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Buying a mill. Looking at brands.

Started by labradorguy, December 08, 2014, 12:29:36 PM

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labradorguy

Hi all. I'm looking at purchasing a mill and am getting ready to visit several factories (and hopefully some owners) prior to making my decision. I'm currently in the process of coming up with a short list. I'd really like to get some thoughts, ideas, observations, and/or opinions from people who have no dog in the hunt. It's not that salespeople are not forthcoming with issues, but.....

I searched some older threads, but the way things are constantly changing and evolving, I thought I might just start a new one.

I'm looking at the:
Baker 3665D
Timberking 2400
Cook AC-36
Wood-Mizer LT70

I have to say that I don't like the way Timberking seems to bash everyone else, but I do like their hydraulics. I am hearing that there are issues with the Wood-Mizer being overly complicated and their parts are specialized. I don't know how true that is. I prefer hydraulics over electronics when that is an option. Cook is six months out on delivery. To me that says something. I like the Baker weighing 7800lb. It sounds like they build them heavy. There is a lot to consider here.

If anyone has anything to add, I would sincerely appreciate it.

Thank you for reading.

drobertson

All good and proven mills, with the exception of the ones that seem to need work before getting on line, (all have had issues)  My only gripe with what I've heard from every one that has bought all the ones you've listed, is this, if you are not in for the long haul and issues arise that will stretch the initial investment, which often times is under a guarantee,  and you are one of the smaller players, then at times it seems that you could be put on another shelf, it takes a maintenance man, if you will to go into the biz,  please don't take this the wrong way, but on this forum, anything mentioned that has a negative context will be approached as a bash if the mill manufacturer is a sponsor.  So which ever mill you decide on, it is my humble opinion that if any issues arise, take it up with the tech reps and leave it off the forum until the issue is rectified, then share the good news of the success with those in the same shoes. 
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

buzzegray


Dave Shepard

I don't consider my Wood-Mizer to be overly complicated. If you want advanced features like setworks, then that means computers. Any computer system is more complicated than simply looking at a scaleboard. On the high production mills you are looking at, you can't take the time to fuss with trying to hit the mark on the scaleboard, you have to let the mill make the sets. Again, as to specialized parts, any mill that uses a computer system will have their own parts. No matter what brand you buy, having certain wear items that are not readily available at the parts store in stock is a good idea. You can buy B57 bandwheel belts for the LT30/40/50 at the parts store, but they are not the specific GoodYear belt that is made just for WM. They are cheap, I keep a couple of pairs in the tool box. Sawmills are like trucks. You can buy some of the parts at NAPA, like bearings or a fan belt, and sometime you have to go to the dealer, like for circuit board or the side view mirror you snapped off on that tree plowing snow. :D

From what I've read here on the Forum, any of the mills you are looking at are rugged, serious, high production mills. My personal experience with Wood-Mizer has been top notch.

drobertson, I don't think it is a problem to talk about mills on the Forum, but if someone is trying to push a load of bull, then people aren't going to stand for it. 4x4American's trouble with his TimberKing should be proof of that. There were several Orange guys on those threads, myself included, that pushed him to stick it out and not trade in for a Wood-Mizer when he was frustrated. He has got his mill running, and it looks like TimberKing is working on an improved guide arm to help with some of the trouble he is having.

labradorguy, good luck in your search. I would try to find the mills you are looking at and see them run and talk to the owners to get their opinions. If anyone, whether it be a sawmill owner, or a manufacturer, tells you the WM cantileaver head is a bad design, then I call BULL! And so will every other WM owner out there. ;) There are plenty of comparison points between the mills, but that isn't one of them, in fact, I consider it a huge advantage. ;) ;)
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

POSTON WIDEHEAD

I have never ran any of the mills on your list.
But I do run a Woodmizer LT40HD29G with the simple set.
Complicated? My 12 year old son can run it and I let him....it is literally a piece of cake.

