a particular load, etc., and I would think the engineer also would be qualified to say "GO" or "NO GO" on the materials I want to use for framing as well.

Anyone have any thoughts on that? Thanks again.

Jeff

My thought is that this engineer is using the NDS (National Design Specifications) tables and such for each stamped grade by lumber size to design his/her trusses. Likely doesn't have much of a good sense of lumber quality (any more than you do ;) ).
Also, a variety of machines and techniques are used to machine stress rate lumber that gets a stamp, and there is only very little human over-ride. But there are still human structural lumber graders at work.

snowshoveler · October 29, 2015, 11:49:11 AM

I wonder if they actually look for a grade stamp or just look to see if its been planed and is the right species if wood and the right size.
Our grade stamp local is "SPF" which I would think is spruce, pine or fir.
They all grow well here although most folks now prefer spruce.
I have doubts if most would know the diference if I showed them a 2x6 of each.
Rgards Chris

hackberry jake · October 29, 2015, 10:32:53 PM

Wasn't there some talk a while back about some jurisdictions having language like "structural lumber must be grade stamped" and some people on the forum even had their own semi-professional stamp made?

beenthere · October 29, 2015, 11:06:17 PM

Arky did that.. so he said.

Magicman · October 30, 2015, 08:27:51 AM

I would never take a chance with a customer's lumber with a "suspect" stamp. A building inspector could get a burr under his saddle and deem the building unsafe and order it to be torn down. We may not like or agree with building codes, but we must surely abide by them.

Thankfully I saw in an area where there are very few restrictions. First, the blueprint specifies #2 and/or rough sawn lumber. Next, the building inspector, building contractor, lending institution, and insurer signs off on it. Most of the counties do not have an inspector so that part is out.

SineWave · October 30, 2015, 10:02:50 AM

Thanks, fellas. Maybe it's time to move to Mississippi. >:(

dean herring · October 31, 2015, 11:24:28 AM

If you were to cut some 6x8 logs,or cants, dried them and built a cabin would it be ok.
I'm asking yalls opnoin because our son is looking into it to see if his insurance co. is good with it and if it is legal here.

beenthere · October 31, 2015, 11:52:46 AM

dean
Would be up to what your local building code states... if you have to follow one.

Not sure what the insurance company would care about it.

dean herring · October 31, 2015, 12:45:53 PM

Thanks beenthere ,we have lived in a log house for 20 yrs. but our logs came from Satterwhite log homes. We love it and had no problems but they were really dry when we stacked them. We have access to plenty of pine logs, what is you take on using them?

beenthere · October 31, 2015, 02:57:43 PM

Not sure what species the logs were from Satterwhite, and not sure what species of pine logs you have access to... but I have no problem with you using them.

Peter Drouin · October 31, 2015, 04:06:54 PM

Jeff, I thought the trouble was you wanted to stand the logs up side by side to make a wall and the building inspector did not like that. Dose he have a problem with you cutting them into framing 2bys or beams too?
Like a timber frame.

Jeff · October 31, 2015, 04:34:32 PM

Yes. No green rough sawn lumber may be used for any structural use. This destroys my ability to create even the floor deck system to use logs in any fashion. I'm free to make siding paneling or flooring or sheeting and that would be about it.

Kingmt · October 31, 2015, 07:27:43 PM

Quote from: Jeff on October 31, 2015, 04:34:32 PM
Yes. No green rough sawn lumber may be used for any structural use. This destroys my ability to create even the floor deck system to use logs in any fashion. I'm free to make siding paneling or flooring or sheeting and that would be about it.

What if it is a shed? Log sheds make a good place to put a bed.

Jeff · October 31, 2015, 09:14:39 PM

This inspector already has me on his radar.

Peter Drouin · October 31, 2015, 09:23:22 PM

Quote from: Jeff on October 31, 2015, 09:14:39 PM
This inspector already has me on his radar.

To bad your state don't have a native lumber law like NH. Then you could get your license and tell the man He is not needed.

Jeff · October 31, 2015, 09:26:41 PM

We dont.

SineWave · November 11, 2015, 09:07:38 AM

Quote from: NNKFarm on October 27, 2015, 03:00:48 PMThe building official said that the lumber milled on site shall be graded and stamped, by IBC. There are graders around who will do this for a fee ...

Does anyone know how to locate and contact one of these "grader" people?

Is there some organization that trains or sanctions or licenses the people who do this?

Thanks again.

beenthere · November 11, 2015, 11:07:46 AM

You might try this agency

http://www.nelma.org/inspection-programs/lumber-and-timbers/

It is one of the several agencies involved in lumber grading.

And they do have training as well.
http://graderacademy.org/

SineWave · November 11, 2015, 05:51:03 PM

Thank you, BeenThere, just what I needed:

http://www.nelma.org/inspection-programs/on-demand-lumber-grading-program/

redprospector · November 11, 2015, 10:10:13 PM

Wow! I was told that originally building inspections and contractors licenses were instituted to protect homeowners/land owners from shoddy contractors, and unscrupulous methods. Like most well intended government oversight, this has become a huge expense, and pain in the butt for anyone wanting to build from their own lumber, or sell lumber to someone else.
Don't these people realize that all lumber was at one time "sawmill" lumber?