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Author Topic: Tree Identification Help  (Read 2417 times)

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Offline WDH

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Re: Tree Identification Help
« Reply #20 on: July 31, 2017, 07:12:40 AM »
The wood of white and red mulberry is very similar.  Both have the yellow heartwood and light colored sapwood. 

Hackberry and sugarberry commonly have insect galls on the leaves.  I have not seen them as prevalent in mulberry.  The buds on red mulberry twigs are heart shaped and sit just a little bit off to the side of the leaf scar.  Once you learn to recognize it, it is pretty distinctive. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5640SU, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Offline NeonZebraSpots

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Re: Tree Identification Help
« Reply #21 on: July 31, 2017, 09:03:50 AM »
I took more pictures of things that might be helpful for identification purposes.

*close up of bark
*close up of leaves - front and back
*I ripped it in half(there was no milky liquid)
*took a picture of the little bug things cocoon
*also tried to get a pic of the fuzziness of the leaf
     (it's pretty soft)

If you need more let me know. I'm just going to attach the album link again, it's easier than posting all of the pictures since I did upload around 8 more pictures. Thanks for everyone's help on this, you guys are great!  :laugh:  :)  :laugh:

http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=8005

Offline LeeB

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Re: Tree Identification Help
« Reply #22 on: July 31, 2017, 09:23:15 AM »
Does it have any spines on it? Has it ever made a fruit or any small hard berries?
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Offline WDH

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Re: Tree Identification Help
« Reply #23 on: July 31, 2017, 08:18:09 PM »
Curve ball!

Curve ball!

After seeing the additional pics, I have changed my opinion once again  :).  Looks more like an elm, probably red elm, also called slippery elm.  For the record, hackberry is in the elm family, so red elm and hackberry are kissing cousins.  The leaf bases in the elms are inequilateral, and I see some of that in the pics, but it is not as distinct as I normally see.  Also, the serrations on the leaf are more elm like.  The bark is a dead ringer for elm.  My money is on elm.   
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5640SU, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Offline DPatton

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Re: Tree Identification Help
« Reply #24 on: August 01, 2017, 12:21:50 AM »
I did mention that I'm sometimes stubborn right ??? I'm also pretty sure I'm about to get schooled :P on this topic and find out I still don't know what I'm talking about :-\. However when I look at the additional photos I am even more convinced that the trees are hackberry and here are my reasons why I think so.

1, The bark in the photos although somewhat similar to our slippery elm because of the general pattern it is a dead ringer for our local hackberry. Especially for young imature hackberry such as the ones in the photo. It is knobby and more irregular in pattern than our elm. The bark is just the right color with matching thickness and layering like our local hackberry. Elm bark is also layered but not in the same way as our hackberry. If you look at files 6 of 12 and 8 of 12 you can see this layering in the individual chunks of bark.

2, the leaves are more elongated than our local elm leaves. Our elm leaves although typically more defined in serration than hackberry are more oval and not this elongated.

3, the cocoons or gall on the leaves visible in files 11 of 12 and 12 of 12. The under side of the leaves are covered with these little bumps. This is very typical of our hackberry and I see this on every hackberry tree I look at in these parts. I'm not accustom to seeing this on our local elm tree leaves.
 
NeonZebraSpots I noticed the other day that our local hackberries are currently setting on their little pea sized fruit. The berries are usually fairly sparce and grow toward the tips of the branches in groups of two. They are round, pea sized, olive drab to slightly brown in color currently with each berry attached to a single thin stem about 3/4" to 1" in length. The berries will vary in color as they ripen.



If your trees have these berries then they are indeed hackberry.

If your trees are elm they will produce round, dime sized, flat, Paper-like seeds.

Ok guys, now that I have opened my big mouth again 8) let the schooling :P begin!

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Offline WDH

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Re: Tree Identification Help
« Reply #25 on: August 01, 2017, 07:25:34 AM »
DPatton,

I know that I am giving you a hard time, but I appreciate your persistence and the additional info that you shared.  It can be tough to ID plants from pictures, and I understand your point about the bark.  Bark can vary from one part of the country to the other.  Our hackberry (sugarberry) has bark that is more smooth with pronounced corky warts.  Our winged elm looks very much like the OP's pics, very much with the corky ridges on the bark.  But, in retrospect, the leaves are too big for winged elm, and the bark, while elmy, is not quite right for slippery elm in this area which does not exibit the extent of corkiness seen in the photo.

Well Sir, I am deferring to you.  I hope to meet a hackberry like that one day.
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5640SU, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Offline TKehl

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Re: Tree Identification Help
« Reply #26 on: August 03, 2017, 07:13:27 PM »
Isn't there a Southern and Northern Hackberry?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtis_occidentalis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtis_laevigata

The difference is the Northern Hackberry doesn't eat grits.   :D ;D

Can't speak for Colorado, but the bark fits the Hackberry bark on our trees (Northern), except for the young and very old. 

http://www.forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,95986.msg1480789.html#msg1480789

Danny, if your ever up this way, it'd be my pleasure to tour the woods with you.  Though I think I'd get the better end of the education from it.   ;) 

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