I have to be honest and say I don't really understand what the adjective "specialized" means when referring to WM parts.
I've had parts I've had to replace from basically sawing everyday. I just pic up the phone, give them my ID number and the part I need and the new part is on its way.  :)

Now all this pertains to me. Buy the mill that suits your needs. I bought the WM because my neighbor had one for 23 years and I was his off bearer on and off. The operation of his mill is what sold me and suited me.
I can promise you 1 thing......if this is your first mill.......you're gonna have a ball!  8)
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Robert Owens

My advice is to take your time and go visit each mill you are interested in. I took over a year looking at mills and talking to the companies and owners before ordering mine. In the end I bought a Cooks and there was a wait time of about five months. Well worth the wait. I have cut about 6000 bd. Ft. Of pine and oak over the last seven months and have enjoyed every minute. Now it's time to start building my shop and sawmill shed. Good luck!

pine

I almost bought the Cooks AC-36 but due to one issue I did not.
Buyers remorse: I really wish I had bought the Cooks instead. 
Waiting a couple of months for your new mill is well worth the time unless you have a deadline that you have to get started by. 
Cooks makes a great mill.  Sharpener and setter as well.

If you have not listened to the Cook's DVD on the AC-36 in it entirety do so.  Even if you buy another mill you will learn a lot from him.

GAB

labradorguy:
If you have the time you should try and be the off bearer for each of the mills you are considering.  Bed height and design could affect productivity for some people.
You can learn a lot just removing lumber from a mill.
I personally have no experience with the mills on your list.
Wishing you the best in your search. 
Gerald
W-M LT40HDD34, SLR, JD 420, JD 950w/loader and Woods backhoe, V3507 Fransguard winch, Cordwood Saw, 18' flat bed trailer, and other toys.

thecfarm

labradorguy,welcome to the forum. I bet I looked for 20 years before I bought mine. Mine is nothing like what you are looking at. I just wanted one to play with.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

Magicman

Quote from: labradorguy on December 08, 2014, 12:29:36 PMI'm looking at purchasing a mill and am getting ready to visit several factories (and hopefully some owners) prior to making my decision. 
That is a very good strategy.  I am Orange and I have no experience with any of the sawmill on your list, but I would not discount any until I did my homework.

Oh and Welcome to the Forestry Forum, labradorguy.   8)
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

dgdrls

Welcome to the FF Labradorguy,

Lots of great wisdom here.  I noticed you listed some big machines.
Whats your plan for sawing?   Depending on where your heading product wise
you may want to consider a circle style mill.

Best
DGDrls

woodmills1

I will repeat forever that woodmizer has treated me like their best customer even though I have never bought a mill from them.  Two different used mills (LT40  LT70) and the help and assistance has been first rate, timley and correct.  I do buy WM blades and most parts.
James Mills,Lovely wife,collect old tools,vacuuming fool,36 bdft/hr,oak paper cutter,ebonic yooper rapper nauga seller, Blue Ox? its not fast, 2 cat family, LT70,edger, 375 bd ft/hr, we like Bob,free heat,no oil 12 years,big splitter, baked stuffed lobster, still cuttin the logs dere IAM

Banjo picker

If you would fill in your location, you might get some invites to see and possibly run some of those mills.  Welcome to the FF....Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

labradorguy

Thanks for all the info guys. I sincerely appreciate it.

To answer a few questions.... I have nothing now. I had a mill that ran off of a PTO. No, I did not like it. It was great 1920's tech. Time to upgrade. lol.

I have an odd work schedule and I want to fill in some idle time. It's just not in me to sit around and keep up the the Kardashians. I have a few hundred acres of timber and access to more. Mainly white oak, red oak, and cedar. I've been selectively logging some of the oak and cedar and taking it to local mills, but to be honest, I am tired of the scaling game. I've found buyers for sawmill posts/boards and I'm looking at cutting out the mills. I'm still working out some numbers and some kinks, but a plan is coming together.

Regarding my questions and comments that were made to me from marketing guys.... Yeah, there were a lot of negative comments about W-M cantilevers. I was told that uptime was lowest with the W-M too. I heard that Cook made the toughest saw, and that Timberking claimed a lot of "advantages" that were actually pretty much shared across the industry. They claim the heaviest, toughest saw but from what I have looked at on paper, it looks like Baker has them beat. IDK. I'm just wading into it and trying to formulate a plan. A lot of that is marketing BS, and I understand that. I have to say though that I don't really care all that much for their electric feed system, but again, that is just a general first impression.

I was an engineer for Cat and you know, every other equipment company makes their comparisons to Caterpillar. That says something about the company and their products and I'm thinking that the same thing applies to Wood-Mizer....

Again, Timberking and their bashing bugs me. I'm considering taking them off of the list but I don't want to do that if their mills truly are the bee's knees... :)

Thanks for the welcome guys and for the info.




Tree Dan

Welcome to the fourm Labradorguy...You sure have your work cut out for you.
They all look good to me...best of luck on your adventure.
Wood Mizer LT40HD, Kubota KX71, New Holland LS150, Case TR270
6400 John Deere/with loader,General 20" planer, Stihl 880, Stihl 361, Dolmar 460, Husqvarna 50  and a few shovels,
60" and 30" Log Rite cant hooks, 2 home built Tree Spades, Homemade log splitter

Magicman

My take is that the only folks making negative comments about WM Cantilever design are those have no experience with one.  That design is actually a very good feature and allows you to many times saw irregular logs that are beyond the advertised 36" (for my LT40).  That is absolutely not possible with a post machine.

Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

uler3161

I think if you're just filling "idle time", you probably don't need quite as fancy of a mill as any of those listed. Those mills are more of a 2-3 person production mill that you probably should be running full time.

Negative comments about the cantilever design really bug me. They are very much a proven design. When properly aligned, all mills cut good lumber. When out of alignment, they will cut junk. We've had LT40s for nearly 25 years, so I trust the design completely and there's a ton of WM owners who will agree. I think if you see one in action you'll agree too.

I'm not sure if I can give an opinion either way on the electric feed system. We've had a few issues over the years (mostly the feed control box), but it's not been enough to be a serious problem. I'd prefer to have a beefier feed motor, but it gets the job done and we've never had to replace or repair one. I'm sure newer mills (especially the LT70) have a better motor.

I haven't seen them up close, but I think you're right about the Baker being toughest. If WM weren't in the game, I'd be bleeding blue instead of orange.
1989 LT40HD, WoodMaster 718

Dan

POSTON WIDEHEAD

In the South East, equipment buyers and owners do not compare their equipment to Caterpillar.
Even Caterpillar owners compare their equipment to JOHN DEERE.  :)
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Banjo picker

Looks like you are too far away, but if you get over to ne miss you can have a go on the AC 36.   :)  Banjo
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

customsawyer

First welcome to the forum. I can tell you with my experience with WM LT70s you will need good help and a edger to be able to keep up with it.
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

Peter Drouin

If you get a LT70 get the wide head. :D :D :D :D
And welcome.

A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

bandmiller2

Labradorguy, you really can't go wrong with any mills you listed. I only have experiance with the LT-70 and my own homemade bandmill. The guys have pretty much covered it but I have a couple of opinions. I operated an WM LT-70 for two years part time and I was impressed with their engineering. The electronics and computer on any mill are a two edged sword, increased production, ease of operation but complicated and expensive to repair. If the mill will be kept out of the weather and used frequently you will have minimal problems with the electronics. For intermittent use and stored outdoors I would go for hydraulic controls and simplicity. You said you had a PTO driven mill would that have been a Bellsaw.?? Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

ozarkgem

I don't own any of the brands you mentioned (mine is a Mighty Might) but I have looked at a lot of mills and my opinion is WM is the best engineered mill. I have no experience with customer service with any of the mills so no comment on that. If I buy another mill it will be a WM. Not that any of them are bad I just think WM goes the extra mile in engineering time. This advice is worth exactly what you are being charged for it. 
Mighty Mite Band Mill, Case Backhoe, 763 Bobcat, Ford 3400 w/FEL , 1962 Ford 4000, Int dump truck, Clark forklift, lots of trailers. Stihl 046 Magnum, 029 Stihl. complete machine shop to keep everything going.

Dave Shepard

After watching customsawyer's LT70 dragging back 40' slabs and boards, I wasn't to worried about the electric feed.  :D

As Magicman said, it's the people who haven't run a WM complain about the cantilever head, not the people who have sawn a hundred thousand, half a million, or maybe even a few million feet using one.

Talk to mill owners about their machine, not some other machine that they don't own. Find out what each owner likes about their machine. Ignore anyone trying to sell you something.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

highleadtimber16

I've got a Woodmizer LT 40 Hydraulic and love it. The only issue I've had with it, is the rain doing it's thing on small electric parts. A roof solves that problem. Or just not living where it rains 7 days a week in the winter!  ;) My grandfather has a circular saw and a 4 post Woodcraft mill. Woodcraft is made here in BC, and are solid mills. I much prefer the cantilever design though. Some big things I noticed are, it makes blade changing easier, and the carriage moves much smoother. An LT 70 is a lot of mill, but there's a few guys around here using them as one man shows. If you're not cutting everyday the LT 40 Super or LT 50 might suit you better. Unfortunately, I don't have any experience with other brands, but there's lots to choose from! Good luck!
2011 Wood-Mizer LT 40 hyd w/ 12' Extension,
EG 200 Wood-Mizer
Cutting Old Growth Cedar from Queen Charlotte Islands.

labradorguy

"In the South East, equipment buyers and owners do not compare their equipment to Caterpillar.
Even Caterpillar owners compare their equipment to JOHN DEERE."

I'm going to like this forum. There are some really funny guys on here...  ;D

It's filling time for me, but it's a mill that will get run daily. I didn't mention that I have a deadbeat brother to support and he has four kids that I need to make sure and get fed every day.... I've got an open-ended 70x100 pole barn I am planning on setting it up under for most of the year. That should help the electronics out. Wiring doesn't like the elements no matter who makes it.

As far as that cantilever head, I had figured it was something along those lines. They simply can't continue to sell that many mills if the design is as bad as some of their competition says. W-M is going to a hydraulic feed on the LT70.

Question: Are there any mill companies I have overlooked that should be considered? I was thinking I had reviewed the major players.

backwoods sawyer

The four post verses cantalever debate in the portable mills is like the over head carrage verses the old circle saw style carrage among the production mills (I prefer the over head carriage for speed of transfer ;D)

My first choice was and is the LT-70, I drove clean across the country to buy it, the Cooks AC-36 came along later as a good buy.

The cooks mill is a very solid machine, WM is more portable, Cooks the guide arm is a bit over kill but the guide motor on the WM is a bit light duty. Cooks uses a lot of long hydraulic hoses they are not cheep, WM uses a plastic hydraulic hose, I changed all them over to standard braded hoses after a fire in the hydralic box, (over zelist customer welding on mill after hours :-\)

Baker done a demo at the local logging conference and is considerably more mill then the Cooks and the Cooks is a very capable mill.

I found the big advantages to the WM is log handling abilities, its portability and its ability to saw over sized logs, Cooks states 36" and mean it, WM states 36" and with the single post you can fudge it a bit to about a 42" log.

Take a look at the LT-50 it uses the same chain turner as the LT-70, the curve design handles the logs better then the straight design of the Cooks.

With the WM I do all the edging on the mill, the Cooks clamps from the oposite side and edging is much easier with the edger. The advantage to clamping this way is the log rotates the oposite direction presenting the saw with a sawn face after making the opening cut. The WM debarker clears a narrow path for the saw
to cut in. Cooks uses a deisle drip with larger steel wheel, a good comination, I added a deisle drip to the WM.
Maintenace cost on the WM are higher than on the Cooks but down time is far less, Cooks can take a couple weeks or you can find parts on the open market but tracking down parts takes time, WM is next day in most cases, if ordering out of indy in a winter storm it can take week.

Not fond of the negitivity on the TK web site either :o ??? but that is their choice to turn customers away at their door.

You are on the right track of sorting it out, hands on is the best way to see what you are looking for in a mill. Take a good look at that Baker mill.

Other mills to take a look at would be the deisle Warrior mill, Norwood, Mighty mites band and circle mills, the Moble dimention mills.


Backwoods Custom Milling Inc.
100% portable. . Oregons largest portable sawmill service, serving all of Oregon, from our Backwoods to yours..sawing since 1991

Magicman

Spoken from a sawyer that owns both an LT70 and a Cooks AC-36.  He also has several years sawing in a commercial sawmill under his belt.  Good write up backwoods sawyer.
Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

slider

Welcome Labradorguy looks like you are doing your homework.Someone should have warned you about POSTON.He can be the boogie man from time to time.
al glenn

Hale87

I don't think I've ever heard for sure, but I'm guessin the lt40hd is the number 1 saw purchased in the US? After hanging around here for a few years and reading a lot more than I wrote, I went form a Hudson to that mill also. I was quite happy with my Hudson, but this WM is light years ahead. Doesn't take much reading on here to figure out why that mill is probably the number one mill.
2002 LT40HD sawmill, WM single blade edger, 23hp Kubota tractor, 2011 Kawasaki Mule, 2002 Honda Foreman, 1983 Case 480D backhoe

labradorguy

Quote from: backwoods sawyer on December 09, 2014, 01:13:56 AM
The four post verses cantalever debate in the portable mills is like the over head carrage verses the old circle saw style carrage among the production mills (I prefer the over head carriage for speed of transfer ;D)

My first choice was and is the LT-70, I drove clean across the country to buy it, the Cooks AC-36 came along later as a good buy.

The cooks mill is a very solid machine, WM is more portable, Cooks the guide arm is a bit over kill but the guide motor on the WM is a bit light duty. Cooks uses a lot of long hydraulic hoses they are not cheep, WM uses a plastic hydraulic hose, I changed all them over to standard braded hoses after a fire in the hydralic box, (over zelist customer welding on mill after hours :-\)

Baker done a demo at the local logging conference and is considerably more mill then the Cooks and the Cooks is a very capable mill.

I found the big advantages to the WM is log handling abilities, its portability and its ability to saw over sized logs, Cooks states 36" and mean it, WM states 36" and with the single post you can fudge it a bit to about a 42" log.

Take a look at the LT-50 it uses the same chain turner as the LT-70, the curve design handles the logs better then the straight design of the Cooks.

With the WM I do all the edging on the mill, the Cooks clamps from the oposite side and edging is much easier with the edger. The advantage to clamping this way is the log rotates the oposite direction presenting the saw with a sawn face after making the opening cut. The WM debarker clears a narrow path for the saw
to cut in. Cooks uses a deisle drip with larger steel wheel, a good comination, I added a deisle drip to the WM.
Maintenace cost on the WM are higher than on the Cooks but down time is far less, Cooks can take a couple weeks or you can find parts on the open market but tracking down parts takes time, WM is next day in most cases, if ordering out of indy in a winter storm it can take week.

Not fond of the negitivity on the TK web site either :o ??? but that is their choice to turn customers away at their door.

You are on the right track of sorting it out, hands on is the best way to see what you are looking for in a mill. Take a good look at that Baker mill.

Other mills to take a look at would be the deisle Warrior mill, Mighty mites band and circle mills, the Moble dimention mills.

This is EXACTLY the type of information I was hoping to find here. Thank you very much for taking the time to reply to my questions gentlemen.

Regarding John Deere.... I'm used to that. :) I was once at a trade show in Louisville and accidentally walking into an elevator full of JD reps. There's me in Cat yellow surrounded by 9 guys in green. The first thing they said was "Git him!" LOL

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Quote from: labradorguy on December 09, 2014, 08:38:36 AM


Regarding John Deere.... I'm used to that. :D I was once at a trade show in Louisville and accidentally walking into an elevator full of JD reps. There's me in Cat yellow surrounded by 9 guys in green. The first thing they said was "Git him!" LOL

Thats funny.  :D
I run a Caterpillar to fight forest fires.....the draw back is not Caterpillar but the EPA junk they have to put on it and other brands too because of our Gov. We took all that stuff off and the power was increase tremendously.
And John Deer? I don't even own one. New Holland and Kabotas.  ;D
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

labradorguy

I have a 299D XHP and I would love to rip all of that garbage off of there.... but I'm scared to. I'm afraid it won't run or the NSA will come get me.

We have to make sure that China has clean air to breathe.

dboyt

Welcome to the  forum!  Not on your list, but if you'd like to get in a little time on a Norwood HD36 (manual-- but hydraulics are optional), you're welcome to visit.  I'm located about 8 miles southeast of Neosho, MO.
Norwood MX34 Pro portable sawmill, 8N Ford, Lewis Winch

Jim_Wahl

I recently found a good deal on a used Baker 3667D, and am still pinching myself to see if it is just a dream! It is more mill than I ever thought I'd have the good fortune to own. It is going to be fun trying to wear it out. Oh yeah, it has a John Deere engine, too. They put Cummins engines in them now, probably because iron wears better than solid gold.
1997 Peterson 9" WPF since 1998
2004 Baker 3667D since 2014
Cooks Catclaw sharpener and setter



I am from Iowa, but I seem fine.

Slingshot

   Speaking of cantilever designs, I like to think of the aircraft industry.
Cantilever seems to work fine when the internal structure is engineered
to support the weight.  Seems WM did OK.



 



 




_________________________________
sling_shot fly_smiley


Dave Shepard

When buying any mill, support equipment is also a consideration, and with a high production mill, it is a serious consideration. I know the LT70 has produced over 1,200 feet an hour with the right material flow. That will take a lot of help, probably a log deck, and a really good loader or forkift. Then you have to do something with the products after you've sawn them. You may find that you are sawing hard for three hours, and then spending the rest of the day trying to get caught up. :D
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

labradorguy

Quote from: dboyt on December 09, 2014, 09:46:07 AM
Welcome to the  forum!  Not on your list, but if you'd like to get in a little time on a Norwood HD36 (manual-- but hydraulics are optional), you're welcome to visit.  I'm located about 8 miles southeast of Neosho, MO.

I appreciate that offer. I'm going to investigate their offerings and I may take you up on that. Very kind of you Sir.

Support Equipment: You mean deadbeat brothers and their kids aren't enough?? :) Seriously, I've got that covered. I may have a bottleneck in the area of kilns though. Some of the market is calling for dried wood and I can see a big mill overloading a kiln quickly. I'm fairly ignorant in the area of kilns too. I'm looking into it and also looking into how to balance production/capacity/sales right now. I've even considered adding something like a Multitek 1620SS for firewood processing to keep everything in balance. Like I said, I'm still working out some kinks. :)

backwoods sawyer

Quote from: labradorguy on December 09, 2014, 05:43:15 PM
Support Equipment: You mean deadbeat brothers and their kids aren't enough?? :)
That might work out for monday and tuesday but the rest of the week ??? ;D
Backwoods Custom Milling Inc.
100% portable. . Oregons largest portable sawmill service, serving all of Oregon, from our Backwoods to yours..sawing since 1991

hunz

Well I'm a Wood-Mizer man today, tomorrow, and forever. I flat out love mine, and so do my customers. Aside from visiting manufacturers, I'm a huge YouTube proponent when it comes to seeing how a mill functions in "real time". I could sit and watch Wmizer videos all day. One pet peeve I have always had of one mill maker, is that every video they have is filmed in time elapsed ( sped up). How can a guy see how the things performs in real life with you hitting the fast forward button?.....trust me, I won't get bored of watching a mill make beautiful lumber in "real time". I do believe they make a quality mill though!

 
Dream as if you'll saw forever; saw as if you'll die today.



2006 Woodmizer LT40D51RA, Husqvarna 372xp, Takeuchi TL140

5quarter

Slingshot...lop off one of those wings and see what happens.  ;) :D :D

   Seriously though, Welcome to the jungle Labradorguy. Every mill you mention is top of the line; any one of them will keep you panting like a dog trying to keep up. If you plan to do a lot of portable milling, you're going to want the lt-70. That monorail system allows you to saw some stuff other mills can't. Like oversized logs and other odd shapes that would not fit between the posts of other mills. I also think the bunks are more ergonomically designed for the offbearer, but if you get the drag back option, then that's not so important. Something I don't like is the electric-over-hydraulic controls. They were jerky and a little over responsive, but that's probably a steep learning curve on my part. Also, this was on a lt-40 super...perhaps the 70 is different.
   If I were stationary (which I am), I'd buy the AC-36. Backwoods gave some good feedback on it. I would only add that the hydraulic controls were very smooth and fast and everything seemed to be right where its supposed to be, if you get my meaning. I only got to saw one log on it(good sized white oak), but by the middle of the second cut I was in love. This particular mill had been run hard and was a little scarred up, but was cutting dead on perfect.
   The other two I can't say much about. I did run a B-20 for a month or so, but I spent more time fixing and aligning the mill than I did running it. A tree service friend of mine had bought at various times both the B-20 and a Lucas 6-18 with the slabbing attachment.  He had tried to run them a couple times, but gave up when he couldn't seem to get a good board out of either of them. what a waste (he bought them both used and was disappointed when they were not plug and play)  :-\. I have zero exposure to baker mills, But member Tom owned one, so its safe to assume its top shelf.
   There is no substitute for running the mills you're interested in. Look at what you are aiming to do and get the mill that best fits your plan. I look forward to hearing how you make out.
What is this leisure time of which you speak?
Blue Harbor Refinishing

ladylake

 After over 10000 hours on my B20 I find it has very few break downs and doesn't need adjustment very often and when it does it's easy to work on.   Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

labradorguy

Thanks Gents for all the feedback. I'm going to narrow down my list and do some running around to try them all out and see where I land. :)

36 coupe

I bought a Thomas mill.built 8 miles from me.Dale Thomas delivered my mill free and showed me how to mill a cherry log I had on hand.Priceless as I had done business with him and trusted his advice.You cant go wrong buying a Thomas product......

xlogger

Not sure why the guy had problems with his B-20, the guys I know on here have good luck with theirs. I have a TK2000 and I'm very happy with the way it cuts.
Timberking 2000, Turbo slabber Mill, 584 Case, Bobcat 773, solar kiln, Nyle L-53 DH kiln

4x4American

Boy, back in my day..

4x4American

Boy, back in my day..

Foxtrapper

I learned to saw on a TimberHarvestor.  One of the best mills ever built in MHO.  It is too bad they went out of business.  I also had a homemade rig I bought off ebay for awhile.  That mill taught me more about the hows and whys of sawing lumber than any mill I have run, but, I didn't like it, at all.  So when I started looking for a new mill, I looked at all of them, and ended up with a WM.

There is a lot to like about WM mills, but the most important thing was price.  I bought my lt28 during the Great Sawmill Sale, which saved me $1850 off the mill, plus they delivered it to the Hannibal NY dealer for free.  Timberking and Cooks wanted $2000 plus just to deliver their mills, and then I would've had to travel 6 hours one way to Timberking's dealership to pick it up, or pay another $900 to have it delivered.

As far as milling goes, I've milled 6200 bd feet on this mill since I picked it up in Nov, and haven't had too many problems with it.  It is all manual log handling, but I did get the deck package so the loading and turning jobs can be done with a hand winch.  The only improvement I can think of would be to have two winches so I don't have to switch the cable between log loading and log turning..I love my mill.

The WM bashing by Timberking was a turnoff to me.  I don't want to know what you think of the compitition's mill, just tell me why I should buy your mill..just saying...
2014 WoodMizer LT28

sandsawmill14

Quote from: xlogger on December 13, 2014, 05:33:16 AM
Not sure why the guy had problems with his B-20, the guys I know on here have good luck with theirs. I have a TK2000 and I'm very happy with the way it cuts.

We have a b 20 bought used and Timberking was very helpful when we were trying to get started with it. It saws good lumber and has pretty good production. we cut averaged 7779 bdft (oak) per week last 3 weeks Im hoping for 10000 per week but i dont know if the mill has it in it or not. Im sawing without setworks now while custom setworks is being built maybe the setworks will make me alittle faster. ???
hudson 228, lucky knuckleboom,stihl 038 064 441 magnum

beenthere

QuoteJust because someone is a sponsor dont mean that we can't talk about their products on here.  They're sponsoring the FF so that we can converse on the forum.  That is the whole point of a forum.

I'd suggest being real careful how that is interpreted. Have heard many times that this forum isn't for venting gripes.
Discussing problems and getting some help from members is the norm, but taking potshots at sponsors or any mfg. in lieu of other means doesn't seem to fly here. Boils down to how the head man, Jeff, wants his forum used.
If in doubt, send Jeff a PM.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

drobertson

When it all boils down to it, I would say decide on one that fits your needs and  your ability to maintain. Each one you have posted have a proven track record.  If I were a gambling man, I would say each and everyone of the mentioned manufacturers has had issues from the onset, but as mentioned earlier, once some of the issues have been rectified then they run like sewing machines.  The ones that have got out of the gate with no issues are the lucky ones,
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

tule peak timber

Quote from: drobertson on December 13, 2014, 02:45:38 PM
When it all boils down to it, I would say decide on one that fits your needs and  your ability to maintain. Each one you have posted have a proven track record.  If I were a gambling man, I would say each and everyone of the mentioned manufacturers has had issues from the onset, but as mentioned earlier, once some of the issues have been rectified then they run like sewing machines.  The ones that have got out of the gate with no issues are the lucky ones,
True for all three mills I have owned . Rob
persistence personified - never let up , never let down

ladylake

 
  My B20 had 3 of issues when I got it, junk cord reel, only 1/8" down pressure which got set to 1/4" fast and the log clamp didn't turn up good.  All of which were fixed fast and it's been a great mill ever since. I later figured out the flange on the guide wheels should be 1/4" behind which increased my blade 2 to 3 times.   Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Parafiddle

Curious if anyone out there has any of the sawmills the OP mentioned near St. Louis, MO?  Out here for a couple of months and would love to see one in action?  I know how to find members on the map, but don't know if there is a way to sort them by the equipment they have.  Especially interested in a Cooks AC-36.  Thanks!

Magicman

Knothole Sawmill, LLC     '98 Wood-Mizer LT40SuperHydraulic   WM Million BF Club Member   WM Pro Sawyer Network

It's Weird being the Same Age as Old People

Never allow your "need" to make money to exceed your "desire" to provide quality service.....The Magicman

5quarter

Just to clarify...

   The B-20 I mentioned earlier was a great mill, once I undid everything my idiot friend did to it. He's the type of guy who will get a wrench and loosen something up, wiggle it around and tighten it back up thinking he fixed something. I swear he left no adjustment untouched. Plus it needed parts (blade guide bearings, belts, etc...) and LOTS of grease. about the last week I finally had it humming like a quartet and it was really a pleasure to run, but after that I was done as his log yard was empty. I tend to forget that last week as the first three were just one headache after another. In fact, I offered to buy it from him last year, but he won't sell it, even though it still sits where I parked it in his shop 3 years ago. ::)

Sorry TK guys.
What is this leisure time of which you speak?
Blue Harbor Refinishing

labradorguy

I'm blown away by all the great feedback I've got from this forum. Thanks guys.

bandmiller2

There is a short blame trail when you have built your own mill. Some folks will mess up a free lunch and should be in sales not manufacture. Any of the major mill manufacturers got there by building a decent mill and giving good service. I doubt there are any that won't help you with a problem. You reap what you sow if you call and come on like gang busters with abuse and excessive demands you will hit a stone wall. If you own a mill do your homework be observant and read the manual, still have problems call and be pleasant. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

redbeard

I know what your talking about 5quarter on getting the B-20 head carriage out of whack. I couldn't find any directions in manual on how to plumb it. I thought I could just figure it out. Well after several hrs. Or days I finally called Techs and they said there was a reason why its not in manual. Its a factory setting. Even though there's nuts n bolts that look like they need fiddled with doesn't mean you can fiddle with them. Stay with mfg recommendations that are in manual. B-20 owners just so you know what Iam talking about its the four stretchers that spread top n bottom between the Teflon cushions.
Whidbey Woodworks and Custom Milling  2019 Cooks AC 3662T High production band mill and a Hud-son 60 Diesel wide cut bandmill  JD 2240 50hp Tractor with 145 loader IR 1044 all terrain fork lift  Cooks sharp

Dave Shepard

redbeard, that reminds me of a mechanic friend of mine. He used to fix a lot of carbureted cars, and he said the only thing wrong with a carb was the last idiot that put a screwdriver to it. :D
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

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